The life of a Magnum (and 46RE question)

[Lecki6]

How is the engine life on these engines, at what point is it not worth picking up for a project?
Lets assume we don't plan on doing any machining, just bolt in type mods.


I ask because there is one with about 185k miles I'm preparing to snag and I just want to be prepared for what lies ahead... [-X


To the transmission question: the 46RE, I believe is the 4x4 that this engine will come with. I've read about these being converted to 2wd, is this preferable or will going to a 904/727 be a better option?

 

[Abodybomber]

I had one handed to me,at 200k.. The bore cross hatch was perfect,so were the main/rod bearings.. A couple cam lobes were flat(yes ,they do on cast iron blanks...). Added horsepower sauce,it lives today..The big question: What is your goals,& what do you want it to do?

 

[67Dart273]

I can't enumerate the 46re 4x2 conversion, but this.......

the re will either need a Mopar ECU for control, and the wiring, or else rebuilt to "full manual" Also, a 46--series will NOT fit in an A body without serious floor and upper /and lower crossmember rework

 

[Lecki6]

Need a donor for a 72 Valiant 4 door, sleeper type project. Also my first endeavor into restoration (if you can call it that)

Alrighty, must have been something else I read somewhere about a conversion.
I see a 904 in my future!

 

[Abodybomber]

Need a donor for a 72 Valiant 4 door, sleeper type project. Also my first endeavor into restoration (if you can call it that)

Alrighty, must have been something else I read somewhere about a conversion.
I see a 904 in my future!

Agreed, keep it simple at start.. (Throw nothing away, if you have room...)...

 

[magnummopar]

If you swap out the OD housing and output shaft from 4x4 to 2wd they work great. The 46RE does require some "more than beginner" level of tunnel modification. I might put it under the bench and run the 904 to get her up and running quickly as I am a firm believer in Get em on the road quickly theory for beginners. You could do a bolt on Magnum FI swap in a few weekends in the driveway if you have a V8 904. You can always trade 46 for 42 later on which is much less work to install and plenty strong enough for street engine.

Plan on cracked heads and be happy if they are not.

Our typical shop build on one of these Magnums is EQ heads, our Stage II or III roller cam, Pro Gear timing set, freeze plugs and gaskets. Remember head, intake bolts are one use torque to yield and front cover bolts are usually corroded and should be replaced. Fortunately, head bolts are only $36 and intake is just 5/16 NC x2"

 

[YY1]

2000 Dakota R/T.

160,000 and still runs like it did when I got it with 30,000

I'd say average driving with occasional bouts of "extreme service" including cross state hauling and towing and foot to the floor episodes.

Valvoline syn blend oil change every appx 5000 miles.

Occasionally need to add 1/2 quart before 5K.

Trans has never had issues (I've heard the R/T trans is lees likely to have issues) other than a cold condition late 1/2 and sometimes 2/3 shift until warm.
Only on sub 50* mornings.

I'd not think twice about dropping a 150K plus magnum in a street car and driving the wheels off it.

 

[318willrun]

2001 Ram 2500 2wd 360 mag, almost 229,*** and still purrs like a kitten. Yep, I took it to test and tune (best 16.79 ). I took it to a digital scale, and it weighed 5,000 lbs on the dot with no tailgate and 1/4 tank of gas.

 

[SIX225]

1998 Durango 4X4, 5.2L with 290K, few water pumps, but valve covers never been off. Trans (42RE?) was done @179K and again @ 213K.

 

[player1up]

I've put about 20k miles on my mpfi 360 / 46re setup in the last couple of years and it's awesome. Dropped in a 60-70k mile 360 with just a tune-up. I did end up putting on the hughes engines lower plenum plate because it was using oil, but other than that, stock efi, stock ecu and it's enough to melt the 245/45's and gets way better mileage than the turbo /6.
Tunnel mods are some work, but not super complex if you plan it out. The actual trans support mount modification is harder IMHO ( to make it strong enough and actually line up with the trans mount pad )
I'd rather mod the tunnel than convert to carb.

I'd also not think twice about dropping in a 150k plus motor and running it, I just happened to find a low mile motor out of a wrecked truck.

 

[67Dart273]

If you swap out the OD housing and output shaft from 4x4 to 2wd they work great.

You guys make this sound real easy. Just where in hell do you FIND 4x2 housings and shafts, since there seems to have been "FAR" more 4x4s made that 4x2s?

