Today, dollar for dollar, is the 318 faster than the 340 ???

would you agree ?

  • yep, the 318 wins if buying and building for under 3k

    Votes: 48 41.7%

  • Nope, the 340 always has and always will beat the 318

    Votes: 57 49.6%

  • Actually, never thought about it like this... Good Point !

    Votes: 10 8.7%
  • Total voters
    115
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I get periods where money is no object but I also look for deals. Like alot of us here I have been scrounging parts for years, but when it gets close to finishing the car money spends quicker or should I say I get in a hurry when in a hurry things cost more. I always say if you want something done fast throw money at it. Now in a few years when Im retired? hopefully the car is "done" and I can keep it running with gas in it I may have to retrofit to 'electric" drivetrain Ill have a electric drivetrain with Sox and Martin hemi noise pumped through the bose speakers LOL!
 
318willrun said:
yes you may :) But between you and me, and everyone else.... Only "I" know my true intentions. And I say I was pointing out a "historic" moment in our Mopar History. A time that now at even 3k to spend, it may make more sense to build a 318. It was never meant to slam a 340, which I've owned, built, and loved.
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Honestly I don’t see anything historic about it. 340’s have always sold at a premium compared to other small blocks. Are deals harder to find now as opposed to years ago? Sure. It’s pretty simple, supply and demand. I gave away a 340 block last summer to a local guy that needed one. In the past people have been good to me and IMO it never hurts to repay it.

I don’t take the thread as a slam on 340’s. Hell I’ve already given my unwelcome two cents. Unless you already have a 340 a 360 is a much better base for a performance build. Even if you already have a 318 and have to pay $300 of your imposed $3000 budget. 318 are great engines there is no disputing that and I have no issues with someone build one if they want. But I’ll never recommend one as a base for a performance build.

Your mileage may vary.
 
I think the original parameters of the test were sufficiently narrow to produce responses in the desired direction, promoting 318 builds.
Thats a lousy way to do a scientific test..... but this is an opinion piece! It sure got lots of opinions.
Even though ive never built a small block, never had one except for the 273 i have now, i still find this thread very entertaining.
I seriously doubt i would build a 318 or a 340 for my 67 barracuda.
 
Dartswinger70 said:
I get periods where money is no object but I also look for deals. Like alot of us here I have been scrounging parts for years, but when it gets close to finishing the car money spends quicker or should I say I get in a hurry when in a hurry things cost more. I always say if you want something done fast throw money at it. Now in a few years when Im retired? hopefully the car is "done" and I can keep it running with gas in it I may have to retrofit to 'electric" drivetrain Ill have a electric drivetrain with Sox and Martin hemi noise pumped through the bose speakers LOL!
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I admit, I look for deals.....but I also look for JUNK I think I can make GOOD again. It's a sickness. I absolutely LOVE taking something someone else would have thrown away and making it good again. I always have.
 
33IMP said:
I think the original parameters of the test were sufficiently narrow to produce responses in the desired direction, promoting 318 builds.
Thats a lousy way to do a scientific test..... but this is an opinion piece! It sure got lots of opinions.
Even though ive never built a small block, never had one except for the 273 i have now, i still find this thread very entertaining.
I seriously doubt i would build a 318 or a 340 for my 67 barracuda.
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Well I don't know......I sorta thought so at first. But dammit, look at all the 318 hate it's brought out. No wonder he felt like he needed to slant it. LOL
 
RustyRatRod said:
I admit, I look for deals.....but I also look for JUNK I think I can make GOOD again. It's a sickness. I absolutely LOVE taking something someone else would have thrown away and making it good again. I always have.
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I just picked up a Federal style Power Steering pump from a parts car, and I am going to install the 6 dollar seal kit from Rock Auto, clean it and paint it and hope it works LOL!
 
