Harmonic balancer or bearing.

[Joel Chapman]

So running down some squealing belts I found that my harmonic balancer was moving in and out with increased rpm and I could move it in and out by hand. (See attached video) I pulled the balancer off with a puller and retreaded the bolt into the crank and got no movement. Safe to say I have a bad balancer? Are there any clear indicators I should be looking for on my balancer? I will be trying to reinstall the balancer and see if it all still moves.

 

[cudascott]

I’m not sure what I see moving in the video but the part of the balancer that the crank pulley bolts to is
steel. The rubber is between that and the outer ring
at least on a stock unit was your crank bolt tight?

 

[Joel Chapman]

I’m not sure what I see moving in the video but the part of the balancer that the crank pulley bolts to is
steel. The rubber is between that and the outer ring
at least on a stock unit was your crank bolt tight?

The whole balancer was moving in and out. It was tight enough I couldn’t break it loose with out the whole crank moving.

 

[cudascott]

There is an amount of end play that has to be in the crank. But you would need a dial indicator to measure it with the oil pan on if it’s indeed out of spec then the thrust face on the thrust bearing is worn. What small block is it?

 

[512Stroker]

So running down some squealing belts I found that my harmonic balancer was moving in and out with increased rpm and I could move it in and out by hand. (See attached video) I pulled the balancer off with a puller and retreaded the bolt into the crank and got no movement. Safe to say I have a bad balancer? Are there any clear indicators I should be looking for on my balancer? I will be trying to reinstall the balancer and see if it all still moves.

I did not see anything move in the video.
If you suspect the balancer is bad , replace it.
A balancer failure can do alot of damage and will be very expensive.

 

[Locomotion]

I'm leaning towards the thrust bearing also. The converter would move back & forth also because it's all bolted together. (Pulleys too.) But it would be best to measure and see what's an acceptable amount. It's possible to "feel" some back & forth movement even though everything is ok.

With the balancer bolt tight, it should seat the balancer against the lower timing gear. Otherwise, a balancer can have:

* Outer ring slipping on the rubber.
* Grooves worn on snout from the seal.
* Lost press fit.
* Worn keyway/groove in crank or balancer.

But none of this would cause the balancer to move back & forth if the bolt is tight & not bottomed out.

cudascott, It might be easier to see the balancer move if you "full page" the video.

Joel, I'm curious how many miles are on the engine.

 

[Joel Chapman]

There is an amount of end play that has to be in the crank. But you would need a dial indicator to measure it with the oil pan on if it’s indeed out of spec then the thrust face on the thrust bearing is worn. What small block is it?

71 318

 

[MoparMike1974]

Thrust bearing. Is it a manual transmission? They tend to be hard on the thrust bearing.

 

[Joel Chapman]

So if Im not showing any signs of wear on the balancer, and a little movement is good with the crank, then I’m back to square one on the squealing noise from the belts

 

[Joel Chapman]

Thrust bearing. Is it a manual transmission? They tend to be hard on the thrust bearing.

No it’s an auto trans

 

[Locomotion]

As for squealing belts, try squirting some water on the belts & pulleys to help find the noise. I think I've used WD-40 sparingly also. But it's been a while. Could be loose or just dry and need replacing.

 

[Joel Chapman]

As for squealing belts, try squirting some water on the belts & pulleys to help find the noise. I think I've used WD-40 sparingly also. But it's been a while. Could be loose or just dry and need replacing.

Replaced all the belts, new alternator new water pump. Ran the engine with certain belts of and still squeals

 

[Locomotion]

Alternator, water pump & power steering (if installed) free turning & no slop? Oops - just saw new alternator & pump. Maybe a bit tight while breaking in or belts not quite tight enough? Correct width belts? Or just new belts breaking in?

 

[Joel Chapman]

Alternator, water pump & power steering (if installed) free turning & no slop? Oops - just saw new alternator & pump. Maybe a bit tight while breaking in or belts not quite tight enough? Correct width belts? Or just new belts breaking in?

I’m not really sure I’ve had the same sound with the old and new belts old and new water pump and it’s seems to have started a while after I installed the new alternator, but I took that back and got another new one and it’s still making the same sound. I suspected power steering because the pulley wiggles but when I took that belt off and ran the car still had the same squeal

 

[Locomotion]

I'm out of suggestions.

 

[cudascott]

Have you checked the alignment of all the pulleys?

 

[Joel Chapman]

I'm out of suggestions.

That makes two of us lol

 

[Joel Chapman]

Have you checked the alignment of all the pulleys?

Too the best of my eye sight they look as lined up as they can be

 

[MoparMike1974]

The movement on that crank looks excessive to me. Not sure if its contributing to your belt squeeling or not.
Is there paint on the pulley grooves? Sometimes belts will slip after painting pulleys. After some time the paint will wear off.
Another thing is the pulleys can wear and the belt sits too low in the groove and bottoms out.
Can you post a video so we can HEAR the noise. It may be easier to diagnose.

 

[famous bob]

As for squealing belts, try squirting some water on the belts & pulleys to help find the noise. I think I've used WD-40 sparingly also. But it's been a while. Could be loose or just dry and need replacing.

OLD REMEDY FOR SQUEAKING BELTS IS A BAR OF HAND SOAP , WATCH UR FINGURES !!
If the convertor is moving in and out , the thrust bearing is shot , big trouble coming.
.005 to .009 at the least and most .

 

[Joel Chapman]

Sound one


Sound two

 

[Joel Chapman]

OLD REMEDY FOR SQUEAKING BELTS IS A BAR OF HAND SOAP , WATCH UR FINGURES !!
If the convertor is moving in and out , the thrust bearing is shot , big trouble coming.
.005 to .009 at the least and most .

Today I’m gonna try and find a dial indicator to see if I’m with in those specs

 

[512Stroker]

So running down some squealing belts I found that my harmonic balancer was moving in and out with increased rpm and I could move it in and out by hand. (See attached video) I pulled the balancer off with a puller and retreaded the bolt into the crank and got no movement. Safe to say I have a bad balancer? Are there any clear indicators I should be looking for on my balancer? I will be trying to reinstall the balancer and see if it all still moves.

I went back and played your original video again and I now agree that is excessive. You are going to find that is over allowable spec.
Time for a new thrust bearing

 

[4spdragtop]

A dial indicator as mentioned if mounted properly will tell the tale on the thrust bearing. You should be able to put indicator on balancer if balancer is tight.

 

[pishta]

We suggested thrust bearing a while ago. The balancer is a press fit. it wont move on its own (especially back and forth). you can take the friggin bolt out and it will still be stuck on there good (some slants didnt get a bolt, just a press fit!) your crank is walking and anything visible is not good. were talking way under 10 thousands for acceptable movement. Pull pan and check #3 bearing. The 'squeeking' could be the timing chain rubbing on the cover as the chain is moving in there too! put a hose or long screwdriver on the timing chain cover and other end to ear/skull and listen for metal on metal.