Cast vs. Aluminum heads and bang for buck..

Would you spend the same amount of money or more on cast iron heads instead of aluminum?

  • No

  • Yes

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It bugs me that to do it right, you should send the new aluminums off to the machine shop to get checked. Now, not all brands are like that but a pair of aluminum heads that I could afford would need to be checked.
 
toolmanmike said:
It bugs me that to do it right, you should send the new aluminums off to the machine shop to get checked. Now, not all brands are like that but a pair of aluminum heads that I could afford would need to be checked.
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Quickly, the "twice a year sale for Chinese heads at 800+" turns into 1000+. I couldn't just bolt and go either. I have a friend that put pro comps on a 455 Olds without checking, and had issues.
 
j par said:
And again it's like I was telling valve flyer, 820 totally loaded aluminum heads compared to buying and spending that that same amount on Factory cast iron.
This is definitely under $1, 000 territory. When you start talkin anyting else it doubles the 820 and then starts tripling and quadrupling...
This isn't Max effort this is bang for buck in the budget realm which I consider and it's definitely my opinion on this one is in the Thousand or less range..
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I asked because there is more to cylinder head selection than materiel. Personally, I'm not a fan of many closed chambered heads, especially the stuff Chrylser used. If my choice is an iron head with a chamber I like or an aluminum head with a chamber I don't like, I'm taking the iron head every time, even though I hate grinding iron.

I say that again because just using air flow off of a bench to determine how much power a given head will make is sketchy at best. I've seen heads that flowed like crazy, but didn't even make 1.7 HP/CFM and I've seen heads that didn't flow very well that made 2.3 HP/CFM.
 
toolmanmike said:
It bugs me that to do it right, you should send the new aluminums off to the machine shop to get checked. Now, not all brands are like that but a pair of aluminum heads that I could afford would need to be checked.
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You need to check every head every time and it doesn't matter the cost or what name is on the box.
 
318willrun said:
Quickly, the "twice a year sale for Chinese heads at 800+" turns into 1000+. I couldn't just bolt and go either. I have a friend that put pro comps on a 455 Olds without checking, and had issues.
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I'm sorry I haven't had a chance to read the telephone book in your last post. But I can tell you here we go again "I had a friend" who had issues...
I have yet to have someone personally chimed in with issues on their Chinese Mopar heads.. not to say it doesn't happen every day but again in our Vash pool we have here no one has chimed in with bad words about them...
 
yellow rose said:
I asked because there is more to cylinder head selection than materiel. Personally, I'm not a fan of many closed chambered heads, especially the stuff Chrylser used. If my choice is an iron head with a chamber I like or an aluminum head with a chamber I don't like, I'm taking the iron head every time, even though I hate grinding iron.

I say that again because just using air flow off of a bench to determine how much power a given head will make is sketchy at best. I've seen heads that flowed like crazy, but didn't even make 1.7 HP/CFM and I've seen heads that didn't flow very well that made 2.3 HP/CFM.
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Okay I don't know how to dumb it down any more. Your choices basically under $1, 000 are as follows Factory cast iron or cheap Chinese aluminum...
 
j par said:
I'm sorry I haven't had a chance to read the telephone book in your last post. But I can tell you here we go again "I had a friend" who had issues...
I have yet to have someone personally chimed in with issues on their Chinese Mopar heads.. not to say it doesn't happen every day but again in our Vash pool we have here no one has chimed in with bad words about them...
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Sigh... I'll try to set the record straight :rolleyes: I'm NOT against Pro Comp, and I like YOUR heads, and I think you got a GOOD deal. But if I found a nice set of used econo W2's for 850, I would rather have them than your pro comps, and I don't care what material they used to make 'em. Further more, I've NEVER EVER EVER EVER EVER put 800+ into a cast head, and I've done more heads than you'd care to count!!!!!
:thumbsup:
 
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I'd use a worn out W2 head as a door stop too. I don't run small blocks.
That makes my choice easy. :D
 
