72duster72
Well-Known Member
Hi, I figured to ask this question in the hemi swap. What do you think of Cleveland performance to pick up an engine and a transmission versus trying to piece one together? Let me know your thoughts, please.
6.4 hemi
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Kiddart1
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I just did a cost compare in buying a 6.4 in pieces then shipping for everything plus rebuild and it was cheaper to buy the motor as a whole, then purchase a refresh kit. just my two cents.
72duster72
Well-Known Member
Thank you I thought it would be cheaper to buy it as a complete set
Not a complete but motor, but I figure I'd throw this out there... MMX has brand new Mopar long blocks for $4399.. no core and that's shipped to a location that has a forklift. If you want it to your house and need a liftgate, it's an additional $200. That's for MDS Motor
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I did exactly as you have described, I purchased a motor and tranny from Cleveland, then stuffed it all in a 72 Demon. I did a build thread here on FABO. For me it worked out well and was very cost effective. Were I to do it again I would probably lean towards doing it the same way. At the time I did it there were not many options available. There may be more now? I dunno? Purchasing it as a whole saved me a lot of headache and time. Send me a PM if you wish and I can provide more details. PS the project is not for the feint hearted!
72duster72
Well-Known Member
I will be in touch. Any chance you can somehow send me your thread for the new hemi? What do you mean it’s not for the faint of heart. Is it that tough? I’m thinking of saving my money and getting a different K frame to make it a little easier and have a little more room.
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I cannot strongly recommend @HemiDenny K frame enough. It is a game changer. Saved me countless hours of both labor and frustration. He is active on this site and if you call his Company the chances are super good he will be the guy answering the phone. He endured countless questions from me with both grace and professionalism. As for the feint of heart comment, I am not an actual car mechanic. I am just a farmer that is handy with a welder. The swap was the ragged edge of my abilities. Both electronically and mechanically. Again not to whine but the industry supporting a Hemi swap has evolved a lot since I did mine. You will still need to fabricate a million of your own parts and provide creative solutions to a myriad of problems. My build thread on here is titled 72 Demon Hemi swap or something like that. I would have to search it to remember what I called it! Hah! The LS guys got it so easy! You gotta earn a Hemi swap!
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@72duster72 found it
6.1 Hemi into 72 Demon March 18
6.1 Hemi into 72 Demon March 18
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The thread is on page 15 of the Hemi swap forum
I checked into Cleveland Performance for pricing and found out buying a crate motor was cheaper with a warranty. You will need to buy the wiring harness separate, If you want A/C it’s an additional charge.
New crate 5.7 Hemi was just over $5000. A new crate 6.4 Hemi is under 6500.
sdparts.com
New crate 5.7 Hemi was just over $5000. A new crate 6.4 Hemi is under 6500.
Mopar 68303088AC - 5.7L 345ci HEMI Crate Engine
Own the same legendary 345 HEMI engine found in the 2015 and newer Dodge Challenger!
sdparts.com
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If I remember right it was the tranny attached that made it more cost effective. The crate motors were cheaper but then you had to buy a tranny and all the associated components. It may be different now? I gotta tell ya, reading this thread is evoking a whole bunch of memories. Some good, some bad! Hah! Please note @72duster72 going back and finding my build thread this morning really highlights the fact that there is a whole bunch of far more elegant and frankly professional swap threads than mine. I did mine myself in my own shop on a very limited budget. As a result my design criteria was often times dictated by what kind of material I had laying around the barn. Typically there was a better solution but I did not have the cash for it so went with what I had! I strongly suggest reading a bunch of the swap threads before you start, it will save you gobs of sweat and tears. There is a bunch of super smart handy guys here on FABO. I am just a knuckle dragging farmer!
DionR
Well-Known Member
Here's a link so he doesn't have to search for it.
6.1 Hemi into 72 Demon March 2018
I have just begun the project of ripping out a perfectly good 360 and putting in a gen 3 with a manual 6 speed in my newly acquired 72 Demon. Here is a summary thus far. I am going to utilize a Cleveland Power pallet 6.1 Hemi from a 2010 SRT Challenger equipped with manual tranny, A HDK front...
www.forabodiesonly.com
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Thanks so much good Sir. I don’t know how to do that! I figure it is a win if I can reply to an Email! Hah!
DionR
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Personally, I think a set of swap mounts and a stock k-frame are the most cost effective method to swap a G3. It's pretty scienced out now. Heck, Holley even has their swap headers back in stock.
