727 Kickdown Linkage Adjustment - HELP!

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George R

George R

Mopar Nutcase
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Hi guys,
I'm trying to get the kickdown linkage adjusted correctly on my 69 Dart with 340/727, and have followed the service manual procedures. The first step in the manual is to lock the trans lever forward. Second is to put a 3/16" dowl in the bellcrank to lock it in position, then, adjust the rod from the bellcrank to the trans lever. That part I understand.
The next step is to adjust the flat, slotted rod at the carb. The manual says to adjust it while "at rest". I understand that to mean at idle position, or closed throttle. It says to adjust the rod so there is no clearance at the pin/slot interface with a slight rearward pressure if I understand the manual correctly.....which I probably don't.
All the guys I have spoken to say to open the throttle all the way, and adjust the top rod so there is no clearance between the throttle pin and the rear of the slot. If this is correct, how would the rod from the bellcrank to the trans lever be adjusted?
Now I'm totally confused.

Right now the car will shift from 1st to 2nd at about 10MPH when driven normally, and from 2nd to 3rd at about 25MPH. If I "get on it", it will carry 1st gear pretty far, and it doesn't want to shift into 2nd gear unless I let off the throttle slightly. I don't know what RPM it will carry 1st gear to with my foot on the floor as I always get nervous and I let off the throttle so it will shift. The car has 3.23 rear gears if it matters.
What is the purpose of the 2 adjustments? In other words, what effect with each rod adjustment make??

Can anyone give me any pointers or shortcuts to this adjustment procedure so I don't ruin this trans? I cannot afford to rebuild it if I ruin it.

Thanks in advance guys!!!

George
 
I have the same car and drivetrain combo. I used the second method.
At WOT, I adjusted the linkage at the carb to push the kickdown lever as far back as it would go. In Drive, my 1-2 shift at WOT is at about 4,000 rpm. Much lower than I want it to be. If I want it to shift at a higher RPM, I need to shift manually.

It is also very difficult to get a 2-1 down shift at anything over 15 mph unless I down shift manually. This is something I have been meaning to get to , but just havn't had time recently. There is also the band adjustment on the drivers side of the transmission. What does the service manual say about that? Does that need to be done first?
 
the sentance they leave out is "You can remove that 3/16 pin now. LOL
Make sure the throttle is against the rest / stop and not on a choke step
 
George I used the wide open throttle method and gave it just a little more, so I don't have full throttle, just a little less but that is where it works for me. Mine with 2.76 gears shifts out of first just under 50 mph if you run it up that far. Normally it will shift around 30 depending how I am driving and the shifts are good and firm. Hope this helps.
Bruce
 
The method in the service manual is confusing to even the best mechanics so I allways tell everybody to adjust it the way your buddy told you. The only thing is it sounds like yours is allready shifting at too high of an rpm so all you really need to do is adjust the rod at your carb to make it shorter. If you shorten that rod it will shift at lower rpm's. If you lengthen that rod it will shift at higher rpm's but you have to watch out how much you lengthen it cause if you go too much it'll not allow full throttle like BWDART said his does.

BWDART if you just back off the adjustment a little it'll still shift the same but it'll let you get full throttle.
 
The best way to adjust the kickdown is to have someone sitting in the car with the gas pedal all the way down like if you were to floor it. Then with you under the hood adjust the kickdown so it is all the way engaged when the pedal is floored. You may need to fine tune it a little bit but not much, your shift points with regular driving should be 10-15 and 20-25. At 60mph you should be able to floor it and it will smoothly kickdown.
After messing with the 3 types of factory mechanical kickdown set ups I have found that they are all crap, look ugly, and should be sold or thrown away unless your doing a factory resto. Lokar cables are the way to go!
 
I just installed a 1"phenolic spacer under my Holley to stop the heat rise.......

I jacked up the throttle pressure bracket 1" as well........Now the car shifts immediately in auto...........No good............I can't quite figure what I've done either, but I guess I changed the length back by the firewall.......

My throttle arm is the same adjustment, but it's all screwed up........
 
OK guys, thanks.
I'm on a mission. I'll have my squeeze punch the gas from inside, and I'll adjust the underhood rod.
Shorter shifts sooner, and longer shifts later. It seems like a little adjustment under the hood goes a long way.
I'll report back after I set the timing, readjust the rear brakes down a bit, and adjust the kickdown rod.

Thanks for the help!!!

George
 
Well, I readjusted the rod at the carb so there was about 1/8" of play at WOT. While I was under there, I hooked up my timing light, and the timing at idle, no vac advance was at 10º BTDC. I left it there. I adjusted the front brakes a little and took it for a ride.
The trans shifts 1-2-3 and it won't kick down at all, so I put it back where it was.
I also seem to have a slow speed misfire now. I guess I fouled the #1 plug with the old fashioned timing light.
I can't win with this frikken car, I swear to God.
Thanks for the help anyway Guys. I appreciate it.
I was gonna take this pig to Lebannon Valley next Saturday, but now I'm afraid we'll end up walking home.

