TTI 1 7/8 Headers hitting oil pan

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mbaird said:
He will have to pull headers to get the pan off. And pull the engine to get the headers off.
For those that have never installed an engine assembly from below it really is the easiest way once you figure it out.
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Have you done it?

Because I’m pretty sure he won’t have to pull the headers to drop the pan. The road race pan has all of its kick outs below the headers. It will be harder to access the bolts, but if the steering link is dropped the oil pan can be dropped out.

And the engine doesn’t need to come out to pull the headers either. I’ve removed and replaced the Doug’s on my 340 in the car with the engine still on the mounts. Even with the road race oil pan in place. Personally, I’d leave the pan alone and drop the headers again. They’re the easier part to modify, and you don’t have to mess with resealing the pan. Yeah pulling the headers is a pain, but I don’t see how it’s avoidable.

Even if he had to do all that to drop the pan, he’s gonna have to do it anyway after he holes the pan with that spoon. Better to do it before the pan is damaged than after.
 
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72bluNblu said:
Have you done it?

Because I’m pretty sure he won’t have to pull the headers to drop the pan. The road race pan has all of its kick outs below the headers. It will be harder to access the bolts, but if the steering link is dropped the oil pan can be dropped out.

And the engine doesn’t need to come out to pull the headers either. I’ve removed and replaced the Doug’s on my 340 in the car with the engine still on the mounts. Even with the road race oil pan in place. Personally, I’d leave the pan alone and drop the headers again. They’re the easier part to modify, and you don’t have to mess with resealing the pan. Yeah pulling the headers is a pain, but I don’t see how it’s avoidable.

Even if he had to do all that to drop the pan, he’s gonna have to do it anyway after he holes the pan with that spoon. Better to do it before the pan is damaged than after.
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I just went through this on my Barracuda with Dougs 1 5/8 and a stock pan.
I had to lift the engine ...remove the Torision bar and loosen headers in order to remove oil pan. This for a main seal replacement.

I cant see any way to do it that way on my Dart with 1 7/8 and that pan with the kick out. He might not have to pull engine entirely but damn near !
 
mbaird said:
I just went through this on my Barracuda with Dougs 1 5/8 and a stock pan.
I had to lift the engine ...remove the Torision bar and loosen headers in order to remove oil pan. This for a main seal replacement.

I cant see any way to do it that way on my Dart with 1 7/8 and that pan with the kick out. He might not have to pull engine entirely but damn near !
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Oh I agree- it won’t be easy either way.

I just think his odds of successfully clearancing that header and oil pan with everything installed is about the same as winning the powerball. I know that with my luck, if I tried making space with a hammer, a clamp and a tire spoon I’d probably ruin the header AND the oil pan and have to pull all of it out anyway. So, better to just pull one or the other first. Or both. Pulling it all after you’ve totaled $1k+ worth of parts will be really disheartening.
 
72bluNblu said:
Oh I agree- it won’t be easy either way.

I just think his odds of successfully clearancing that header and oil pan with everything installed is about the same as winning the powerball. I know that with my luck, if I tried making space with a hammer, a clamp and a tire spoon I’d probably ruin the header AND the oil pan and have to pull all of it out anyway. So, better to just pull one or the other first. Or both. Pulling it all after you’ve totaled $1k+ worth of parts will be really disheartening.
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I dont disagree with you at all... He will have to pull the engine. I am saying to drop the engine ( or lift the body off it) to do it. Once you have done it this way you will never do it otherwise.
 
1: Send TTI pictures, talk to them.
2: No luck in talking to them? That leaves on option for me.

HAMMER TIME

Walker434 said:
I have TTI 1 7/8 race headers and just installed new engine in my 71 Dart. It has a milidon road race oil pan and one header tube is resting on the top of the kick out.

Any tips on getting clearance without removing engine or headers? This is on the drivers side and this header was a nightmare to install. It's only touching on one small portion. Thought about a flat blade screwdriver and hammer but I'm afraid of damaging the oil pan. Thanks in advance for any helpful tips or tricks.

