Nv3500

-

BrandunLee

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2013
Messages
45
Reaction score
0
Location
Colorado
Hey there FABO! It's been awhile Since I've been on the forums but I wanted to seek some advice on a decent 5 speed swap into my 74 318 Duster. Awhile back I snapped the main shaft on my 3on the floor manual trans doin a little bit of showin off. I had takin it to a well known trans shop that builds trannys for some mud racing trucks for a friend of mine to get rebuilt. They called a few weeks later and said they couldn't find parts for it at all. In fact they had never seen a trans like that! Kind of odd but I figured it's my chance to upgrade. It's been a couple years since the car has ran and I'm looking to get it up and running by summer time. I had thought about getting a four speed from the same year and model but now I'm thinking I want a 5speed. I found a trans on eBay for $300 that came out of a 94 2wd Dakota, with a tad bit of Internet surfing I found some helpful info that leads me to believe it's not too difficult. I know the nv3500 is rated to be able to handle around 300ftlbs of torque. I know that some of 90s Dakotas have a 5.2 but I'm not %100 sure how difficult it will be to fit in. All comments and advice are appreciated! P.s. I'm on a moderate budget
 
[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqi1vuNbs-8"]Dodge Ram - YouTube[/ame]

Full bodied Ram with a 360 and a NV3500.


The gear spread kind of sucks and the shifter throw feels like a truck, but they will hold up fine seeing you don't clutch dump them with slicks at 6,000 rpm on a regular basis. Treat them respectfully and they will last no doubt.


Send a PM to 'schwinger'. He has pictures and information as he did this swap years ago.

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/member.php?u=6893


Another:

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NU6dCr-5BAE"]How to burnout - YouTube[/ame]
 
NV3500 comes in close and wide ratio. Close will work much better in car, you can also shorten stick or get aftermarket shifter. B & M and Hurst used to sell them.
 
From Wiki:

Wide Ratio Gearing Option in Dodge 1500 & GM Full-size Light Trucks:
[1]---[2]---[3]---[4]---[5]---[R]
4.02-2.32-1.40-1.00-0.73--3.55


Close Ratio GM S/T Small Trucks[1] & 2500 Light Duty Dodge Ram Truck Gearing:
[1]---[2]---[3]---[4]---[5]---[R]
3.49-2.16-1.40-1.00-0.73--3.55

Now I'm wonderin' if he can buy an aftermarket close-ratio set... Doin some research as I'm curious as well.
 
NV3500 ratios are
4.01-2.32-1.40-1.00-.73 O/D with splits of .58-.60-.71-.73
Notice the truck "granny"gear.
To make best use of od, you might want a rear gear of 3.55s This will get you 65mph @2266,with 25inch tires. But low gear will be 3.55 x 4.01 = 14.23. This much gear is good for hauling grain off a soft field, and not much else. So with first gear useless, you are left with a 3 +1 box;with a brutal starter gear of 2.32 x 3.55 = 8.24. So 3.55s are out and so is anything bigger.
Lets work it from the bottom.
A good teener Duster starter gear would be 11.0/1 So;11.0/4.01 = 2.74s. So we've got first working. Howsabout O/D? 2.74 x .73 =2.00FD. This will get you 65 @1749. This would be fine for a stock-cammed teener.
So 2.74s are gonna work. Anything bigger you rapidly lose first gear, and it would be very difficult to use 2nd as a starter gear.
Now, let's say you get tired of looking at those teeny 25s back there, and graduate to 28s which fill up the tubs pretty nicely. A recalculation shows that now you will need 2.94s to best use od and low.
Ok so lets just put the 28s on right away, and the 2.94s too. Good to go right?
Not so fast,grasshopper. Lets talk about the splits.
Ima gonna assume you are wanting to set this up as a streeter. And that teener might have some bite to it; so let's say you are running the ever-popular 268 cam. This cam likes some revs to get moving, so lets say,around town you are gonna shift it at 3300. So lets go; into first with 2.94s and 28s, 3300 will be 23mph, and yank it into 2nd.At the shift the Rs will drop to 58% so that makes 1914 Rpm. Teener got torque?
Lets continue; 3300 in 2nd will be 40mph;and the Rpm drop of 60% puts the 3rd gear Rs at 1980. Teener got torque?Let's continue; so now you are in 3rd and accelerating to cruise speed; 3300 will be 66.8MPH .But you have two gears to go! So you dump into OD and the Rs come down to 1721,perfect. But you skipped 4th. So what have you got? Running as a streeter you have a 3 plus 1, with very wide splits.
- This tranny demands an engine with a very low operating powerband. Just like the stock Magnum or V6 that it came out of.
So what to do? Get rid of the cam. Move up to a 3.23. Sacrifice a little o/d for a little better 2-3-4 and rev it a little higher in 1st and 2nd, that's what.
-So how will that look? Again with 28s and 3.23s(or 3.55s with 25.5s,works out the same), Lets run her up to 3500 in first.OK.That makes 22.5mph and at the shift into 2nd the Rs drop to 2030. Teener got torque? It does now, with the stock cam.So now, lets buzz it up to 3500 in 2nd to make 38.9mph. The rpm drop into 3rd will be 2100, but lets calm down a bit now and buzz it up to just 3000 in 3rd. So that will get us 55mph, and the rpm drop into 4th gets us 2130. Finally you motor it up to 65@2520, and drop it into o/d;1840rpm.Pretty sweet?
Maybe.
But look at all the sacrifices you made; 1)Small, hi-torque engine required. 2) exactly two pumpkins will work and only with matching tires, 3) Lotsa reving going on for brisk acceleration.,4) limited torque rating,5) tunnel mods, 6) truck shifter,etc

