Passenger Side Torsion Bar Too Long

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ElephantKiller

ElephantKiller

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I'm currently in the process of assembling the front suspension of my '73 Duster. I'm installing the factory torsion bars and am having an issue installing the passenger side bar. The bar will not install far enough past the groove to install the retaining snap ring. The driver side installs with room to spare. When installing, I can hear the bar bottoming out on the socket of the lower control arm. I measured between the mating surface inside the LCA socket to the groove on both the left-hand and right hand side. They measure at the same depth. I measured the torsion bars, and the passenger side is longer, but is still under the 35.8 specification. I replaced the LCA bushings with new rubber bushings, so I verified the passenger side was fully installed and it was. Honestly I'm running out of ideas of what could be causing the issue.
This car has been in the project stage for a while now, and I'm just getting back in the groove of putting it together. It's been a while since I removed the torsion bars, so I can't rightly remember if the clips were installed before. But I drove the car in college and the bars didn't come out. The front end of the car has been suspended with jack stands behind the rear torsion bar socket. Could the frame have sagged enough to change the distance between the K-member and the rear mount? I'm desperate for ideas at this point. I've thought about getting a new set of P-S-T torsion bars, but am worried that I will have the same issues when installing them.
I'm planning on putting a few more photos to illustrate the issue when I get back in the garage.

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To my knowledge there is a front and back and a left and right .. On my 68 Barracuda ' the left had two painted white strips about 8 inches from the front ... The right had one white strip about 8 inches from the front. I believe it is also stamped on the end of the t-bar . Hope this helps
 
How about if you swap sides with the bars. Make sure the odd numbered bar is in the drivers side & the even numbered bar is on the passengers side. Look at the end of the bars for the numbers.
 
ElephantKiller said:
I'm currently in the process of assembling the front suspension of my '73 Duster. I'm installing the factory torsion bars and am having an issue installing the passenger side bar. The bar will not install far enough past the groove to install the retaining snap ring. The driver side installs with room to spare. When installing, I can hear the bar bottoming out on the socket of the lower control arm. I measured between the mating surface inside the LCA socket to the groove on both the left-hand and right hand side. They measure at the same depth. I measured the torsion bars, and the passenger side is longer, but is still under the 35.8 specification. I replaced the LCA bushings with new rubber bushings, so I verified the passenger side was fully installed and it was. Honestly I'm running out of ideas of what could be causing the issue.
This car has been in the project stage for a while now, and I'm just getting back in the groove of putting it together. It's been a while since I removed the torsion bars, so I can't rightly remember if the clips were installed before. But I drove the car in college and the bars didn't come out. The front end of the car has been suspended with jack stands behind the rear torsion bar socket. Could the frame have sagged enough to change the distance between the K-member and the rear mount? I'm desperate for ideas at this point. I've thought about getting a new set of P-S-T torsion bars, but am worried that I will have the same issues when installing them.
I'm planning on putting a few more photos to illustrate the issue when I get back in the garage.

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Click to expand...

Since your left and right side measurements match I wouldn’t think that you have frame issue. More than likely you need to revisit the “bar bottoming out in the socket”. Check the LCA socket for burrs and dings. Clean it out thoroughly and then put a small amount of grease on the hex walls. Also, clean off the end of the bar and put a dab of grease on the end. Re-fit the bar, and then remove it. If the dab of grease on the end isn’t flattened, then you didn’t actually bottom out the bar.

What other parts are attached? If you have anything other than the LCA attached (spindle, shock, strut rod fully tightened, etc) then remove that stuff and see if it helps. It could be that something is causing the bar to bind up before it gets home.

It may also be that the passenger bar is slightly bent, causing a binding issue.

CudaCraig said:
To my knowledge there is a front and back and a left and right .. On my 68 Barracuda ' the left had two painted white strips about 8 inches from the front ... The right had one white strip about 8 inches from the front. I believe it is also stamped on the end of the t-bar . Hope this helps
Click to expand...

There is a left and right, front and back doesn’t matter and the paint stripes only indicate the size of the bar.

Demonracer said:
How about if you swap sides with the bars. Make sure the odd numbered bar is in the drivers side & the even numbered bar is on the passengers side. Look at the end of the bars for the numbers.
Click to expand...

That would work for checking the length and for any bar specific problems. But DO NOT run the torsion bars that way, as the suspension will twist the bar the opposite direction. Also, the LCA position for lining up the socket with the bar will change as the hex offset will be opposite, so the ride height will change. Swapping sides should be done only to rule out the other torsion bar itself as an issue.
 
72bluNblu, you are correct. I was not meaning for him to run them that way, but I have a sneaky suspicion he may have swapped them by accident. That's why I suggested he check the numbers on the end of the bars.
 
There is a L and R stamped on the back sides of my stock tbars. That made it easy to reinstall em but I didn't check if 1 was longer or not.
 
Demonracer said:
72bluNblu, you are correct. I was not meaning for him to run them that way, but I have a sneaky suspicion he may have swapped them by accident. That's why I suggested he check the numbers on the end of the bars.
Click to expand...

Ah gotcha. Just wanted to make sure that was clear.

There was at least one other case on here of a torsion bar actually being too long, the forgings on these things were not always cut the same way on the hex ends. With the small difference in length that shouldn't be the cause, but it is something else to consider. But typically you can push the torsion bars a good 1/4" or more past the spring clip retainers before they bottom out, so the bar length doesn't have to be perfect.