I may be wrong but I read into YR's post that velocity is as important as max flow
and IMHO
higher flow at lower valve lifts is a worthy goal
from someone who's motorhome/ truck boat builds were mostly in the half inch lift range- I throw out all the flows above that
 
if I knew the name of the famous racer who used cast iron I would say like him or her and if I knew someone famous that used aluminum I would say him or her and maybe that would make it more understandable...
318willrun said:
Sure, many will be interested in loaded aluminum heads for 820. But this thread isn't about where to buy, there was a thread on that last year, their big sale. This thread is about, "putting equal or more into iron heads vs aluminum".
Lets visit REALVILLE.
  • My 318 heads in my '74 Duster. New valve springs for 50 bucks, and new exhaust valves for 48 bucks, and 10 bucks for new umbrella seals, 20 bucks in stones to port. For my engine, for my build, 128 dollars and some winter time porting, I got what I wanted. Didn't want 800+ dollar heads!
  • I also bought remanufactured, fully loaded mag heads for 300 bucks (pair). They were meant for my 5.2 mag. I changed my mind, added 230 bucks for Hughes spring kit, and 60 bucks to have Odessa's fix checked out, and 10 dollars in stones. That's 600 dollars all set for up to .550 lift. You will be over 900 dollars in your aluminum heads with springs. That's still 300 bucks cheaper than your heads with new spring, and even more if you take yours to a machine shop to be checked out, and I'm not sure you'll flow hardly any better, IF better.
  • So tell my why I'm stupid in these two builds??? This is why the decision will be made case by case scenario.
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I certainly don't know why you're putting words into my mouth and in the end here asking me why I think you're stupid? I don't.
.Also freshening up your 318 heads have absolutely nothing to do with this whatsoever...
. now the second scenario don't forget to add the $99 for the pushrods that you're going to need to make those heads work?
And I won't forget the 60 bucks that I'll need for the special studs to mount mine..
I'm definitely saying I would be stupid to spend the same kind of money I did on my factory cast iron heads knowing what I know now...
I guess what I'm saying if I could do it over again I would do it different with this new option.
And what I hear you saying is if you had to do it over again with this option available you would still do what you did?
as in if you knew when you got those heads everything you were going to end up doing to them and have checked and back and forth to the Machine Shop and all the grinding and Hassell..
 
Wyrmrider said:
I may be wrong but I read into YR's post that velocity is as important as max flow
and IMHO
higher flow at lower valve lifts is a worthy goal
from someone who's motorhome/ truck boat builds were mostly in the half inch lift range- I throw out all the flows above that
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There is SO MUCH that goes into how the head will perform. Unfortunately, many don't realize it.
 
j par said:
if I knew the name of the famous racer who used cast iron I would say like him or her and if I knew someone famous that used aluminum I would say him or her and maybe that would make it more understandable...

I certainly don't know why you're putting words into my mouth and in the end here asking me why I think you're stupid? I don't.
.Also freshening up your 318 heads have absolutely nothing to do with this whatsoever...
. now the second scenario don't forget to add the $99 for the pushrods that you're going to need to make those heads work?
And I won't forget the 60 bucks that I'll need for the special studs to mount mine..
I'm definitely saying I would be stupid to spend the same kind of money I did on my factory cast iron heads knowing what I know now...
I guess what I'm saying if I could do it over again I would do it different with this new option.
And what I hear you saying is if you had to do it over again with this option available you would still do what you did?
as in if you knew when you got those heads everything you were going to end up doing to them and have checked and back and forth to the Machine Shop and all the grinding and Hassell..
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  • Push rods needed for the LA, not if I use them on the magnum. You have aftermarket pushrods for your LA ?? So call it even.
  • I'm not sure you'll get this, but I think for my motor, the mag heads I have will give a better ET than your Pro Comps on my motor. IF ET is what we want, then I will stick with my 600 dollar heads rather than your 900 dollar Procomps.
 
318willrun said:
  • Push rods needed for the LA, not if I use them on the magnum. You have aftermarket pushrods for your LA ?? So call it even.
  • I'm not sure you'll get this, but I think for my motor, the mag heads I have will give a better ET than your Pro Comps on my motor. IF ET is what we want, then I will stick with my 600 dollar heads rather than your 900 dollar Procomps.
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So the 50 lb and the bigger intake valves are going to equal out also...
 
j par said:
So the 50 lb and the bigger intake valves are going to equal out also...
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Bigger valves not needed in a street car. Flow at lower lifts is very important to a highway geared car with a small cam, something you obviously haven't considered in my case. Also, velocity builds low end torque, something crucial to my car. I'm willing to bet my heads beat yours hands down in the two crucial areas to my car.
 