View attachment 1715320472

View attachment 1715320473
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rumblefish360 said:
1: Send TTI pictures, talk to them.
2: No luck in talking to them? That leaves on option for me.

HAMMER TIME
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If a guy is careful, he might be able to heat it close to cherry red with a small torch, and spoon it a little for clearance.
I did it w/ a pair of big channel locks after heating the #2 tube , but was not on the car, not enough room while next to the valve cover, and had to protect the tube from the teeth on the channel locks.--------
 
I have tried fixing different issues over the years with the BFH method... aka: cob job... it rarely works out, especially on something this big, and then when you're done you still have the initial problem plus the added repairs from using the BFH/cob job method. JM2C.
 
"Ok Trail, what would you do if this was your car?"

I'm so glad you asked.

I would pull that pan and mod it like this and then wrap that tube with header wrap all the way back past the pan.
The heat produced under heavy throttle is going to cook the oil running down the inside of the pan.

Dart 23.jpg
 
Speaking of which I should wrap portions of my headers for I start driving it.
 
Is the header keeping the pan from seating properly or just barely touching ?
If it is barely touching I would heat the tube and use a wedge of some sort to gain a wee bit more clearance then wrap the tube after.
If it is interfearing then it will be a lot more work.
 
There is ABSOLUTLEY no way to pull this pan while still in the car. A lot of people are talking about what they did with their 1 5/8 headers in their A bodies. BIG difference when you have 1 7/8 headers with 3 1/2 inch collectors in an A body.

Anyway. Good news, I used a C clamp and a small pry bar with some heat and got some clearance. Now I believe I can use the spoon and the C clamps to get acceptable clearance and wrap a portion of the header. I'll keep you posted.
 
Hopefully the pan doesn’t leak on you... l just witnessed a new Milodon pan leak all over the dyno. Sad part was it has to come off to fix it but at least it wasn’t in the car.
 
Good to hear ! I wouldnt worry to much about it as long as its not touching and you have some header wrap on the tube
 
Update: I still wasn't satisfied with the clearance I got with the heat and C clamp. I pulled the engine and took the oil pan to my fabrication friend.... this is what I got back. Figured I better just do it right and be done with it. Also wrapped that header tube since the engine was out. All should be good now. Is this pan zinc coated? Should I just spray some engine paint on the pan or does it need to be some sort of zinc coating?

Dart 25.jpg
 
Walker434 said:
Update: I still wasn't satisfied with the clearance I got with the heat and C clamp. I pulled the engine and took the oil pan to my fabrication friend.... this is what I got back. Figured I better just do it right and be done with it. Also wrapped that header tube since the engine was out. All should be good now. Is this pan zinc coated? Should I just spray some engine paint on the pan or does it need to be some sort of zinc coating?

View attachment 1715328926
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That's a nice fix. Rattle can that thing and go drive.
 
good call (see post #4)
i would paint it gold and call it good, in fact, that what i did when i owned one of these pans, and had to have it fixed some)

on a side note, kudos to your fabricator buddy, his welds look much better then the stock welds on that pan
 
Walker434 said:
Update: I still wasn't satisfied with the clearance I got with the heat and C clamp. I pulled the engine and took the oil pan to my fabrication friend.... this is what I got back. Figured I better just do it right and be done with it. Also wrapped that header tube since the engine was out. All should be good now. Is this pan zinc coated? Should I just spray some engine paint on the pan or does it need to be some sort of zinc coating?

View attachment 1715328926
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now that's the proper fix , very nice .
 
Thanks guys. It was definitely worth pulling the engine for. His welding skills are phenomenal. Now I just need life to slow down a bit so I can put the engine back in LOL.
 
I want to say that is Cadmium plating, but could be some form of zinc. Paint will work fine for corrosion resistance. I'd use a hi-temp or engine paint since it is still pretty close to that header tube. Congrats on doing it the right way. Hard to make that choice sometimes.
 
I have TTI 440-200 on my notch with that pan and they clear no problem... out of the box to boot. I had to hammer on the road race pan to clear the qa1 K member though
 
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