33IMP said:
I think the original parameters of the test were sufficiently narrow to produce responses in the desired direction, promoting 318 builds.
Thats a lousy way to do a scientific test..... but this is an opinion piece! It sure got lots of opinions.
Even though ive never built a small block, never had one except for the 273 i have now, i still find this thread very entertaining.
I seriously doubt i would build a 318 or a 340 for my 67 barracuda.
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I agree about the original parameters. As I previously mentioned say someone scored a good condition stock 340 ,did some tuning nd pulled 340 HP on a dyno.

Can 318 guy pull the same HP? with the 3 grand. I think we've found out yes possibly but not with LA heads or at least that was my conclusion. And this is pure bench racing it would have to be played out for real on a dyno. 273 will run real good for you.
 
RustyRatRod said:
All I can say is, just once I'd like to see what it's like to "not worry" about what "budget" is. But I have to. With everything I do. S'why I'm listing stuff for sale now that I really don't want to sell. The ship has a hole in it.
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In around 2012 I started a fund for my 1978 Little Red's (Wife's truck) resto. I had a very good paying job and could afford to put $50 here, $150 there in the bucket. Times did get tough at times and some paydays I could not put a dime in the can.
Fast forward to April 2015. Coming home from work on my motorcycle I got hit by a flying tire that sent me into the concrete barrier at 70 MPH. This was not covered by my insurance due to it being a hit and run with no witness. 7 days in ICU and then 2 months of PT learning to walk upright again. My Co Pays and deductible ate my resto bucket plus a lot more. Dec that year at 59 years old I was forced into retirement, could not climb telephones anymore.
Living off a small pension and drawing off my IRA we made due till Social Security Disability finally came thru and I got a settlement check that put a smile on my face. Things are better but still on a tight budget and Property Taxes just went up to $9,800 a year.
My "Ship that came in" does have a big hole in it too. The only 'PLUG' is to sell my house and move somewhere I don't want to be, in a house sub standard to the one I'm in now. I just have to "Suck it up ButterCup".
 
Dave_J said:
In around 2012 I started a fund for my 1978 Little Red's (Wife's truck) resto. I had a very good paying job and could afford to put $50 here, $150 there in the bucket. Times did get tough at times and some paydays I could not put a dime in the can.
Fast forward to April 2015. Coming home from work on my motorcycle I got hit by a flying tire that sent me into the concrete barrier at 70 MPH. This was not covered by my insurance due to it being a hit and run with no witness. 7 days in ICU and then 2 months of PT learning to walk upright again. My Co Pays and deductible ate my resto bucket plus a lot more. Dec that year at 59 years old I was forced into retirement, could not climb telephones anymore.
Living off a small pension and drawing off my IRA we made due till Social Security Disability finally came thru and I got a settlement check that put a smile on my face. Things are better but still on a tight budget and Property Taxes just went up to $9,800 a year.
My "Ship that came in" does have a big hole in it too. The only 'PLUG' is to sell my house and move somewhere I don't want to be, in a house sub standard to the one I'm in now. I just have to "Suck it up ButterCup".
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Damn. Our stories are eerily similar. I don't know what would be a "sub standard" from a double wide. So our options are pretty limited. LOL
 
justinp61 said:
This thread was never intended as a “reasonable discussion”, he has got just exactly what he was looking for from the start. A lot of bickering and arguing. It was not about provoking thought or dialogue or opening anyone’s mind.

It was all about stirring the pot and he has done that job well.
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That's why he takes time and money to do builds that average guy can follow and documents them here and on youtube.

Like This one
$500 budget to make 318 Duster is fast as stock 73 340 Duster.

my Low dollar 318 hop-up project

There should be no bickering at all the 318 side says yes we agree a 340/360 is a better platform to start with but we feel a 318 does have a lot of potential if one choose to play with one. The bickering only comes cause the 340/360 feels cause they wouldn't bother with a 318 no one should and feel the need to tell us over and over and over again. It would be like us going on every 340/360 threads and going on and on about big blocks non stop. There's always more views on 273/318 threads cause more people have them and looking for ideas what to do to them, if you have a 340/360 it's already well documented what to do with them.
 
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To me this thread is asking with $3000 can you make a 318 as fast or faster then a stock refreshed 10.5:1 long block 340 with 750 xe285hl headers.
 