 

[DionR]

I'd start with vans. Not sure they ever had a 4WD option when the Magnum motors and OD trans were in production. I see them show up at Pull and Save once in a while, I could pull one for you the next I am there with nothing to do. ;-)

 

[67Dart273]

I'd start with vans. Not sure they ever had a 4WD option when the Magnum motors and OD trans were in production. I see them show up at Pull and Save once in a while, I could pull one for you the next I am there with nothing to do. ;-)

Or if you find one drop me a line. I've got a 42R? out of a V6 But if you find one of those, then you won't need to change the tail LOL

 

[Infecteddog]

1998 Durango 4X4, 5.2L with 290K, few water pumps, but valve covers never been off. Trans (42RE?) was done @179K and again @ 213K.

4x4 5.2 would be 44RE. I've seen a few original motor Jeeps with over 370k.

I'd start with vans. Not sure they ever had a 4WD option when the Magnum motors and OD trans were in production. I see them show up at Pull and Save once in a while, I could pull one for you the next I am there with nothing to do. ;-)

Dodge never offered 4x4 vans- Ford did because they got wise that Pathfinder & similar companies were buying Ford spec Danas to put under every kind of van. Vans are a pretty good donor since many vans even had 3spd hydraulic transmissions which means you can use basically whatever transmission you choose. The van 32RHs (904/998), 42s and 44s all have low 1/2 gearsets and I think the better front pump setup than earlier 904s despite being lockup.

 

[67Dart273]

4x4 5.2 would be 44RE. I've seen a few original motor Jeeps with over 370k.


Dodge never offered 4x4 vans- Ford did because they got wise that Pathfinder & similar companies were buying Ford spec Danas to put under every kind of van. Vans are a pretty good donor since many vans even had 3spd hydraulic transmissions which means you can use basically whatever transmission you choose. The van 32RHs (904/998), 42s and 44s all have low 1/2 gearsets and I think the better front pump setup than earlier 904s despite being lockup.

Do you know when the vans went from rh to re? Same as pickups, or ??

 

[earthmover]

2002 ram 1500 4.7 249xxx lifter lost its prime jumped out the bore busted the head no warning at all Trans has been giving problems about 2yrs..in reverse it will pull then stop then pull again change both filters and fluid works ok for a week or so then same thing again. .as far as the lifter I did a search and man there are a lot of people that has the same problem. .pretty much same with trans..but that's just my story..

 

[magnummopar]

2002 ram 1500 4.7 249xxx lifter lost its prime jumped out the bore busted the head no warning at all Trans has been giving problems about 2yrs..in reverse it will pull then stop then pull again change both filters and fluid works ok for a week or so then same thing again. .as far as the lifter I did a search and man there are a lot of people that has the same problem. .pretty much same with trans..but that's just my story..

4.7 is a overhead cammed diamler/mercedes designed POS. That is the highest mile 4.7 I have ever heard of. They are not a comparison to the 5.2/5.9 magnum engines as they are complete junk and you cant put them in anything, nor would you want to. The trans is not a 42/44/46 RE/RH, its a 45RFE which takes its own pcm. They are only slightly more notorious for exploding than the 4.7. The 4.7 is famous for cams seizing in heads,cams breaking in half, cracking heads, they toss rods like angry toddler but at least they make a pathetic 200 hp and get 15 mpg unless you happened to be the unlucky bastard that got the Chrysler "death flash" then it was 10 mpg sitting in the drive way. Ask me how I know:banghead:

Comparing a 4.7 to a 5.2/5.9 is like comparing a turd to a cup cake. Oh, by the way, I dont really like 4.7's ....sorry for your loss.

 

[magnummopar]

Do you know when the vans went from rh to re? Same as pickups, or ??

Vans, rams, dakotas, durangos and grand cherokee switched same year.
OBD I is always RH 1995 older
OBD II is always RE 1996 newer
OBD I was fazed out due to increased EPA regs which mandated all vehicles upgrade to OBD II in 1996.Universal AL/DL(diagnostic) plug on every car , all makes, double O2 sensors, sealed EVAP can/gas caps and a much smarter computer capable of running auto trans.

We typically flash the second O2 and evap system out for A body swaps so it doesnt set a code for not having a cat or non sealed gas cap. One O2 makes it easier too.

