Electrical solderless or soldered connectors

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Solder is more resistance. A crimped connector requires $$ to really have strong crimps. Maybe it's me but if you keep up with Drag and drive events wiring seems to be at the forefront of problems..... Just my observation.

My last resto I soldered almost all the joints except a handful in the car including the Weatherpak connectors. Zero failures and 100% operating from day 1. I was around the car 5 years after it was done and had over 10K for road miles and beat up on it pretty good at the track.

I have always believed both serve a purpose and are durable but like anything if you don't put your best foot forward doing the work you will get mediocre results. I use the water tight solder connectors on all my trailers and they never seem to fail FYI....

JW
 
I have gotten away from the plastics, since I wired this. But I have problems finding the rings in anything but the plastic. I imagine I could have just pulled the plastic, which I did in other places.
I make sure Everything has an insulator, whether it comes with one or I use the shrink wrap.
Sometimes, if I make the wire a little too long and it sticks out of the top of the connector, I will solder the end of the wire to the connector and leave the rest of the wire free of the solder so it has flexibility and won't crack and break
 
Pawned said:
But I have problems finding the rings
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Tyco (TE) Amp Catalog is one.

Thomas & Betts, Anchor (Marine) may also make them.

Once you know hte part, finding a retailer is pretty easy. A lot of those places that carry the Packard 58, 59 and others mentioned or linked in the Chrysler Terminal thread carry much much more. Here's another of those linked direct to large ring terminals
 
Most if not all the insulated connectors use a butted seam. The good ones are brazed to make a complete circle retaining the wire.

Places like waytek and terminal supply have the brazed connectors.
 
Most of my crimpers are hand me downs, except for the manual ones that work perfectly. Yesterday, I went out and bought a new Crimper set that came with 9 sets of dies.
I got to tell you that I am extremely happy with the crimps I am getting with this new crimper. Even though most of the dies were duplicate to the dies I already own. The difference between the new and the old tools are night and day.
So far, I am almost completely done putting new ends on all my wires on the terminal strips that I showed in a previous post. Relabeled every wire and terminal. I am no longer concerned with the quality of the connections.
When I tear into my dash, next time, I will start replacing the old connectors with new ones. As soon as the new connectors, I ordered get here
 
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SIX225 said:
Proper tooling for connectors! I deal with this all the time at work. Can't tell you how many crimps come apart due to improper tools and worn out tooling. One size doesn not fit all! Good crimp tools are not cheap.
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^^^^ This is the best post I have read for ages. :thumbsup:
 
Here, hopefully the 2nd photo looks better than before

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These companies, especially on Ebay, that give the product you order, to a secondary shipping company to take the package to USPS for them. Rather than having the USPS pick it up directly, are adding 2-3 days on to the time it takes to receive your order.
And I will sit here with nothing to do, because I ran out of ring connectors and need to wait 2-3 days extra, for my order to get here.
This is why I am doing a lot of my ordering from Amazon, but they are no angels either.
I can not rewire my fuses until the order gets here. There are no companies, locally, that sell connectors (that I know of), forcing me to buy them online
 
slantsixdan said:
Yup, properly-done solderless wins. Read this (or if that link won't let you read it, try this one), and this, and this.
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I had to make some connectors , and found something that works for smaller wiring.
Out in the sticks , no time to go t the store : took a 1/16'' copper oil line tube, cut it about 3/4'' long , used a small drill bit to ream it out as far as possible w/o weakening it , cleaned w/ laquer thinner , used them as connector , crimped ,then and soldered it , then heat shrink a couple times , hasnt failed me once.
Only drawback is it takes a little time to do ....
 
As long as you are soldering, you are getting the best electrical connection you can get....
 
Bewy said:
As long as you are soldering, you are getting the best electrical connection you can get....
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Make sure to use resin core solder. My neighbor used acid core solder that is used for copper plumbing and other metals and ended up with lots of corrosion for his motorcycle battery. Don't be like my neighbor.