It will be 20hp less MAYBE! Than a 340. I can see a street able 318 magnum making 400hp on the street
 
273 said:
That's why he takes time and money to do builds that average guy can and documents them here and on youtube.

Like This one
$500 budget to make 318 Duster is fast as stock 73 340 Duster.

my Low dollar 318 hop-up project

There should be no bickering at all the 318 side says yes we agree a 340/360 is a better platform to start with but we feel a 318 does have a lot of potential if one choose to play with one. The bickering only comes cause the 340/360 feels cause they wouldn't bother with a 318 no one should and feel the need to tell us over and over and over again. It would be like us going on every 340/360 threads and going on and on about big blocks non stop. There's always more views on 273/318 threads cause more people have them and looking for ideas what to do to them, if you have a 340/360 it's already well documented what to do with them.
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Like I’ve already mentioned I’m not a 318 hater, I just wouldn’t use one or recommend one as a base for a performance build.

This has all been hypothetical so I have a hypothetical question. Your a young aspiring gear head, you’ve worked and saved your money for a project. You find a Dart/Valiant/Duster/Scamp with a very tired 318, cheap. After buying it you have $3000 left over to rebuild you engine. Now you find an equally tired complete 360 for $100 (and yes I know where there is one right now for that much). Assume both engines need to be bored and a complete rebuild.

Which engine would you build?

No hate or innuendo intended.

I know what I’d do, I’d buy a junkyard ls, stuff it in a fox body and try to beat it to death. LOL
 
justinp61 said:
Like I’ve already mentioned I’m not a 318 hater, I just wouldn’t use one or recommend one as a base for a performance build.

This has all been hypothetical so I have a hypothetical question. Your a young aspiring gear head, you’ve worked and saved your money for a project. You find a Dart/Valiant/Duster/Scamp with a very tired 318, cheap. After buying it you have $3000 left over to rebuild you engine. Now you find an equally tired complete 360 for $100 (and yes I know where there is one right now for that much). Assume both engines need to be bored and a complete rebuild.

Which engine would you build?

No hate or innuendo intended.

I know what I’d do, I’d buy a junkyard ls, stuff it in a fox body and try to beat it to death. LOL
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With your hypothetical question I'd say go 360 but if the guy still wanted to do the 318 for whatever reason as long he knew the pros and cons on his decision, I would try to help with the 318 build even if it made no sense to me like a 450-550 hp build, personally around 450-500hp plus people should seriously be thinking big block. But I rarely see someone building a 318 looking for more than 300-350 hp not a huge deal out of a 318 yes a 360 could do it cheaper and more streetable each to their own. Some want a hot street engine with some rumble but are not looking to build high hp eg.. A stock magnum makes 300 hp at 4500 rpm but maybe some wants around 300 hp but in a more radical engine aka a 300 hp at 6000 rpm like a 273 would, depending on the car and use I could see using either. Daily cruiser 5.9l, Lightened early A body 4 speed road racer type car I want the 273 type engine probably with another 50 hp and peak at 500 more rpm..
 
justinp61 said:
Like I’ve already mentioned I’m not a 318 hater, I just wouldn’t use one or recommend one as a base for a performance build.

This has all been hypothetical so I have a hypothetical question. Your a young aspiring gear head, you’ve worked and saved your money for a project. You find a Dart/Valiant/Duster/Scamp with a very tired 318, cheap. After buying it you have $3000 left over to rebuild you engine. Now you find an equally tired complete 360 for $100 (and yes I know where there is one right now for that much). Assume both engines need to be bored and a complete rebuild.

Which engine would you build?

No hate or innuendo intended.