Certainly some of it is dependent on end goals. A max HP build might want a COC like the HDK so they can run big long tube headers. Another option with a COC is the use of the OEM 6.4 exhaust manifolds, can't do that with a stock K-frame. Or if you want PS but don't want a Borgeson box, then (I think) a COC is the only path. And Denny has worked hard on engine placement and might be able to save some cutting on the floor if an 8HP were used. Plus the lack of TB and clear space is huge. So there are advantages. And I would add that if I was looking at COC kits, an HDK would be the winner in my mind. Just keep in mind that there are disadvantages too, and in this context cost is the number one.
For me, the Holley swap parts are the bomb. Gives clearance for the SRV module so I don't have to cut my firewall or lose the SRV option, I can run the stock car FEAD including the low mount AC compressor (VVT motors only) and there is an oil filter adapter that works so I don't have to run a remote filter. A COC doesn't need one either but the Schumacher/TTI kits requires work to avoid them. And the Holley swap headers are stainless and like $300 less than the polished TTI's. The disadvantage is the Holley mounts are for '73+ V8 k-frames only and they move the motor forward 1.75" and forces transmission mount and linkage work. So they are kind of a downer if someone wants to run their stock auto or 4 speed, but that doesn't matter if a 6M/8A is being used. It's not free for sure, I am $1500 into the parts to bolt a G3 into my car and I already had a k-frame. Current costs are certain to be higher but pretty sure it kills the cost for a COC if that is the only reason
Be aware that using a TR6060 from a Challenger with a stock k-frame is difficult. The idler hits the starter and requires an aftermarket starter and a custom starter mount. Add that an aftermarket shifter will be required (stock is divorced), an adapter to make the driveshaft work is required and there are no outputs for speed. Plus I have seen several stories of people buying used TR6060's and having problems with them, so I dropped the idea and bought a T56 Magnum kit and got a brand new trans and dodged those issues.
Here's another example of a 6.4 swap but using the stock k-frame and shifting the motor forward just 1/2"-5/8".
www.forabodiesonly.com
Certainly some of it is dependent on end goals. A max HP build might want a COC like the HDK so they can run big long tube headers. Another option with a COC is the use of the OEM 6.4 exhaust manifolds, can't do that with a stock K-frame. Or if you want PS but don't want a Borgeson box, then (I think) a COC is the only path. And Denny has worked hard on engine placement and might be able to save some cutting on the floor if an 8HP were used. Plus the lack of TB and clear space is huge. So there are advantages. And I would add that if I was looking at COC kits, an HDK would be the winner in my mind. Just keep in mind that there are disadvantages too, and in this context cost is the number one.
For me, the Holley swap parts are the bomb. Gives clearance for the SRV module so I don't have to cut my firewall or lose the SRV option, I can run the stock car FEAD including the low mount AC compressor (VVT motors only) and there is an oil filter adapter that works so I don't have to run a remote filter. A COC doesn't need one either but the Schumacher/TTI kits requires work to avoid them. And the Holley swap headers are stainless and like $300 less than the polished TTI's. The disadvantage is the Holley mounts are for '73+ V8 k-frames only and they move the motor forward 1.75" and forces transmission mount and linkage work. So they are kind of a downer if someone wants to run their stock auto or 4 speed, but that doesn't matter if a 6M/8A is being used. It's not free for sure, I am $1500 into the parts to bolt a G3 into my car and I already had a k-frame. Current costs are certain to be higher but pretty sure it kills the cost for a COC if that is the only reason
Be aware that using a TR6060 from a Challenger with a stock k-frame is difficult. The idler hits the starter and requires an aftermarket starter and a custom starter mount. Add that an aftermarket shifter will be required (stock is divorced), an adapter to make the driveshaft work is required and there are no outputs for speed. Plus I have seen several stories of people buying used TR6060's and having problems with them, so I dropped the idea and bought a T56 Magnum kit and got a brand new trans and dodged those issues.
Here's another example of a 6.4 swap but using the stock k-frame and shifting the motor forward just 1/2"-5/8".
Things Change.. Butters is now getting a 392
So, things changed up after stumbling across a 6.4 that just had to good of a price to pass.. Sold off all the 5.7 stuff. With that, I'm starting a new thread to track things and progress. The 6.4 that I grabbed was out of a 2019 Charger with 32k miles (got Hellcat Swapped) So this past...
www.forabodiesonly.com
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72duster72
Well-Known Member
Thank you I appreciate all the input help me figure out everything I need to do ahead of time
Buying the Hemi and transmission is a deal. The big drawback was cutting up my trans tunnel. It would be too much modifying the car to fit it. I went with the 5spd TKX.
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Straight up fact right there, I had to end up fabricating my own tunnel. By then I was so frustrated I made it a bit larger than needed so that I could get to everything underneath. In retrospect I should have fabricated it a bit smaller!
Nice job!
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