Now my opinions
-It is my opinion that if you just want a nice cruiser car, and your teener has a stock cam and is otherwise healthy, and that you are willing to drive it this way forever,and that you are willing to swap the rear out to what you need, then go for it.
-I posted this elsewhere;for a nice tranny performance-ratio spread, you take the lowest gear and divide it by the highest gear ratio, and the result should fall between 4.0 and 4.5 tops for a 5spd; and in the range of 3 to 3.5 for a 4-spd . The NV3500 is 4.01/.73 = 5.5. This might be a nice spread in a farm truck, but it is way too huge for Duster with anything but a stock teener.
-Ima telling you this so that you will know what to expect in the end.After the many hours spent to fit it in there, and all the additional monies spent to finalize the install.This tranny does not play well for street and strip.
-All the best to you in your endeavors.
EDIT
Well, Tantibus posts a close ratio set
3.49-2.16-1.40-1.00-.73 o/d,with splits of .62-.65-.71-.73, and 3.49/.73 = 4.78; getting closer. This set will give you a bit more wiggle room in selecting a matching rear gear. But Ima thinkin the 3.23s with 28s, or 3.55/25.5tire,is still the go to gear. But you won't need to rev it to 3500 in the first two gears. Instead it would be 3200 to drop into 2nd at 1984, and 3100 in 2nd to drop into 3rd at 2015. As you can see, the rest of the story is the same. And the splits are now somewhat progressive, allowing a bit of a cam before trouble starts. So if you can find one to bolt up to your teener, it now becomes a bit more viable. The 2-3 split is still quite wide.This tranny might be able to run street/strip, but several sacrifices will need to be made.But,Really, it's horrible. The ratios are just Too far apart.
-For comparison here are the A833 numbers; 2.66-1.92-1.40-1.00 and splits .72-.73-.71. Those are hard to beat, especially considering how easy and affordable they are to find. The 3.09low model is IMO,a little sweeter for SBMs,and I highly recommend it. It runs nice with 3.55s or smaller number gears.
Running the early gears;3.09-1.92-1.40-1.00 splits are .62-.73-.71. This allows a bit more giddy-up off the line. You have to drive it like a mustang sometimes tho, but the following shifts make up for it. The beauty of the tight ratios, means you can put whatever rear under your Duster that you care to. Unfortunately tho, because it's just 4 gears, for a street/stripper, this invariably means a 2-chunk system.
 
From Wiki:

Wide Ratio Gearing Option in Dodge 1500 & GM Full-size Light Trucks:
[1]---[2]---[3]---[4]---[5]---[R]
4.02-2.32-1.40-1.00-0.73--3.55


Close Ratio GM S/T Small Trucks[1] & 2500 Light Duty Dodge Ram Truck Gearing:
[1]---[2]---[3]---[4]---[5]---[R]
3.49-2.16-1.40-1.00-0.73--3.55

Now I'm wonderin' if he can buy an aftermarket close-ratio set... Doin some research as I'm curious as well.

I was actually on that page on google before coming to FABO! lol I'm thinking I'm gonna go ahead and snatch up this trans
 