I have been restoring antique radios from the 1920's and the soldered connections are still fine. For our cars make sure the wires are twisted together or crimped in a barrel connector (copper is best) and soldered and protected with shrink wrap.

The factory had professional crimp tools and soldering everything on the line would take too much time.
 
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Bewy said:
Reliable mechanically & electrically [ least amount of resistance in the connection ]
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Not fully true.
The electrical conductivity of solder is relatively poor. It's not even close to copper.
A low resistance solder joint is accomplished the same way a low resistance crimp joint is achieved. The copper of both parts is joined to maximize the surface to surface contact. The solder itself should not be relied upon for the electrical connection where resistance is a concern. It's there to ensure the joint stays together and protects from oxidation.

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IACS is conductivity relative to copper.

Don't get me wrong. I like soldering. I soldered new caps into the radio. But with open barrel connectors, crimping the conductor and insulator with the right crimper is quite reliable. A sleeve to protect against oxidation takes it one step further. Many of the open barrel terminals are still available with a tin plate which also reduces oxidation (at the expense of a very thin layer of higher resistance). The most exposed OEM terminals used a silver plate which is much more difficult to find new.
 
Woodys_Cuda said:
Make sure to use resin core solder. My neighbor used acid core solder that is used for copper plumbing and other metals and ended up with lots of corrosion for his motorcycle battery. Don't be like my neighbor.

I have been restoring antique radios from the 1920's and the soldered connections are still fine. For our cars make sure the wires are twisted together or crimped in a barrel connector (copper is best) and soldered and protected with shrink wrap.

The factory had professional crimp tools and soldering everything on the line would take too much time.
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Not sure that acid core is used proffessionally on plumbing. None of the plumbers I've worked with used cored solders at all. Brush the female, sand cloth the male and then a thin coat of rosin. Assemble and solder. that's it. If you get sloppy and a little drips hit with a a damp rag.
 
Someone mentioned alternators.
Alternator Stator.
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Ring terminal double crimped. Windings crimped and soldered.


Now an interesting question is why were OEM battery terminals lead rather than copper for so many years?
My guess is that manufacturing considerations were the reason and the large surface area of contact minimized the resistance.
 
Mattax said:
Not sure that acid core is used proffessionally on plumbing. None of the plumbers I've worked with used cored solders at all. Brush the female, sand cloth the male and then a thin coat of rosin. Assemble and solder. that's it. If you get sloppy and a little drips hit with a a damp rag.
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Yes I've seen it mostly done that way. I just used this website as reference: Acid Core VS Rosin Core Solder: Pros & Cons Discussed

*edit* All that being said if you have professional grade crimping tools it's the easiest way to go. I'm good with either method if done properly.
 
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Last year I completely redid an underhood wiring harness for my 85 D150. Repaired a few "aged spots" that insulation was deteriorating, replaced a few wires, and wired in an underhood fuse box from a different application that incorporated maxi fuses so I could do away with any and all fusible links. I hate those things. (Nother story); I crimped every connection with a bare uninsulated butt connector, soldered every connection I made and used the good grade of heat shrink (adhesive lined, not the stuff that is usually bought at Lowe's or ace hardware) So far so good. But I've wired up more trailers from scratch over the years than I can remember and in an application like that I've noticed that if I am gonna later have issues, it's a broken wire and/or corrosion right next to a soldered joint. I don't get that. I don't use acid core, never have.
 
Right at the end of the solder (or the crimp barrel) it goes from a rigidly held section of metal to an unsupported section. This becomes the stress point when there is any movement. Need to break a piece of metal? Clamp it in vise and bend back and forth. You've seen it. You've likely done it.

These soldered connections do not see much stress because there is little mass in the wire sections and the other end is held rigid.
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Most of the terminals on the car had a second crimp that holds the insulation. This provides support so wire movement is not concentrated at the end of the flexible portion of the wire.
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All those cable supports that us mechanics (shade tree) thought were placed there to anoy us - turns out they were there for a reason.
 
