Everything You Wanted to Know About Ignition Advance

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halifaxhops

halifaxhops

It's going to get stupid around here!
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Maybe I missed something basic here........."where did" you get this? I did not see credit to the author, or did I miss that?

"For peak engine performance, driveability, idle cooling and efficiency in a street-driven car, you need vacuum advance, connected to full manifold vacuum. Absolutely. Positively."

I'll tell ya who this sounds like.............FBO!!!
 
67Dart273 said:
Maybe I missed something basic here........."where did" you get this? I did not see credit to the author, or did I miss that?

"For peak engine performance, driveability, idle cooling and efficiency in a street-driven car, you need vacuum advance, connected to full manifold vacuum. Absolutely. Positively."

I'll tell ya who this sounds like.............FBO!!!
Click to expand...

Citing the author(s) would be proper. other than that I am using it to set this new cam install
 
I used it to set up my Mallory disty. So today I will see how well it works or if I need more adjustment. I am using a mechanical disty.
 
This is a nice article and it really explains a lot of questions that I asked within the forums. The one thing that really sticks out, is the recommendation to run full port vacuum at idle. How many slant 6 owners are using full port vacuum at idle?
 
The full vacuum thing is quite a controversy. Folks have "made it work" either way. The whole system takes on completely different strategy one way or the other
 
Couldn't get my big cam 318 to idle without manifold vacuum.

On ported it wanted to over heat at idle and shake the livin crap out of the whole car. had to run it at 1100 rpm to idle in gear at a light.

Put an adjustable can and a travel stop on the rod. The can started pulling in at 6" vac and was all in at 12". The rod stop limited idle vac advance to 24*.

Ran great after that and idled at 800 rpm. still shook a bit more than a bit but I could idle in gear without stalling, over heating or chirping the tires when I put it in gear.
 
you can put together ten engine specialists and you are going to have probably ten different comments. knowing how to truly understand the true operation of an Otto cicle engine is not easy.
the text simply wants to show the functioning of each element of the distributor.
When I started my job, the spark plug was my only indicator of the correct setting (1984). and in 2020 I use: a "Horiba" engine test bench, individual exhaust temperature sensors, lambdas sensor minimum two, see even one for each cylinder, MAP sensor, air temperature, rpm, water temperature at several points engine and cylinder head, and much more ....
And finally I realize that I know nothing and that every day, I have more questions to ask than answers.
the history of humanity is summarized = attempt and error
 
The ignition system I currently have is from Don at FBO, and I've been running it for at least 5 years. He is who some posts are referencing.
Anyone who is that passionate about the ignition system and how critical it is to optimize ALL parameters of engine performance gets my attention and respect, because I also think it is critically important.
I'm going to change it out to a new system from Progression Ignition, but I have been happy with the one from Don.
 
Biomedtechguy said:
The ignition system I currently have is from Don at FBO, and I've been running it for at least 5 years. He is who some posts are referencing.
Anyone who is that passionate about the ignition system and how critical it is to optimize ALL parameters of engine performance gets my attention and respect, because I also think it is critically important.
I'm going to change it out to a new system from Progression Ignition, but I have been happy with the one from Don.
Click to expand...

As soon as I read "
CONTROL WITH YOUR SMARTPHONE ."......................................... I'm out............
 
67Dart273 said:
The full vacuum thing is quite a controversy. Folks have "made it work" either way. The whole system takes on completely different strategy one way or the other
Click to expand...

The big block SS Chevelles came from the factory with manifold vacuum on the distributor. I didn't know that until I helped Matt do the restoration on my friend's 1970 LS5 car, but it's right there in the GM manual. We tried it both ways. Car ran like a slug with ported vacuum and ran like a banshee on manifold vacuum. I timed it accordingly for both ways. It was strange.
 
67Dart273 said:
As soon as I read "
CONTROL WITH YOUR SMARTPHONE ."......................................... I'm out............
Click to expand...

Yup no doubt about it. Don't want "none of that". LOL
 
If my carb didn't supply enough vacuum at the sparkport, to not bring my Vcan in all the away, until 3000 rpm; well duh, That 's a problem. But that's fixable.
I have never seen a carb/combo work like that......
must be a Chevy/Ford thing, cuz I don't work on those either.
Or maybe I just haven't got enough experience yet.....

My Spark-ported V-can can be full in by 10 to 12 mph.
And the pedal can be floored right there.
Cruise timing can be 48*@2250@65mph.

There are a innumerable ways, for the average Joe, in his streeter, to skin that cat, that do not involve full-time vacuum to the distributor.
Anybody the preaches full time vacuum for all streeters, is mandatory; I don't care how many letters are behind his name; I'm just gonna put him on ignore.
 
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67Dart273 said:
As soon as I read "
CONTROL WITH YOUR SMARTPHONE ."......................................... I'm out............
Click to expand...
RustyRatRod said:
Yup no doubt about it. Don't want "none of that". LOL
Click to expand...
I'm not trying to change your minds about that, but it's difficult for me not to be over the top with enthusiasm for this system because it's exactly what "I wished "they" made, and voila! there's a "they" who did.
EFI system-like control of the ignition but for carbureted engines.
I guess those opposed to this or not interested won't watch the video(s).
I downloaded the app, entered the basic data to fill in the blanks on the app, "working offline" since I don't actually have the system yet, and it generated a "timing map" or chart. This is it. RPMs are across the bottom and I believe the Left vertical column is Manifold Absolute Pressure (in Kpa). The real time advance appears as a ball that moves around on the chart as the timing changes.
Screenshot_20210213-095930_Progression Ignition.jpg

You could even "share" a chart with someone if you were inclined to, it would have to be manually copied, but still, that's pretty cool too.
 
I'm a carburetor and distributor guy. I'm old. You're not gonna change my mind.
 
RustyRatRod said:
I'm a carburetor and distributor guy. I'm old. You're not gonna change my mind.
Click to expand...
All good. Between my Roadrunner and my wife's GTO, I have SIX 2bbl carbs to tune! It's not for a lack of 6bbl EFI systems, like the Fitch, I like my carburetors! My Charger R/T I bought in 1978 when I was starting my senior year in high school had a dual point distributor, and I changed the points and condenser, all of the spark plug wires, cap and rotor myself, and set dwell on the points. I even recall an "old school trick" regarding setting one set of points with a smaller gap than the other, I think it was supposed to give better performance throughout the entire RPM range? I'm not sure. I also recall getting a springs and weights set for that distributor, but I didn't really know what I was doing at the time. I learned quickly as making the wrong mods had a noticeable detriment to performance.
Now my Roadrunner has always had an electronic ignition, and after Chrysler electronic ignition I switched to the FBO setup, and the Progression Ignition is going to be my 3rd (and I hope final) setup.
 
FWIW, there is a "version 2" of the app (that controls/sets up/provides feedback) for the Progression Ignition system. It has guages now that make reading the data it conveys easier, especially for us "old school" guys.
 
blewbyoutobad said:
Is that good or bad?
Click to expand...
In general, bad. However if you are going to buy his stuff, then in general you should follow his setup advice.
However the info posted there was snipped and put together from a variety of pretty reconizeable sources.

cchrishefish said:
I think I found the right information in this link which conflicts with the author. The author states that there should be full vacuum to the distributor at idle.

Rough idle when warm? - Slant Six Forum
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That's a big hint isn't it.
wink-gif.gif

This is one of those cases where you will only really know what was done by looking at original examples yourself.
:elmer:
 
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