A couple of pictures from my cars, you can see there's a good distance between the clip and the end of the bar. So if the clip won't go in it's not off by a little bit, it's off by over a 1/4" at least.

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Thanks for the replies. My torsion bars have the numbers cast into the ends in addition to the letters L and R; 890 for the right and 891 for the left. I also installed the bars so the same casting numbers were to the rear. You can see in the picture in addition to the P/N, the letters BAX are cast into the end of the bar. I put these to the rear of the car. I did try swapping the right-hand bar to the left-hand side and had similar results, the bar covers the groove for the snap ring.
I inspected the socket for the LCA and found no burs. I also rounded the edges of the bar to be sure there were no hard edges that could cause the dimensional difference. There were no burs and the rounding did not help. I made sure the rod was bottoming in the socket by measuring the depth of the socket (31 mm), installing the torsion bar and marking the depth on the bar, and measuring the distance from the mark, to the end of the bar (31 mm). So I'm confident the bar is going in the full distance. I don't believe the bar is bent as the bar slides fairly easily through each of the sockets. I need only top the end of the bar to install it in the socket.
I attached the pictures of the left-hand and right-hand bars installed. You can see the left-hand bar is close to what 72bluNblu had on his torsion bars. It's just that the right-hand side isn't that deep.
I've seen posts in other threads that mention grinding the end of the torsion bar the needed amount to get the needed clearance. Is that something that would work? I would likely take it from the socket end to keep the snap ring end true so the snap ring would still function correctly.

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The only other thing that comes to mind to me would be is the K-frame shifted back on the right side a little and that’s enough to cover the snap ring groove. Just a thought.
 
Yeah, I thought about the K-member as well. But, the hardware that secure the K-member to the frame are tapered near the head of the bolt to locate the member in the correct position. I tried loosening the hardware and pulling it forward, but it didn't move.
 
The socket is clean of grease. Just the surface film from applying it to the torsion bar. I've made sure the pivot and the bushing are fully pressed into the socket as well. I thought they might not be fully installed, but they will not budge and I believe they are fully seated.
I appreciate all of the input. Like I said before, I'm running out of ideas and am about to get the grinder out to resolve the issue. I'm open for any other thoguhts.

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Shewie! Check the stock length of them and grind a lil off if you have to. Do it slowly tho and dont over heat the metal. I had a 69 that smashed a curb and they cut the strut rod to correct it. Alignment was never right after that tho. The k member was the culprit. Changed that and the cut strut rod and realignment went
 
72bluNblu said:
Ah gotcha. Just wanted to make sure that was clear.

There was at least one other case on here of a torsion bar actually being too long, the forgings on these things were not always cut the same way on the hex ends. With the small difference in length that shouldn't be the cause, but it is something else to consider. But typically you can push the torsion bars a good 1/4" or more past the spring clip retainers before they bottom out, so the bar length doesn't have to be perfect.

A couple of pictures from my cars, you can see there's a good distance between the clip and the end of the bar. So if the clip won't go in it's not off by a little bit, it's off by over a 1/4" at least.

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I read this thread then grabbed mine off the shelf to clean yesterday wow mines the opposite the left side is over .200 to long. I won't know if this is going to be a problem yet until I start putting it back together and the reason why is because I did not have the Spring clips in place there was 2 Cotter pins hanging from 2 holes at the end of the frame where bars go through. I know there was lots of work done to this Car because when I bought it in 2012 it was a slant 6 car with a slant 6 K member And after looking at my vin numbers realizing that this car was actually a 273 v8 car from the factory .
No real question here just thought id share.
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Mysons68dart said:
I read this thread then grabbed mine off the shelf to clean yesterday wow mines the opposite the left side is over .200 to long. I won't know if this is going to be a problem yet until I start putting it back together and the reason why is because I did not have the Spring clips in place there was 2 Cotter pins hanging from 2 holes at the end of the frame where bars go through. I know there was lots of work done to this Car because when I bought it in 2012 it was a slant 6 car with a slant 6 K member And after looking at my vin numbers realizing that this car was actually a 273 v8 car from the factory .
No real question here just thought id share.
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Is the driver side bar 0.200 longer than the passenger side bar or is the bar 0.200 longer than the specified length of 35.8 inches for A-body torsion bars?
The left-hand bar being similar to my right-hand bar gives me a little more confidence in my plan to make my right-hand bar the same length and the left-hand bar. Since the distance between the rear mounts and LCA sockets is the same, I know the left-hand one fits correctly.
 
ElephantKiller said:
Is the driver side bar 0.200 longer than the passenger side bar or is the bar 0.200 longer than the specified length of 35.8 inches for A-body torsion bars?
The left-hand bar being similar to my right-hand bar gives me a little more confidence in my plan to make my right-hand bar the same length and the left-hand bar. Since the distance between the rear mounts and LCA sockets is the same, I know the left-hand one fits correctly.
Click to expand...
Yes my R is 35.8 and the L is longer so i to can grind it to the correct length if needed.
 
To update this thread, I was able to grind enough material from the front of the torsion bar to allow enough clearance to install the clip. The bar was still slightly longer than the left-hand torsion bar, so I more or less split the difference. Still don't understand how it installed originally, I'm moving on.
 
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