I know what I’d do, I’d buy a junkyard ls, stuff it in a fox body and try to beat it to death. LOL
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we bought a 5.9 mag "suppose to run good, 198,*** miles" for a 150 bucks. We sold the manifolds, wiring, and stuff to pay for the purchase. Now we have a free 5.9. It's getting hughes valve spring kit, Oregon Cam Grind, new timing set, 135 dollar speedmaster intake and carb that's on top of the 318 in DT. We are not pulling the pan, but we primed the oil and it held 75 psi cold. Because I already had a set of Odessa replacement magnum heads (I bought for cheap), we put these on. They weren't needed, but just because we had them. This will AGAIN be a bottom of the barrel budget build that we plan to beat on.....
 
RustyRatRod said:
Well then I guess I need to go out and break it to Vixen that she's all smoke and mirrors and fakery. I built her on less than a 1985 budget, so I guess she doesn't count.
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If it makes you happy that’s all that counts. Again, as someone else posted 318WR started this thread to make himself look smart, not to have a discussion about a platform and what it really costs do build a street engine. Let’s face it. This stuff is all 40-50 or more years old. The decks aren’t flat. The main line is marginal at best. The bores are straight or round. You can eat up 2k just in machine work for the engine. And that’s not buying a part. I never build an engine where the block doesn’t get at least a surface. I’d rather square deck it. No one on here would buy core heads and not surface them, but they do that with blocks. Cheap and smart aren’t close friends. As I said before, I don’t have an issue with a budget. I have an issue with threads like this where someone puts constraints on a build most reasonable people would never consider. One guy wants to keep his 3k budget but run a roller cam set up. That’s 1200 bucks right there. That shoots a 3k budget right in the wallet. At least let’s be reasonable about the costs.
 
jammied said:
A good solid built 318 will out run a middle of the road 340
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And that’s not a 3k budget. Sorry. And of the 340 has the same parts, then what. I don’t hate the 318. What I don’t like is hypothetical nonsense and the defenders of broke assed budgets. I get it. I read Dave’s post at 1008. That makes sense for him to be on a budget and make it work. Or a 17 year old just starting out. But come on, if you are broke your whole life you are doing something wrong.
 
Well first off it doesn't cost $1200 for a roller cam setup in a magnum or a 340. You can easily build a good bottom end for around $1200. Nothing cheating out here it is what it is. Then get some magnum heads get a touch up on the valves. And pick a cam around $300. Nothing el'cheapo about it that's what it costs. So guess I'm trying to figure out why you think it cost $5000 to build a worthy engine?

Heck go get a reman magnum short block and throw a cam in it
 
But if you buy a 340 block these. Days you just have to take what you can get for$1000 core shift already bored and all. 318 you can still pick and choose good blocks .

Dollar for dollar 318
 
448Scamp said:
If it makes you happy that’s all that counts. Again, as someone else posted 318WR started this thread to make himself look smart, not to have a discussion about a platform and what it really costs do build a street engine. Let’s face it. This stuff is all 40-50 or more years old. The decks aren’t flat. The main line is marginal at best. The bores are straight or round. You can eat up 2k just in machine work for the engine. And that’s not buying a part. I never build an engine where the block doesn’t get at least a surface. I’d rather square deck it. No one on here would buy core heads and not surface them, but they do that with blocks. Cheap and smart aren’t close friends. As I said before, I don’t have an issue with a budget. I have an issue with threads like this where someone puts constraints on a build most reasonable people would never consider. One guy wants to keep his 3k budget but run a roller cam set up. That’s 1200 bucks right there. That shoots a 3k budget right in the wallet. At least let’s be reasonable about the costs.
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The roller cam and lifters eat up most of your 1200 dollar estimate alone. Add in the good sprAngs and rockers and then where are we? 2K. Oh don't forget the high dollar timing set "all that" needs too. It's not a cheap hobby. People who try to do it too cheaply, usually pay twice as much.
 
Flat tappet cams have gotten the job done for decades. Roller LA's are not too hard to find and are plenty cheap. If I go roller, I go roller from the factory meaning later LA or Magnum. That takes a bite out of crime... I mean the cost... LOL
 
When all of the tight a$$ people decide to step out of poverty they will start building aluminum block Hemi's . Otherwise they are just being cheapo budget people. Nothing less then a $40,000 engine is worthy
 
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