Mattax,
Solder may well have higher resistance to copper. While you might have a 3ft long battery cable to your starter, you would not use a 3ft long length of solder for the same job.
The resistance of any material is a product of it's length & CSA. The distance between a copper wire inside a terminal & the distance to the wall of the terminal [ the space that is filled with solder ] is so small that it would probably be measured in microns.....The resistance across the joint would thus be so tiny that laboratory grade equipment would be needed to measure it.
More solder heaped on the joint will further lower the resistance because the CSA is being increased.
 
presume the car battery connectors are lead alloy becasue the plates in the battery are lead alloy... usually lead with some nasty chemical in it like antimony or some such to give it some rigidity.
worked for a car battery recycler in my youth.."acid proof gloves n boots and a space suit, blood test every 3 weeks" and the vast majoirity of end plates in a lead acid car battery were created with the top contacts for the battery as an integral part. may no longer be the case.

battery tech has come a long way in the last 30 years

i wonder if its hard to solder to lead and easier to just drill and rivet or put a self tapping screw through to make a connection

Dave
 
Bewy said:
So use a good soldering iron......
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Off Topic Sorry, For the old Rigid Mounted HDs, and Boats, we use vibration proof terminals. That's the only point i was trying to make. A dab a solder won't kill it, but the heat, from a full joint, hurts older stranded wires. I think everyone here has Vaild Points for what they want to do. Hope all is Well Down Under!
 
Dave999 said:
presume the car battery connectors are lead alloy becasue the plates in the battery are lead alloy... usually lead with some nasty chemical in it like antimony or some such to give it some rigidity.
worked for a car battery recycler in my youth.."acid proof gloves n boots and a space suit, blood test every 3 weeks" and the vast majoirity of end plates in a lead acid car battery were created with the top contacts for the battery as an integral part. may no longer be the case.

battery tech has come a long way in the last 30 years

i wonder if its hard to solder to lead and easier to just drill and rivet or put a self tapping screw through to make a connection

Dave
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Possible, if you have a solid ring terminal fer the wire, unlike some things I've found with stranded wire wrapped around a self tapper! Lol
 
I crimp with the standard manual Klein crimpers that someone posted on the previous page and use quality insulated butt splices while adding heat shrink over the top for looks mainly. I've probably done a few thousand splices like this over the years at home and work and have never had a failure that I know of.
 
TT5.9mag said:
Completely disagree. And if you read the instructions on aftermarket ecu wiring, they all recommend terminating the wire at the connector and a proper crimp.
Here’s one example,
View attachment 1716086586
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Also, I seem to remember reading something regarding the chemical makeup of the solder reacting with the stranded wire and corroding. Maybe the acid in the solder? I've taken apart may soldered connections that were green with corrosion.
 
crackedback said:
Don't use those insulated connectors. Use the non insulated and shrink tube them.

Always use a toothed crimper on non insulated. This Klein 1005 is a great tool.

www.kleintools.com

Crimping and Cutting Tool for Connectors - 1005 | Klein Tools

The Klein Tools Crimping and Cutting Tool crimps both insulated and non-insulated 10-22 AWG terminals and connectors. The tapered nose which is great when working in tight spaces. The wire cutter in the nose specially hardened for long life.
www.kleintools.com www.kleintools.com

View attachment 1716089334


No solder required. Solder is not a good conductor. There are times I use solder to help "lock" a connection, it is not used to improve the connection.
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One of the best tools in my box.
 
RustyRatRod said:
Also, I seem to remember reading something regarding the chemical makeup of the solder reacting with the stranded wire and corroding. Maybe the acid in the solder? I've taken apart may soldered connections that were green with corrosion.
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Cool, this thread is still going! Yeah moisture got into that connection turning it green. Here's Scotty showing us how to do it right. Rev up your engines! lol.


 
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