71 Dart A/C car heater issues

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DCtruckin

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My 71 swinger is a factory ac car, however the components in the engine bay have been removed. I dont plan to put AC back on the car, but im having issues with the heater. When you push the "max ac" or "ac" buttons the fan works great, but does not blow warm air. When you push "heat" or "def" the fan hardly blows at all. The car is a driver and my goal here is to have the defrost and heat blow strong, would be nice to have the heat blow out of the under dash "ac vent". It does also have a valve in the heater hose in the engine bay hooked to what looks like a small vacuum pump that is hooked to the manifold. Any help, or point me in the right direction would appreciated, thanks!

You can see the valve in this pic on the left
IMG_17291(1).jpg
 
I don't know much on A/C darts but I would take the valve out. That stops the heat in A/C mode. Then you'll have heat possibly in A/C mode. Also plug hose so no vac. leak.
 
I don't know much on A/C darts but I would take the valve out. That stops the heat in A/C mode. Then you'll have heat possibly in A/C mode. Also plug hose so no vac. leak.
Ok, I was thinking that would help too. But still curious why the fan only works real low on heat, when it worms great and blows hard on ac mode? I live in oregon and it rains, and having a working, hard blowing defrost is something ive got to have.
 
With the engine running, does the air come out of the vents it is supposed to when you change the position of the selector switch, defrost, floor, ac vents?

If you have an ac car, the vacuum still needs to be hooked up for the controls to work even in heat mode. If the vacuum heater valve still works, no reason to remove it. If it doesn’t, but a manual one at the parts store. They are only about $5. Turn it on in the winter and off in the summer.
 
With the engine running, does the air come out of the vents it is supposed to when you change the position of the selector switch, defrost, floor, ac vents?

If you have an ac car, the vacuum still needs to be hooked up for the controls to work even in heat mode. If the vacuum heater valve still works, no reason to remove it. If it doesn’t, but a manual one at the parts store. They are only about $5. Turn it on in the winter and off in the summer.

So I played with it a little more on my way to work today.

Yes, it does seem to come out of the proper vents, and does blow warm air on heat and defrost. But the fan barely pushes air when in those 2 modes. Blows very strong on either ac mode.

So what my issue is, why doesnt the fan blow hard on heat or defrost?
 
That's why I said try removing the valve. When in A/C mode with heat turned up it may help ? Or maybe the blower resistor ? As I said I don't know much on A/C Darts as I never had one. Just trying to give some ideas.
 
The ac on these cars blows harder than the heat. If you look at the wiring diagram the blower, it never gets full power on heat, only ac. I think this was designed this way because cool air is harder to move than hot air. It is likely that your fan is operating properly, but there still may be an issue, could be the fan resistor.

If the fan is blowing and you are not getting heat, there could be a number of issues. As Kendog has pointed out, the easiest thing to start with is the heater valve under the hood. First see if the lever moves when you change from heat to ac. That will tell you if it is even working.

Take it out and put a barbed hose splicer in and see if that helps. The valve can be tested by moving the lever with your finger and blowing through it once you have it off. If it is moving with vacuum and you can blow though it when it is in one position or the other, the valve is not your problem.

The rest of the process gets a lot worse. since these cars are 50 years old could be a number of things. Some ideas:

1. Heater core could be plugged. You could try flushing it out. Do it both ways. The bad news here is that the rust may be the only thing keeping it together and it may start leaking after you flush it.

2. The heater box could be full of leaves & trash blocking the air flow. There is no filter, so anything that makes it through the cowl vents goes into the heat / ac box.

3. The vacuum operated doors in the heater box may not be operating properly. This is kind of complicated on an Ac car, and will likely require removing the box from the car to service. If the air is coming out of the right places when you move the controls, the vacuum actuators are probably working, but the seals in the box may be shot, or the doors are not moving full travel.

Removing and rebuilding an ac box isn’t brain surgery. Just like rebuilding an engine, you need to pay attention to detail. Detroit Muscle sells good rebuild kits. There are a lot of threads on here about it.
 
The ac on these cars blows harder than the heat. If you look at the wiring diagram the blower, it never gets full power on heat, only ac. I think this was designed this way because cool air is harder to move than hot air. It is likely that your fan is operating properly, but there still may be an issue, could be the fan resistor.

If the fan is blowing and you are not getting heat, there could be a number of issues. As Kendog has pointed out, the easiest thing to start with is the heater valve under the hood. First see if the lever moves when you change from heat to ac. That will tell you if it is even working.

Take it out and put a barbed hose splicer in and see if that helps. The valve can be tested by moving the lever with your finger and blowing through it once you have it off. If it is moving with vacuum and you can blow though it when it is in one position or the other, the valve is not your problem.

