1969 valiant with 13 inch wheels

[sketch]

I know nothing other than i want to switch to Disc brakes all around. What do i need? I know that the 13s won't work for disc so i have to go to 14 inch wheels. What are the basic ones i need. this is a daily driver for son. I don't understand all the "bolt pattern" discussions so please bare with me and explain. The car is a survifor 1969 with 13s stock. Please tell me what i have to buy. be specific please. there are a ton of "kits" out there, but i need help with the 14 inch wheels. how do i tell which ones will fit the axles that are on their now???

 

[moparmat2000]

What you have is a 5 bolt 4.0" diameter bolt circle with 7/16" threaded lug studs.

Typically the left hand side (drivers side) of the car had left hand threaded lug nuts (reverse thread) if it still has those and your planning on keeping this (small diameter) bolt pattern, I recommend you replace the LH threaded studs and nuts. These are nothing but trouble.

When you say disc brakes all around, are you talking about 4 wheel discs? If so, why? What are the final intentions for the car? Most times a proper adjusted rear drum setup along with front discs is just fine.

I will let others chime in with the rest.

 

[cudamark]

The first thing you'll need to decide is if you're going to keep the bolt pattern you have now, or change it to one with more options. The stock pattern for a '69 model is one with a 4" diameter circle for the lug nuts/studs. There are kits available to keep that pattern, but, none that I know of can still use your 13" wheels. If it were me, I'd get a kit with the 4 1/2" bolt pattern and get whatever wheels you like (I'd go 15" at least, instead of 14") and what are appropriate for the brake kit you buy. For a daily driver, I wouldn't bother going with disc on the rear. Not necessary unless you're doing some serious repeated stopping, like hauling a trailer, or racing. You'll still need to do something in the rear if you want to have matching wheels however. You didn't say what engine you're running, but, I would still get a heavier duty rear end assembly with the bigger bolt pattern there too. If you just have a slant 6 or mild small block, I'd get a stock '73-6 Abody 8 1/4" rear axle assembly complete with the factory drum brakes. They bolt right in, they're not terribly expensive, they hold up well, and it's easy to get parts for them. You'll probably have to shorten your driveshaft a bit, but, just about any other rear end will require the same.

 

[sketch]

What you have is a 5 bolt 4.0" diameter bolt circle with 7/16" threaded lug studs.

Typically the left hand side (drivers side) of the car had left hand threaded lug nuts (reverse thread) if it still has those and your planning on keeping this (small diameter) bolt pattern, I recommend you replace the LH threaded studs and nuts. These are nothing but trouble.

When you say disc brakes all around, are you talking about 4 wheel discs? If so, why? What are the final intentions for the car? Most times a proper adjusted rear drum setup along with front discs is just fine.

I will let others chime in with the rest.

i may only go with the front disc. the car is original and has all new drums but they stick and squeal no matter how many adjustments i have. and they pull to the right if he presses down too hard. he is a new driver and i just feel that disc are safer but i have been told if i put disc, the 13s won't work so i have to change wheels and rims. if i do that, i have to change the rear wheels too, right? other wise the car will slant down. He wants to keep it as original as possible but knows he needs discs.

 

[sketch]

The first thing you'll need to decide is if you're going to keep the bolt pattern you have now, or change it to one with more options. The stock pattern for a '69 model is one with a 4" diameter circle for the lug nuts/studs. There are kits available to keep that pattern, but, none that I know of can still use your 13" wheels. If it were me, I'd get a kit with the 4 1/2" bolt pattern and get whatever wheels you like (I'd go 15" at least, instead of 14") and what are appropriate for the brake kit you buy. For a daily driver, I wouldn't bother going with disc on the rear. Not necessary unless you're doing some serious repeated stopping, like hauling a trailer, or racing. You'll still need to do something in the rear if you want to have matching wheels however. You didn't say what engine you're running, but, I would still get a heavier duty rear end assembly with the bigger bolt pattern there too. If you just have a slant 6 or mild small block, I'd get a stock '73-6 Abody 8 1/4" rear axle assembly complete with the factory drum brakes. They bolt right in, they're not terribly expensive, they hold up well, and it's easy to get parts for them. You'll probably have to shorten your driveshaft a bit, but, just about any other rear end will require the same.

it is a slant six, he will daily drive it. So if i just do the front discs i still need all that stuff in that back. the current rear end is what came on the car when it rolled off the line in 69, 13 inch wheels and all. So could he put 14s all around? or 15s?