George
 
George, leaving 1/8" of play at WOT is allot. No wonder it wouldn't kickdown. Split the difference and see what happens. Sometimes just a half turn of the linkage will make a difference. It's like anything else you have to fine tune it.

I allways start with no slack at all then test drive it and if needed back off the adjustment 1/2 turn at a time until I get it where I like it. Sometimes you may have to drive it 3 or 4 times to get it right but that shouldn't be hard. Only takes up a little time and $5 worth of gas.
 
I`ve got your same set up George and I did mine like this:

1) Hold or affix the kickdown lever on the trans all the way forward.
2) Install 3/16 bit in bellcrank and kickdown linkage.
3) Remove all play from the rod traveling up from the trans pivot to the bellcrank and snap in place.
4) With throttle closed, remove all freeplay from the rod between the bellcrank and the carb.

If it shifts too soon then screw the linkage at the carb forward and this will increase the pressure at the trans. If it takes too long to shift then you have too much pressure and you`ll have to screw the linkage back. Only go a few threads at a time and test drive it between each run. When you get it right it should kickdown all the way to first from third at about 28 mph.
 
Longgone said:
I`ve got your same set up George and I did mine like this:

1) Hold or affix the kickdown lever on the trans all the way forward.
2) Install 3/16 bit in bellcrank and kickdown linkage.
3) Remove all play from the rod traveling up from the trans pivot to the bellcrank and snap in place.
4) With throttle closed, remove all freeplay from the rod between the bellcrank and the carb.

If it shifts too soon then screw the linkage at the carb forward and this will increase the pressure at the trans. If it takes too long to shift then you have too much pressure and you`ll have to screw the linkage back. Only go a few threads at a time and test drive it between each run. When you get it right it should kickdown all the way to first from third at about 28 mph.
Click to expand...
OK guys, I'll give it another shot today after I figure out the misfire problem, and report back.

Thanks again for taking the time to post the info.

George
 
A long time ago in a place far far away I was a Chrysler Master Technician. If I am remembering correctly we adjusted the kickdown this way. It's very easy. Get under the vehicle........okay it's not that easy. Back off the adjuster bolt on the kickdown linkage arm on the side of the trans so it slides easily back and forth on the rod. Then take your finger (or thumb or whatever else you got) and push the arm all the way forward (front of the car) as far as it goes letting the rod seek it's own position. Then, simply tighten the bolt down at that position and your done! Hope this helps.
 
Dustr-70 said:
A long time ago in a place far far away I was a Chrysler Master Technician. If I am remembering correctly we adjusted the kickdown this way. It's very easy. Get under the vehicle........okay it's not that easy. Back off the adjuster bolt on the kickdown linkage arm on the side of the trans so it slides easily back and forth on the rod. Then take your finger (or thumb or whatever else you got) and push the arm all the way forward (front of the car) as far as it goes letting the rod seek it's own position. Then, simply tighten the bolt down at that position and your done! Hope this helps.
Click to expand...

Unless it's the really old ones that had a setup like that your thinking of the shifter linkage. The shifter linkage is adjustable like that. The kickdown never had a setup like that unless it was made before 66 which I haven't worked on.
 
fishy68 said:
Unless it's the really old ones that had a setup like that your thinking of the shifter linkage. The shifter linkage is adjustable like that. The kickdown never had a setup like that unless it was made before 66 which I haven't worked on.
Click to expand...

Here is a link with several setups. I'm not thinking of the shifter linkage. I am looking at my kickdown linkage from my 70 Duster and it is adjustable like that, well it was before the manual valve body.

http://www.moparts.org/Tech/Archive/auto/35.html

Check the side bar pictures of the two bottom drawings and you can clearly see the adjustment. Those are for mid 70's transmissions.
 
Dustr-70 said:
Here is a link with several setups. I'm not thinking of the shifter linkage. I am looking at my kickdown linkage from my 70 Duster and it is adjustable like that, well it was before the manual valve body.

http://www.moparts.org/Tech/Archive/auto/35.html

Check the side bar pictures of the two bottom drawings and you can clearly see the adjustment. Those are for mid 70's transmissions.
Click to expand...

I was going to say what Fishy said about the rod on the trans. The 69 models do not have an adjustment on the lower rod. The first adjustment available (from the trans up)on 69 cars is the vertical rod that comes up to the manifold pivot. Dustr-70, your linkage might not be original to your car.?
 