318willrun said:
  • Push rods needed for the LA, not if I use them on the magnum. You have aftermarket pushrods for your LA ?? So call it even.
  • I'm not sure you'll get this, but I think for my motor, the mag heads I have will give a better ET than your Pro Comps on my motor. IF ET is what we want, then I will stick with my 600 dollar heads rather than your 900 dollar Procomps.
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I'm going to go ahead and dispute your flow numbers as well. I'm going to say these untouched Speedmaster heads would flow better...
 
318willrun said:
Bigger valves not needed in a street car. Flow at lower lifts is very important to a highway geared car with a small cam, something you obviously haven't considered in my case. Also, velocity builds low end torque, something crucial to my car. I'm willing to bet my heads beat yours hands down in the two crucial areas to my car.
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I bet my heads beat yours in the critical areas that I use my car! Number 1 horsepower! Number two kicking bench Racers asses.. number three give me that giddy feeling that I'm finally going to have aluminum heads on my car that I've always wanted... And the cootie Gras blow I will always have a faster duster than you...:popcorn:...:rolleyes:..
 
j par said:
I'm going to go ahead and dispute your flow numbers as well. I'm going to say these untouched Speedmaster heads would flow better...
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Heads are like cams. You can dump a .557 lift and 320 duration cam in a stock 318. It's not what's best. Treat heads the same, match the build and components. This is why this thread is SO generic it's silly.
 
318willrun said:
Heads are like cams. You can dump a .557 lift and 320 duration cam in a stock 318. It's not what's best. Treat heads the same, match the build and components. This is why this thread is SO generic it's silly.
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Get whatever you want and enjoy it especially if you get lucky enough to afford it...
 
j par said:
I bet my heads beat yours in the critical areas that I use my car! Number 1 horsepower! Number two kicking bench Racers asses.. number three give me that giddy feeling that I'm finally going to have aluminum heads on my car that I've always wanted... And the cootie Gras blow I will always have a faster duster than you...:popcorn:...:rolleyes:..
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Celebrate... LOL. 6k built stroker motor, Dana 3.54's, and you are about a whop'n 6 tenths ahead of a stock 360, with stock converter, and 2.94's? You dance around your yard but I'd be ashamed to post what you just did.
 
Now I haven't built a small block mopar in thirty five years so I don't have a dog in this fight but I have refreshed two big blocks in the last five years and both received new valve train. Both have iron heads and both received a little more work in the ports. I personally like working the heads and finding power, I don't go crazy but they seam to work with the 9.5 440 making 520 hp and the 12.5 motor making 645 hp. On the second motor I'm giving up 55 to 60 hp for the price of a pair of Trick Flows less what I spent on valves and springs this last time. I take some satisfaction knowing I'm making the power and not just heating up the card ordering heads.
 
j par said:
Yes this thread was partially created to stop derailing the thread I have on Speedmaster heads and actually paying for them and getting them on...
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and you'll always stay on topic in other people's threads.... :rolleyes:
 
Oldiron440 said:
Now I haven't built a small block mopar in thirty five years so I don't have a dog in this fight but I have refreshed two big blocks in the last five years and both received new valve train. Both have iron heads and both received a little more work in the ports. I personally like working the heads and finding power, I don't go crazy but they seam to work with the 9.5 440 making 520 hp and the 12.5 motor making 645 hp. On the second motor I'm giving up 55 to 60 hp for the price of a pair of Trick Flows less what I spent on valves and springs this last time. I take some satisfaction knowing I'm making the power and not just heating up the card ordering heads.
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Again I wasn't trying to compare a refresh of cast-iron heads to buying a completely new set of aluminum heads. it's more there's a product available now that with the same money you did spend on those cast-iron heads you could be now actually refreshing aluminum heads. As in the price of aluminum head has now become close to equal as old cast iron. If you had to start with brand-new Magnum or LA cast-iron heads and load them up? For me this is just all discussion not pointing fingers just if I wanted to give somebody advice now I would probably Point them towards these heads especially after I test them... but if someone need testimonies on them there's plenty of good ones...
 
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