 

[cudamark]

It's not absolutely necessary to change the rear end, but, you would then have to carry two spares, or use the dreaded wheel adaptors for the rear. You can find stock steel wheels in a 14 or 15" that will work with disc up front, and still look fairly stock for the rear if you're just using hub caps and not full wheel covers. Just get lower profile tires for the front and/or taller 13's in the rear, to keep the rake angle of the car within reason. The main reason to go with 15" wheels, other than the bolt pattern change, is cheaper, more selection, and easier to find tires.

 

[moparmat2000]

Scarebird front disc conversion then and then find and put small bolt pattern 14" rims on front and back.

I think it uses toyota previa van rotors that you get redrilled to the mopar pattern with a supplied pattern , and chevy celebrity calipers and pads. Both pretty cheap at rock auto.This kit allows you to reuse your front stock drum spindles, and bearing hubs.

 

[moparmat2000]

You can get everything in 1 kit ready to bolt on, or just the brackets and source everything else yourself. One kit for 9" drums, one kit for 10" drums. I have no experience with these kits, so I have no idea why there 2 different kits based on drum diameter

However, for a nice upgrade on a stocker slanty A body sedan, this is probably the way to go. It appears to not work with 14" steelies as well but will work with small bolt pattern rallye wheels. These would be a good choice anyways. They pop up on here for sale fairly regularly, and are a 5.5" width rim, so you can at least put wider tires on it making it safer than riding on pizza cutter width rims and tires. Plus they look good.

 

[moparmat2000]

i may only go with the front disc. the car is original and has all new drums but they stick and squeal no matter how many adjustments i have. and they pull to the right if he presses down too hard. he is a new driver and i just feel that disc are safer but i have been told if i put disc, the 13s won't work so i have to change wheels and rims. if i do that, i have to change the rear wheels too, right? other wise the car will slant down. He wants to keep it as original as possible but knows he needs discs.

Pulls to the right when he steps hard on them can be a few things. Either the left front brake shoes are not adjusted out enough so the front shoes on both sides dont grab at the same time. The left front wheel cylinder could be sticking and not moving.

It may be something as simple as that, or the left front fluid line could have some rust in it restricting it. Disconnect the line at both ends, and put compressed air through it to see if it's clear. Sometimes the old rubber flex hoses swell shut. I would replace them anyways.

 

[sketch]

Pulls to the right when he steps hard on them can be a few things. Either the left front brake shoes are not adjusted out enough so the front shoes on both sides dont grab at the same time. The left front wheel cylinder could be sticking and not moving.

It may be something as simple as that, or the left front fluid line could have some rust in it restricting it. Disconnect the line at both ends, and put compressed air through it to see if it's clear. Sometimes the old rubber flex hoses swell shut. I would replace them anyways.

had all hoses replaced. they were original and nasty. front wheel cylinder could be the culprit for sure. The disc fronts are for ease of mind for my 16 year old safety

 

[sketch]

It's not absolutely necessary to change the rear end, but, you would then have to carry two spares, or use the dreaded wheel adaptors for the rear. You can find stock steel wheels in a 14 or 15" that will work with disc up front, and still look fairly stock for the rear if you're just using hub caps and not full wheel covers. Just get lower profile tires for the front and/or taller 13's in the rear, to keep the rake angle of the car within reason. The main reason to go with 15" wheels, other than the bolt pattern change, is cheaper, more selection, and easier to find tires.

i keep geting told i have to switch from the 13s to have disc brakes up front. he wants to keep hub caps. He is going for original look.

 

[sketch]

It's not absolutely necessary to change the rear end, but, you would then have to carry two spares, or use the dreaded wheel adaptors for the rear. You can find stock steel wheels in a 14 or 15" that will work with disc up front, and still look fairly stock for the rear if you're just using hub caps and not full wheel covers. Just get lower profile tires for the front and/or taller 13's in the rear, to keep the rake angle of the car within reason. The main reason to go with 15" wheels, other than the bolt pattern change, is cheaper, more selection, and easier to find tires.

i think we are going to just go with 15s on front and back. then all I need is the disc kit; correct?

