904 has no first gear?

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green72

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1972 Scamp /6. Drove the car for the first time after a winter of cleaning and detailing. There is no first gear just takes off in second and then shifts fine into 3rd. Am I in need of a rebuild or is there something to adjust that might help? Thanks for any help!!
 
Reverse work? Even if the rear band is broke you should still have low gear.If the rear clutch is bad second wont work either. Maybe check your linkage adjustment.
 
Any manual low?
Might be just a stuck valve could work itself loose.
Could be stuck because it has bad stuff in it too.

Does reverse work ok?

Yes, check that TP linkage.
 
I will check and adjust linkage. Trailbeast, I don't think it is going from 1st to 3rd it is really sluggish from a stop. And thanks for the link.
 
green72 said:
I will check and adjust linkage. Trailbeast, I don't think it is going from 1st to 3rd it is really sluggish from a stop. And thanks for the link.
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Hm, this is odd.

Take a look here, as it has diagrams of the powerflow through the trans in each gear selection.
http://www.allpar.com/mopar/transmissions/torqueflite-tom-hand.html
Look at the difference between "Breakaway Drive" and "Manual Low"
and also what it says about engine braking in manual low.
Breakaway Drive means taking off in drive using automatic shifting.
I have a feeling our answer is right here somewhere, but I just can't pin it down.
The governor could keep it from shifting, but not from starting out in first.
It would almost have to be a stuck 1-2 shift valve (Stuck in the second position)​

I can't think of anything else that would cause it.​

I'll PM Tracy and see if he has any further ideas.​

(I just PM'd Tracy, and maybe he can tell us something I'm not thinking of)​
 
green72 said:
Reverse works fine, no manual low. A little more info on linkage adjustment would be great
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When you say "no manual low" I assume it still takes off, just in second? Or are you saying it doesn't even move at all when you pull it down in low gear?
 
...............the governor can make it so u have no downshifting, unless u put it in neutral then manually shift it to manual low.............and yes it can take off in 2nd or 3rd...........kim...
 
green72 said:
Yes when I say no manual low I mean that it will still move but just in 2nd.
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Sorry, but I think you are going to have to pull the valvebody, flush it out while moving the valves back and forth to make sure they are free.
Then very probably have to pull and rinse the governor also. (maybe do this first as it couldn't hurt) then try it, before you pull the pan and have to drop the fluid.

What is worrying us a little is we wonder what was in the fluid that settled out while sitting enough to cause a valve to stick in it's bore.

The contents of the pan when you pull it will be interesting.
A little metal and black junk is ok (like a teaspoon)

The reason I say "we" is because Tracy and I have been discussing the possibilities via PM.
 
Thanks Trailbeast. The car sat along time (14yrs) before I purchased it last summer. When I drove it home it did not seem to have first but I had very little time in a /6. I pulled the pan and it looked like a very recent fluid change had been done so who knows what it looked like before!! Thanks for the help
 
green72 said:
Thanks Trailbeast. The car sat along time (14yrs) before I purchased it last summer. When I drove it home it did not seem to have first but I had very little time in a /6. I pulled the pan and it looked like a very recent fluid change had been done so who knows what it looked like before!! Thanks for the help
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Sounds like they tried to patch it up with a fluid change. Setting 14 yrs. things can stick even if there's no contaminants in the fluid cause fluid drains off of everything and rust can form. You might want to check out the governor first since it's up high and out of oil when it sits. It could be the problem like Kim said. If there's no problem with the governor dropping the valve body would be next. The more I think of it I'd probably drop the pan for a look even if you find a problem with the governor and fix it just to see how much gunk is in the pan.
 
@green72 I realize this was 9 years ago but how did you end up solving this issue? I just rebuilt a 67 A904 and have the same problem. Reverse works fine but both breakaway drive and manual low start in second gear.
 
This happens often that the op never gets back to us. He was just on the site last Tuesday. 5 days ago. Still has 133 messages so he must just be lurking. Didn’t bother to update the thread. So there is a 50/50 chance he got it fixed. As stated by me b4. Check and clean the governor. Kim
 
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Thanks for the response Kimmer. I have been studying the info Trailbeast linked above and I have come to the conclusion that either the 1-2 valve is stuck in second or the governor is forcing it into second. I will check those out but it will be a bit before I can drop the trans. My only thought is that the 2-3 shift is working fine. If the governor was stuck wouldn't the 2-3 shift not work either?
 
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The governor needs to see zero psi to shift to first when your coming to a stop. If it doesn’t then it won’t shift down to first on its own. It will stay in second. The up shifts need to see pressure to be able to shift. U can check governor pressure with a gauge on the governor pressure port on the passenger side of the tranny. I would start there. Then report back. Kim
 
So...help me understand; with the engine idling, and the car not moving, the port should have ZERO pressure? How many pounds would it have to have to make it start in second? (12?) How many for third? (18?) This is the first time I have ever considered using a gauge on a trans. If the 1-2 valve was stuck, could it affect the pressure put out by the governor? It seems to me that the governor is not likely the culprit, because the valve would have to stick only partially to cause a 2nd gear start; and it would be more likely that the valve would stick at the full point of travel; forcing a 3rd gear start. Unless it's possible for only one of the governor valves to stick (on one side) causing a 2nd gear start condition? It's a lot of work to remove the governor; whereas the valve body is a lot more accessible.
 
Got a pressure gauge on the way but won't be here till Tuesday. Will be sure to give an update once I have a reading. Thank you for the advice.
 
Right. And it takes a pro to sort thru all that. That's why I asked a few simple questions. But I guess you don't know the answers.
 
CudaFactHackJob said:
Right. And it takes a pro to sort thru all that. That's why I asked a few simple questions. But I guess you don't know the answers.
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Not off hand I don’t have all the answers as I haven’t had to deal with this situation in a very long time. I understand if u can’t read a manual. Kim
 
Already have it, along with a hard copy. =) Will get to digging through it this week.
 
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