NV3500 ratios are
4.01-2.32-1.40-1.00-.73 O/D with splits of .58-.60-.71-.73
Notice the truck "granny"gear.
To make best use of od, you might want a rear gear of 3.55s This will get you 65mph @2266,with 25inch tires. But low gear will be 3.55 x 4.01 = 14.23. This much gear is good for hauling grain off a soft field, and not much else. So with first gear useless, tou are left with a 3 +1 box;with a brutal starter gear of 2.32 x 3.55 = 8.24. So 3.55s are out and so is anything bigger.
Lets work it from the bottom.
A good teener Duster starter gear would be 11.0/1 So;11.0/4.01 = 2.74s. So we/ve got first working. Howsabout O/D? 2.74 x .73 =2.00FD. This will get you 65 @1749. This would be fine for a stock-cammed teener.
So 2.74s are gonna work. Anything bigger you rapidly lose first gear, and it would be very difficult to use 2nd as a starter gear.
Now, letr's say you get tired of lookin at those teeny 25s back there, and graduate to 28s which fill up the tubs pretty nicely. A recalculation shows that now you will need 2.94s to best use od and low.
Ok so lets just put the 28s on right away, and the 2.94s too. Good to go right?
Not so fast,grasshopper. Lets talk about the splits.
Ima gonna assume you are wanting to set this up as a streeter. And that teener might have some bite to it; so let's say you are running the ever-popular 268 cam. This cam likes some revs to get moving, so lets say,around town you are gonna shift it at 3300. So lets go; into first with 2.94s and 28s, 3300 will be 23mph, and yank it into 2nd.At the shift the Rs will drop to 58% so that makes 1914 Rpm. Teener got torque?
Lets continue; 3300 in 2nd will be 40mph;and the Rpm drop of 60% puts the 3rd gear Rs at 1980. Teener got torque?Let's continue; so now you are in 3rd and accelerating to cruise speed; 3300 will be 66.8MPH .But you have two gears to go! So you dump into OD and the Rs come down to 1721,perfect. But you skipped 4th. So what have you got? Running as a streeter you have a 3 plus 1, with very wide splits. This tranny demands an engine with a very low operating powerband. Just like the stock Magnum or V6 that it came out of.
So what to do? Get rid of the cam. Move up to a 3.23. Sacrifice a little o/d for a little better 2-3-4 and rev it a little higher in 1st and 2nd, that's what.
-So how will that look? Again with 28s and 3.23s(or 3.55s with 25.5s,works out the same), Lets run her up to 3500 in first.OK.That makes 22.5mph and at the shift into 2nd the Rs drop to 2030. Teener got torque? It does now, with the stock cam.So now, lets buzz it up to 3500 in 2nd to make 38.9mph. The rpm drop into 3rd will be 2100, but lets calm down a bit now and buzz it up to just 3000 in 3rd. So that will get us 55mph, and the rpm drop into 4th gets us 2130. Finally you motor it up to 65@2520, and drop it into o/d;1840rpm.Pretty sweet?
Maybe.
But look at all the sacrifices you made; 1)Small, hi-torque engine required. 2) exactly two pumpkins will work and only with matching tires, 3) Lotsa reving going on for brisk acceleration.,4) limited torque rating,5) tunnel mods, 6) truck shifter,etc

Now my opinions
-It is my opinion that if you just want a nice cruiser car, and your teener has a stock cam and is otherwise healthy, and that you are willing to drive it this way forever,and that you are willing to swap the rear out to what you need, then go for it.
-I posted this elsewhere;for a nice tranny performance-ratio spread, you take the lowest gear and divide it by the highest gear ratio, and the result should fall between 4.0 and 4.5 tops. The NV3500 is 4.01/.73 = 5.5. This might be a nice spread in a farm truck, but it is way too huge for Duster with anything but a stock teener.
-Ima telling you this so that you will know what to expect in the end.After the many hours spent to fit it in there, and all the additional monies spent to finalize the install.
-All the best to you in your endeavors.

Thank you, this might be the most helpful post to me. I know the entire rear end in the car is different. My dad was the one who swapped it out. I'm not sure what the top speed of a 318 3 speed should've been but my gps had said I never passed 79 mph and that's almost topped out. The motor also has been machined and I think it has a cam. This year will be my first to modify or repair anything on the car myself besides getting it running 4 years ago
 
Is it a AX15 or a NV3500? The 3500 is a large trans, and will need a bunch of tunnel mods. If it is out of a Dakota first gear will not be as bad as one from a 1500. Have you looked in some yards local to you, you can find the 15s and the 3500s somewhat easy. (lots of Dakotas in yards)
 
Is it a AX15 or a NV3500? The 3500 is a large trans, and will need a bunch of tunnel mods. If it is out of a Dakota first gear will not be as bad as one from a 1500. Have you looked in some yards local to you, you can find the 15s and the 3500s somewhat easy. (lots of Dakotas in yards)

The account selling it classifies it as an nv3500 out of a 94 2wd Dakota
http://m.ebay.com/itm/131714610194
 
So what do you suggest I do? I'd like it to be pretty zippy and I wanna do some sort of restomod to it. Like modern suspensions n such
 
-For comparison here are the A833 numbers; 2.66-1.92-1.40-1.00 and splits .72-.73-.71. Those are hard to beat, especially considering how easy and affordable they are to find. The 3.09low model is IMO,a little sweeter for SBMs,and I highly recommend it. It runs nice with 3.55s or smaller number gears.

Thank you again for your help. At this point in time I just want to drive it. I don't want to spend hours on end and dollar after dollar to put a five speed in it. When the time and extra money come I'll buy a tremec and do what I gotta do to fit it in there
 
It can be done for cheap; grab all the stuff out of a Dakota, weld up a cross brace and let r' rip. About $400 should do it. Your fooling yourself on getting a 4 speed A-833 for $600 with all the parts needed to install and run it. More like at minimum $1500. And you've got to hunt down all of the parts over time.
 
-
Back
Top