 

[RustyRatRod]

My 64 Valiant is a slant 6 car and gonna stay that way. I rebuilt the stock 9" drum brakes after I got the car. It'll stop on a dime and give you 5 cents change. 2700 pounds doesn't need autocross brakes to stop good. It just needs "what's there" to be in good shape.

Of course, there are plenty of other options, but discs are totally not necessary in cars like ours.

 

[RustyRatRod]

i keep geting told i have to switch from the 13s to have disc brakes up front. he wants to keep hub caps. He is going for original look.

You do. Also, FWIW, you need to be careful which 14" wheels you choose as some of those don't clear, either.

 

[RustyRatRod]

i think we are going to just go with 15s on front and back. then all I need is the disc kit; correct?

If going discs, that's the safest bet. 15 or larger.

 

[cudamark]

i think we are going to just go with 15s on front and back. then all I need is the disc kit; correct?

You'll need to do something to the rear for 15" wheels unless you have them custom made with the small bolt pattern.

 

[moparmat2000]

Small bolt pattern steel rims do not normally come in 15" if you want 15" rims in small bolt pattern, they need to be specially made. If your running factory dog dish type center caps, they will readily snap in place on any mopar 13,14,15 inch steelie rim. If running a full wheel cover, a 13" one will only fit a 13" wheel. Your best bet is to find some 14x5.5" SBP steelies. These came on performance minded A body 340, 383 , 440 cars. They were painted body color with dog dish caps. They are harder to find than the SBP rallye wheels. Because people bought these cars new with the cheapo "poverty pack" wheel combo and switched em out for cragars back then, and tossed em.

 

[RustyRatRod]

You'll need to do something to the rear for 15" wheels unless you have them custom made with the small bolt pattern.

Summit has them in stock. EDIT. Ok, as usual with everything else, not in stock, but available.

Steel, Aluminum & More Aftermarket Wheels at Summit Racing

 

[sketch]

I am more confused now. So could I just get 15s with the 4.5 inch bolt pattern and call it a day. What else do i need? Besides the disc kit of course. just the steelies and wheels right? or do i need other things? sorry, I am so new at all this and know very little

 

[cudamark]

What brakes did you decide on? 4 1/2" bolt pattern front and rear?

 

[sketch]

What brakes did you decide on? 4 1/2" bolt pattern front and rear?

disc only upfront. whatever is easiest. I don't want to have to totally redo the underside of the car. that's why i want suggestions from the experts here.

 

[Mopar Momzee]

My son also has a 68 valiant/6 3 on the tree and we rebuilt complete front end to stock and also keeping the 71/4 rear for now just rebuild it. Me as a young adult have done many things to my cars wish i could go back. My son is 11 and ill let him make those decisions when and if he wants to change all the extras when he’s much older. IMO fix what u have before u spend a lot of money.

 

[cudamark]

Still need to know what brakes you decided on, and what bolt pattern you have front and rear. They should match so you only need to carry one spare.

 

[RustyRatRod]

I am more confused now. So could I just get 15s with the 4.5 inch bolt pattern and call it a day. What else do i need? Besides the disc kit of course. just the steelies and wheels right? or do i need other things? sorry, I am so new at all this and know very little

What is there to be confused about? Decide WHICH brakes you want. If you want later A body discs (73-76) you need to go to the 4.5" bolt pattern. Unless you want to run 2 different bolt pattern wheels, you'll need to convert the rear to the large bolt pattern to match the later big pattern on the late A body disc brakes.

OR if you want to retain the 4" bolt pattern, use the 72 and prior small bolt pattern disc brakes on the front, and you'll have to do nothing to the rear.

Those are your choices. You can do either choice with factory used parts rebuilt, or aftermarket new parts.

What part about any of that is confusing?

 

[Mopar Momzee]

My son also has a 68 valiant/6 3 on the tree and we rebuilt complete front end to stock and also keeping the 71/4 rear for now just rebuild it. Me as a young adult have done many things to my cars wish i could go back. My son is 11 and ill let him make those decisions when and if he wants to change all the extras when he’s much older. IMO fix what u have before u spend a lot of money.