Charging/Gauge Power gremlins

[PNW_Plymouth]

Hello everyone!

First post here and looking for a little advice about my headlights and r!
Two months ago, I started work on my 1964 Plymouth Valiant that had been sitting for more than 20 years. Fast forward to today and it’s running and driving and I’m completely in love with everything about it. It’s the 2-door Sedan, push-button torqueflite with the 225.
When I purchased the vehicle, the original alternator wouldn’t keep the vehicle running. Replaced the battery and the alternator at the same time. Everything seemed to be alright for a while when one day the ammeter started smoking on my way to work. Thankfully nothing caught on fire, but it definitely rendered the ammeter unusable. I bypassed the gauge by connecting the wires together and then did the Mad Electric rewire.
I’m now having issues of flickering lights that will flicker faster with increases in RPM, stalling after starting, and lower RPM backfire. I will be wiring in an Equus Tach to be able to see what RPM the backfire is occurring at. The gauge cluster has power for turn indicator, high beam indicator and the oil pressure light, but no power going to the gas or temp gauge (engine terminal is broken to the temp gauge, so that wouldn’t work until I fix it anyways), but the sending unit is new and I confirmed with a test light that it has power to the fuel level float.
I also replaced the voltage regulator with one from NAPA and it immediately started smoking when I turned it on after replacement. The alternator I replaced is a 60 amp Ultima from O’Reilly and the battery is a super start from the same place.
Any input on things that I could be missing or doing wrong?

 

[halifaxhops]

The gas and temp gauge go through the current limiter behind the dash on the circuit bord it plugs in I believe on yours.

Make sur also that your engine has a ground strap to the body also. Can be some of the other issues. Just my FYI

 

[slantsixdan]

he ammeter started smoking on my way to work.

The alternator you installed, aside from being of notoriously poor "remanufactured" "quality", can provide at least double the current the car's charging circuitry (including the ammeter and all wires, connections, voltage regulator, etc) was designed for. Smoke and destruction is the near-inevitable result.

did the Mad Electric rewire.

You were in the neighbourhood of the right idea, but the halfassed hack of a "fix" proposed by the clowns at MAD Electrical is crap. Read this. As to the ammeter, see here, for example.

I’m now having issues of flickering lights that will flicker faster with increases in RPM

Charging system still faulty.
• Poor-quality alternator (buy a better-quality one with a more appropriate current rating)
• Old/iffy wires and connections (examine carefully, clean/repair/replace as needed)

• Poor voltage regulator ground (run a 14ga wire from alternator housing to voltage reg base, and from voltage reg base to battery negative terminal).

stalling after starting, and lower RPM backfire

Not related to charging system badness; diagnose/repair separately. Do a valve adjustment, study the carburetor operation and repair manuals and links to training movies and carb repair/modification threads posted here for free download, and the tune-up parts and technique suggestions here.

no power going to the gas or temp gauge (engine terminal is broken to the temp gauge, so that wouldn’t work until I fix it anyways), but the sending unit is new and I confirmed with a test light that it has power to the fuel level float.

Instrument cluster voltage regulator ("limiter") has failed. It's built into fuel gauge on your car. Buy an RT Engineering IVR-4 and install it this way.

Overall: as soon as you can, get the three books listed in this thread.

 

[PNW_Plymouth]

The alternator you installed, aside from being of notoriously poor "remanufactured" "quality", can provide at least double the current the car's charging circuitry (including the ammeter and all wires, connections, voltage regulator, etc) was designed for. Smoke and destruction is the near-inevitable result.



You were in the neighbourhood of the right idea, but the halfassed hack of a "fix" proposed by the clowns at MAD Electrical is crap. Read this. As to the ammeter, see here, for example.




Charging system still faulty.
• Poor-quality alternator (buy a better-quality one with a more appropriate current rating)
• Old/iffy wires and connections (examine carefully, clean/repair/replace as needed)

• Poor voltage regulator ground (run a 14ga wire from alternator housing to voltage reg base, and from voltage reg base to battery negative terminal).



Not related to charging system badness; diagnose/repair separately. Do a valve adjustment, study the carburetor operation and repair manuals and links to training movies and carb repair/modification threads posted here for free download, and the tune-up parts and technique suggestions here.



Instrument cluster voltage regulator ("limiter") has failed. It's built into fuel gauge on your car. Buy an RT Engineering IVR-4 and install it this way.

Overall: as soon as you can, get the three books listed in this thread.

Lot of material to go off here. Thank you! I think my only other question before I head into this more than I already have, is do you have a specific alternator that you’d recommend to replace the ultima?

 

[slantsixdan]

The trouble isn't one brand versus another; the whole breed ("remanufactured") is categorically lousy, especially with decades-old parts that have been through the abusive process numerous times. Problem is, this isn't 1970 or even 1980; now the pickings are few and difficult unless you want to get into a more involved retrofitment of an other-than-original kind of alternator. Awhile back Old Car Parts Northwest had shelves and shelves full of new old stock Chrysler alternators with a wide range of ratings. They might still, or might not—the biz moved from WA to ID. You might try using the linked contact form to ask if they still have any new '60s-'70s Chrysler alternators, 40A or less. The year doesn't matter; '70-up alternators have two field terminals rather than one, but you can just ground the extra terminal if you want to keep using the single-field '64-type charging circuit.

 

[PNW_Plymouth]

The trouble isn't one brand versus another; the whole breed ("remanufactured") is categorically lousy, especially with decades-old parts that have been through the abusive process numerous times. Problem is, this isn't 1970 or even 1980; now the pickings are few and difficult unless you want to get into a more involved retrofitment of an other-than-original kind of alternator. Awhile back Old Car Parts Northwest had shelves and shelves full of new old stock Chrysler alternators with a wide range of ratings. They might still, or might not—the biz moved from WA to ID. You might try using the linked contact form to ask if they still have any new '60s-'70s Chrysler alternators, 40A or less. The year doesn't matter; '70-up alternators have two field terminals rather than one, but you can just ground the extra terminal if you want to keep using the single-field '64-type charging circuit.

Gotcha. Calling around to a few reputable places hasn’t yielded any of the correct ones for my engine. Only remanufactured ones. Is there a way to safely run a 55 - 60 amp unit? I need a new alternator regardless, but if the higher amperage units can be safely run, I saw another person say they had luck with a BBB Industries one which I understand would still be a gamble given what you said about the age of the cores. I would get a new VR and the IVR4 you recommended as well. I’ve been working on redoing some of the crusty wiring as well, but I’ll install the new VR ground to the battery tomorrow once I get to work. Would an electronic voltage regulator do a better job with handling the output of the alternator?

 

[slantsixdan]

Yes, there is a way to safely run a 60A alternator—it is described in detail at the first link in post #3 of this thread.

A good regulator is better and more reliable than a cheesy one. My preference for the pre-'70 system is this one. It looks a little different to the original, but fits and hooks up directly.

 

[PNW_Plymouth]

Yes, there is a way to safely run a 60A alternator—it is described in detail at the first link in post #3 of this thread.

A good regulator is better and more reliable than a cheesy one. My preference for the pre-'70 system is this one. It looks a little different to the original, but fits and hooks up directly.

Thank you! Of all places, my local NAPA actually had a square back 36a in stock that I grounded the extra field connector on and with a new voltage regulator it no longer is flickering the headlights or gauge lights. My coworkers are Mopar guys and one of them had an extra IVR4 so I have that now as well, but am yet to wire it in. Will post an update when that is taken care of.