The RE is controlled by the JTEC and JTEC+ PCM . If you want to use RH with OBD II JTEC you have to find manual trans pcm or get it flashed to remove auto trans code or it will set codes and go into "limp home mode".

If you want to find a 2wd od housing and output shaft, check with your local trans shop, they will probably have cores, they are more common than you think. Lots of 2wd daks and rams, durangos too.All vans. Many of my wrangler customers go 2wd to 4wd, feedback is $150-$200 cost to swap.

 

[magnummopar]

1998 Durango 4X4, 5.2L with 290K, few water pumps, but valve covers never been off. Trans (42RE?) was done @179K and again @ 213K.

If you get rid of 15# fan clutch and run electric they stop eating water pumps and you will pick up enough hp to scare you.

 

[Abodybomber]

4.7 is a overhead cammed diamler/mercedes designed POS. That is the highest mile 4.7 I have ever heard of. They are not a comparison to the 5.2/5.9 magnum engines as they are complete junk and you cant put them in anything, nor would you want to. The trans is not a 42/44/46 RE/RH, its a 45RFE which takes its own pcm. They are only slightly more notorious for exploding than the 4.7. The 4.7 is famous for cams seizing in heads,cams breaking in half, cracking heads, they toss rods like angry toddler but at least they make a pathetic 200 hp and get 15 mpg unless you happened to be the unlucky bastard that got the Chrysler "death flash" then it was 10 mpg sitting in the drive way. Ask me how I know:banghead:

Comparing a 4.7 to a 5.2/5.9 is like comparing a turd to a cup cake. Oh, by the way, I dont really like 4.7's ....sorry for your loss.

Agreed! I did retail auto parts,a damn long time. Anytime someone called for a reman 4.7, none of the rebuilders ever even had a rebuild able core. What a turd....

 

[Infecteddog]

4.7 is a overhead cammed diamler/mercedes designed POS. That is the highest mile 4.7 I have ever heard of. They are not a comparison to the 5.2/5.9 magnum engines as they are complete junk and you cant put them in anything, nor would you want to. The trans is not a 42/44/46 RE/RH, its a 45RFE which takes its own pcm. They are only slightly more notorious for exploding than the 4.7. The 4.7 is famous for cams seizing in heads,cams breaking in half, cracking heads, they toss rods like angry toddler but at least they make a pathetic 200 hp and get 15 mpg unless you happened to be the unlucky bastard that got the Chrysler "death flash" then it was 10 mpg sitting in the drive way. Ask me how I know:banghead:

Comparing a 4.7 to a 5.2/5.9 is like comparing a turd to a cup cake. Oh, by the way, I dont really like 4.7's ....sorry for your loss.

Really? They're often out here inexpensive with over 370k on them- it's driving all the value out of one to where even near perfect they just aren't worth much. A shade more power than a 5.2, not really much less than a 5.9. The lil 4x I've got with one gets over 18mpg out on the road- it's been over 21 on sustained road trip in the Summer with some sense. They give a bit less trouble than the Hemis which is still plenty. Aftermarket doesn't exist. I won't complain about one in a vehicle but I wouldn't be swapping one into anything except the slim possibility of something with a 4.7/5.7 that I couldn't be bothered to want to change the wiring on and didn't have to spend that much money on the swap.

Agreed! I did retail auto parts,a damn long time. Anytime someone called for a reman 4.7, none of the rebuilders ever even had a rebuild able core. What a turd....

A while back they were still selling for around $1000 as runners instead of the $250-600 of most Magnums.

Do you know when the vans went from rh to re? Same as pickups, or ??

Yes- far as I know all overdrive vans '96-up are OBD-II. But not all '96-up vans have overdrive. In 360s the latest I've seen was '99 for a 3spd van and apparently they are RH transmissions.

Vans, rams, dakotas, durangos and grand cherokee switched same year.
OBD I is always RH 1995 older
OBD II is always RE 1996 newer
OBD I was fazed out due to increased EPA regs which mandated all vehicles upgrade to OBD II in 1996.Universal AL/DL(diagnostic) plug on every car , all makes, double O2 sensors, sealed EVAP can/gas caps and a much smarter computer capable of running auto trans.

The RE is controlled by the JTEC and JTEC+ PCM . If you want to use RH with OBD II JTEC you have to find manual trans pcm or get it flashed to remove auto trans code or it will set codes and go into "limp home mode".