I dont recall ever seeing a adjust point under the car either. That may have been before the long slot in the top rod. That type of linkage that caused sticking wide open throttle.
Shifter linkage does have one at the trans.
 
Dustr-70 said:
Here is a link with several setups. I'm not thinking of the shifter linkage. I am looking at my kickdown linkage from my 70 Duster and it is adjustable like that, well it was before the manual valve body.

http://www.moparts.org/Tech/Archive/auto/35.html

Check the side bar pictures of the two bottom drawings and you can clearly see the adjustment. Those are for mid 70's transmissions.
Click to expand...

I see that in the illustrations. Thanks for the clarification. Everything I've worked on has been 72 or older and I see the ones in the pics with the adjustment down below are for a 74 and up. Since George's car is a 69 his should be the older style that doesn't have the adjustment down below as long as it's original. Your 70 must have been swapped over to the newer style according to the pics on the link you provided.
 
I just p/u 70 duster which has a 340/ 727 tranny. It has a b/m shifter which needs adjustment. It shifts fine from 1 to2 but won't go into drive until 50mph. What do I need to do to make it go into drive sooner. The last time I adjusted a tranny was in 1976. I seem to have forgotten how it's done . Any help is appreciated. Thanks
 
Hemiram2006 said:
I just p/u 70 duster which has a 340/ 727 tranny. It has a b/m shifter which needs adjustment. It shifts fine from 1 to2 but won't go into drive until 50mph. What do I need to do to make it go into drive sooner. The last time I adjusted a tranny was in 1976. I seem to have forgotten how it's done . Any help is appreciated. Thanks
Click to expand...

Sounds to me that you need to shorten the kick down linkage, don't go crazy ,shorten it a little at a time and try it.
 
I bought this 68 Cuda used and didn't drive it enough to remember if it ever had 1st gear. It had a trans leak when I bought it, and so I had a shop repair the leak. The shop said they fixed the leak (it still leaks but now from the pan) but that's another story. The shop said it is missing the kickdown linkage, so they couldn't road test the car much. I took the car back and installed a linkage. I adjusted it the way the FSM says, but the procedure is a bit vague. I think everyone agrees at WOT, the trans lever should be all the way back. But, at throttle warm idle, where should the trans lever be? I do NOT believe it should be at the full forward position. I believe it should be at a mid-way position where it first meets "some resistance" (as you start from the full forward position and start moving it backward slowly until you feel resistance). I get this from reading the FSM about 100x. I set mine up this way, and test drove the car. It seems to start out (from a stop) in Second gear! I hear only one shift, and the car lacks acceleration. It won't peel rubber. If I drive 25 mph and floor the gas, it feels like it's shifting from 3 to 2 and the acceleration is really weak (I know the trans KD lever is fully pushed back at WOT). If I put the shifter to "L", I don't think the trans is really in "L". I adjusted the shifter link (not K/D link) so that the trans just enters "D" as I move the shifter from "N" to "D" at idle. That should put the trans in true "D" and it should start out in 1st gear. Drove it and again it feels like it's starting out in 2nd. Any ideas why?
 
I think I made a mistake in my earlier post. The FSM tells you to wire the trans lever all the way forward, adjust the vertical link so the drill bit fits into the alignment holes, and adjust the carb link so the slot barely touches the carb pin. Then, and only then, do you unwire the trans lever, and check that the slotted linkage moves freely forward when you push it back and release it. So, when the carb is at idle, the trans lever is fully forward. When the carb is at WOT, the trans lever is somewhere else but the FSM doesn't say it has to be fully rearward. Where the trans lever is at different throttle positions (other than idle) depends strictly on the geometry of the kickdown linkage bellcranks, levers, etc. The only FSM adjustments are to ensure that when the trans lever is fully forward, (1) the drill bit lines up, and (2) the slotted link engages the carb pin but doesn't apply any pressure to it. Outside of this, if we start shortening/lengthening the kickdown linkages, the slotted link will either apply pressure on the carb pin or it won't touch it at idle (with the trans lever held fully forward). This kind of adjustment will result in earlier/delayed shifts, but it diverges from the FSM adjustment procedure. Meanwhile, I can't get my trans to start out in 1st gear.....and it won't kickdown to first gear either....
 
when your shifter is in L (1st), the trans lever is ALL the way forward, and so on and so forth moving rearward as you go through the gears to park. park is all the way back. count your positions, you should have 6 positions. 1-2-D-N-R-P. if you push it past 1st or park, it will naturally come back .loosen your shifter rod with your lever all the back.make sure your shifter is in park, tighten it down. and go throught the gears, counting positions, if you dont click into 1st, the problem is in your shifter.once that is sorted out ,move on to your kickdown
 
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