The rest of the process gets a lot worse. since these cars are 50 years old could be a number of things. Some ideas:

1. Heater core could be plugged. You could try flushing it out. Do it both ways. The bad news here is that the rust may be the only thing keeping it together and it may start leaking after you flush it.

2. The heater box could be full of leaves & trash blocking the air flow. There is no filter, so anything that makes it through the cowl vents goes into the heat / ac box.

3. The vacuum operated doors in the heater box may not be operating properly. This is kind of complicated on an Ac car, and will likely require removing the box from the car to service. If the air is coming out of the right places when you move the controls, the vacuum actuators are probably working, but the seals in the box may be shot, or the doors are not moving full travel.

Removing and rebuilding an ac box isn’t brain surgery. Just like rebuilding an engine, you need to pay attention to detail. Detroit Muscle sells good rebuild kits. There are a lot of threads on here about it.

Thats great info i appreciate that, I will get to it and start testing things when I get a chance.
 
So update, no fan at all on heat and defrost. Where would the fan resistor be located?
 
You access it by removing the glove box..
View attachment 1715513684


Thank you for that! Great info. Pulled my glove box and come to find out the plug that is furthest passenger side was barely unplugged. Plugged in. Seems to have a fan now on heat/def, but does not blow as hard as max ac/ac buttons do. Could this possibly be a fan resistor issue?
 
Look at post 7 again. The other thing would be a large amount of dirt on the fan wheel itself. When that type of wheel builds dust on the blades, airflow can drop a good bit. But I'd start by checking the vacuum and door position with a FSM.
 
Looks like you are making progress. Does it heat any with your blower fixed?
 
Update, now that I plugged the resistor back on and it seems to blow out of every proper vent, It’s not getting hot. It’s warmi(ish) but not very warm to hot. Going to try and swap out my thermostat for a 180* unit. Not sure what’s in it now, but the temp gauge has never risen above about 1/4 since I’ve owned the car. The valve inline with the heater hoses does move to one side or the other when you go from heat to ac.
 
Feel the heater hoses and see if they are both warm. If the water is circulating they should both be hot.

You can buy an IR temp gun on Amazon for about $10 they are pretty handy for stuff like this.
 
Feel the heater hoses and see if they are both warm. If the water is circulating they should both be hot.

You can buy an IR temp gun on Amazon for about $10 they are pretty handy for stuff like this.

they are both hot to the touch, I did borrow a IR heat gun and around the thermostat housing didn’t get above about 165* after driving the car home from work which is 30 miles away. Just picked up a 180* new thermostat, will throw that in later today.
 
3. The vacuum operated doors in the heater box may not be operating properly. This is kind of complicated on an Ac car, and will likely require removing the box from the car to service. If the air is coming out of the right places when you move the controls, the vacuum actuators are probably working, but the seals in the box may be shot, or the doors are not moving full travel.

Check this. My clip fell off that holds the actuator pin on the door. Would only blow warm air. You can see it with glove box removed right side.
 
Check this. My clip fell off that holds the actuator pin on the door. Would only blow warm air. You can see it with glove box removed right side.


Ok I will try this.

Bought a new 180* thermostat... to replace the old 180* thermostat. No change. I’ll try and see if the blend door does anything.

also, when the time comes, how does this ac vent mount? Is there supposed to be clips under the dash for screws to go into? I can’t see how you’d get a nut and wrench on the back side of dash to tighten. Thanks a bunch you all have great info here!
2D9189B5-C8BD-4C4D-988B-425F19DA4A84.jpeg
 
Did the engine temp you measured change with the new thermostat? How hot are the heater hoses? I don’t think you can keep your hands on anything hotter than about 130 F.
 
Reverse flush the heater core. The core is piped like a trap - inlet and outlet are on top, stuff settles in the bottom of the core. A fender cover and some long heater hose is your friend.
 
So the actuator passenger side behind glove box does not move when ever you put the heat or defrost on, however if you manually pull it out(toward driver side) it stays out. When you switch to AC, it retracts back in on its own. Is the actuator that opens or closes the blend door? Any way of testing if it’s bad?
 
A83657CA-A0A9-4191-ADB4-5B3E2183024E.jpeg
Here’s the actuator that retracts on its own but has to be manually pulled out. Also, anyone have a diagram on how these heater boxes bolt to car? It ls slightly loose and does not perfectly seat up to the round hole in the cowl. When I manually move the actuator the air seems to be hot. Even though I’m idling in my driveway and it’s 70 degrees out. I’ll try it this week when it’s cold in the mornings
 
So after manually pulling it out several times, it seems to work now. But when it pushes out it’s very slow, but retracts back in fairly quick. When it pushes out the air seems to be hot as well. Not sure if I should replace that actuator if it naturally pushes out slowly?
 
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