You've not seen 3spd vans before? Usually the ones I see are either 3.9s or 5.9s.

 

[Abodybomber]

Really? They're often out here inexpensive with over 370k on them- it's driving all the value out of one to where even near perfect they just aren't worth much. A shade more power than a 5.2, not really much less than a 5.9. The lil 4x I've got with one gets over 18mpg out on the road- it's been over 21 on sustained road trip in the Summer with some sense. They give a bit less trouble than the Hemis which is still plenty. Aftermarket doesn't exist. I won't complain about one in a vehicle but I wouldn't be swapping one into anything except the slim possibility of something with a 4.7/5.7 that I couldn't be bothered to want to change the wiring on and didn't have to spend that much money on the swap.


A while back they were still selling for around $1000 as runners instead of the $250-600 of most Magnums.


Yes- far as I know all overdrive vans '96-up are OBD-II. But not all '96-up vans have overdrive. In 360s the latest I've seen was '99 for a 3spd van and apparently they are RH transmissions.


You've not seen 3spd vans before? Usually the ones I see are either 3.9s or 5.9s.

You actually maintenance, by the book,my guess.. (That's a fantastic thing,more power..). That's the whole key,no one ever pays attention...

 

[YY1]

If you get rid of 15# fan clutch and run electric they stop eating water pumps and you will pick up enough hp to scare you.

Interesting.

That's been possibly the worst issue with mine.

I've been through about six idler pulleys, three H20 pumps and a radiator.

I attributed the pumps (and rad) failure to the poor design of the heater core height that traps water and turns it into system plugging rusty sludge.
...combined with the pressure on the pump shaft from the serp belt.

I still have a pinhole in my H/C that I'm not really thrilled about pulling the dash to fix.

Doesn't effect operation or pressure of system but smells a bit of coolant if heater is on. (BTW the heater SUCKS).

 

[magnummopar]

Really? They're often out here inexpensive with over 370k on them- it's driving all the value out of one to where even near perfect they just aren't worth much. A shade more power than a 5.2, not really much less than a 5.9. The lil 4x I've got with one gets over 18mpg out on the road- it's been over 21 on sustained road trip in the Summer with some sense. They give a bit less trouble than the Hemis which is still plenty. Aftermarket doesn't exist. I won't complain about one in a vehicle but I wouldn't be swapping one into anything except the slim possibility of something with a 4.7/5.7 that I couldn't be bothered to want to change the wiring on and didn't have to spend that much money on the swap.


A while back they were still selling for around $1000 as runners instead of the $250-600 of most Magnums.


Yes- far as I know all overdrive vans '96-up are OBD-II. But not all '96-up vans have overdrive. In 360s the latest I've seen was '99 for a 3spd van and apparently they are RH transmissions.


You've not seen 3spd vans before? Usually the ones I see are either 3.9s or 5.9s.

Besides the neon engine, the 4.7 is probably one of Chryslers biggest mistakes. we had a pile of them literally 3 blocks tall x 5 blocks wide piled behind the shop around 2004 or 5 , called it the wall of shame. You seem to be lucky, on the west coast, they bring $1500-$2000 for an almost blown 150K enigne.

The only thing better than seeing my 4.7 dak leaving on a rollback w smashed cab was my ex leaving for good. Both sounded pretty good but turned out to be the biggest POS I ever had to deal with. I drove that damn truck for 8 years because I couldnt bring myself to sell it to somebody because it was such a gas sucking turd from hell.

5.2 hp rated at 245, 4.7 hp supposedly 230(crap) . Put in cams, pcm flash, tb etc...still a pathetic turd. 5.2 stock will destroy a 4.7 even with all the mods I did.

ALL vehicles made in 1996 and later are OBD II, even Yugos. I have never seen a 3 speed anything with 5.2/5.9 in 20 years of taking them apart. I will admit, we avoid vans so not as many taken apart. I have never heard of any Chrysler V8 using a RH after 1995. Not saying its not possible for 3 speed, but I wouldnt believe it unless I saw one. How did you determine they were 3 speeds?

 

[itate]

Besides the neon engine, the 4.7 is probably one of Chryslers biggest mistakes.

Whats the problems with Neon engines? I thought the 2.7 with the sludge issues was one of their worse mistakes.