273 adjustable rockers need refurbish.
- Thread starter MOA
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j par
Well-hung Member
Well like I said I do have 273 rockers for sale here on the Forum they are banana grooved, they are all set up with aftermarket adjusters, they are back ground in case you have larger valve springs. And I'm throwing in a small set of Hughes spacers to get the spacing perfect. These are stored in the bubble wrap and box I got my Hughes rockers in. These were performing perfect on my Stroker motor and I really don't want to sell them that's why I have them at that price.
Now with that said I wouldn't use them in your application I would just put hydraulic rockers on there and call it good. And I'm assuming this is going in a 66 or earlier a body and that's the reason for these Doug's headers because they certainly aren't going to do any better than cheap headers unless it's a fitment issue.
Now with that said I wouldn't use them in your application I would just put hydraulic rockers on there and call it good. And I'm assuming this is going in a 66 or earlier a body and that's the reason for these Doug's headers because they certainly aren't going to do any better than cheap headers unless it's a fitment issue.
j par
Well-hung Member
To me it's kind of a waste of the Adjustable rockers using a hydraulic Cam and hydraulic lifters.
Maybe so, but I'm not chasing the pushrod length rabbit any longer.
I could get all new stamped rockers and shafts, and try it, no guarantee it will be right. Adjustable shortens the journey.
Plus, if I decide to change out to a solid lifter cam,I'm good to go.
Not if you are running the Rhoades Vmax lifters, that's how you get the most out of them...
j par
Well-hung Member
Is he running Vmax lifters? If not, what does this have to do with the price of tea in China ?
SLOPAR72
Well-Known Member
No sense in getting in the fight over adjustable or non adjustable for certain applications however I have set of Crane Gold 1.6's with hardened shafts that are gonna hit the market pretty soon since I changed a few things on my car
or I too have a set like j par but it sounds like his will be nicer than mine...
Good luck with your build and send me a PM if there is any interest....
JW
j par
Well-hung Member
New cam, new lifters, new (stock size?) Ball-Ball pushrods, and valve stems level installed.
Me personally (from my experience), I'd get new shafts and run it.
When you really want to step up to the proformance plate, you're going to need parts that will withstand power adders if you're going to stay with the 318.
Me personally (from my experience), I'd get new shafts and run it.
When you really want to step up to the proformance plate, you're going to need parts that will withstand power adders if you're going to stay with the 318.
Comp cams 822-16 lifters, high energy.
The plan was and still is to get the car on the road, 72 dart swinger, original engine, 904 trans done by pro trans, 2200 stall. Lower ratio planetary, 8-3/4 355 Sure grip.
I just don't have the coin to spend on a high hp build. It should be fun to drive until I can build another engine. I have a 97 360 magnum out of my truck that I plan to use for 500+. Its only money, right?
I planned on doing a freshen up and that didn't pan out, I was already heavily invested in the 318, I'd like to get this thing on the road.
Self imposed due date is October 31st,it will be close to get it done by then.
Rocker arms are next on the hit list.
The plan was and still is to get the car on the road, 72 dart swinger, original engine, 904 trans done by pro trans, 2200 stall. Lower ratio planetary, 8-3/4 355 Sure grip.
I just don't have the coin to spend on a high hp build. It should be fun to drive until I can build another engine. I have a 97 360 magnum out of my truck that I plan to use for 500+. Its only money, right?
I planned on doing a freshen up and that didn't pan out, I was already heavily invested in the 318, I'd like to get this thing on the road.
Self imposed due date is October 31st,it will be close to get it done by then.
Rocker arms are next on the hit list.
He stated that they are a waste of time, I was giving a case where they aren't...
j par
Well-hung Member
Okay then perfect yes you will not see the difference getting adjustable rockers at this point. And when you do go for that big 500 horsepower Plus application you want some custom roller rockers anyways.
You're pretty close to my first 318 combination same gears but I had a four-speed. I was able to get it down to about a 13-7 at the track which is pretty much what the Hemi Challengers are doing these days had at the track. And yes that was with a cam about the same size and just regular non adjustable hydraulic rockers. I really don't feel you're going to see any kind of performance gain whatsoever. Not worth the money especially when you have to get custom pushrods.
You're pretty close to my first 318 combination same gears but I had a four-speed. I was able to get it down to about a 13-7 at the track which is pretty much what the Hemi Challengers are doing these days had at the track. And yes that was with a cam about the same size and just regular non adjustable hydraulic rockers. I really don't feel you're going to see any kind of performance gain whatsoever. Not worth the money especially when you have to get custom pushrods.
j par
Well-hung Member
^^^^ a funny side note, the best bang for my buck on that motor at the time was the Craigslist Mickey Thompson Street ET I bought used and some rims from the junkyard. I had about 150 bucks into that and that actually took a half second off my time at the track. Don't forget about getting all this newfound power down to the ground....
That stuff you can do to get it down to the 12 second Arena. Once you get below that then everything cost thousands per half second loss at the drag strip.
That stuff you can do to get it down to the 12 second Arena. Once you get below that then everything cost thousands per half second loss at the drag strip.
j par
Well-hung Member
Well the real biggest thing I see you're doing correct here is the 355 gears that's going to help the 318 be fun.
If you can keep with the non adjustable rockers I would it just going to make things simpler cheaper and anything you do to change that is definitely not going to get you any bang for the buck. Buy it a $400 nitrous kit if you want to go Crazy.
If you can keep with the non adjustable rockers I would it just going to make things simpler cheaper and anything you do to change that is definitely not going to get you any bang for the buck. Buy it a $400 nitrous kit if you want to go Crazy.
Quoted by whom? Gary at Rocker Arms unlimited? If so, send them to him. It's a no brainer. He is a legend genius and what you'll get back will be better and stronger and nicer than anything in that price range.
No one gives the stock ductile rocker credit, but they are STRONG. I wouldn't be afraid of a .650 lift solid roller on some properly prepared and if Gary is doing them, they WILL be properly prepared. If that quote was not Gary, call him and send them to him. He KNOWS his stuff.
No one gives the stock ductile rocker credit, but they are STRONG. I wouldn't be afraid of a .650 lift solid roller on some properly prepared and if Gary is doing them, they WILL be properly prepared. If that quote was not Gary, call him and send them to him. He KNOWS his stuff.
T56MaxTorq
Well-Known Member
I say run them how they are. Who gives a **** about galling on a set of 273 rockers? Nobody. I ran a set that were TORE up, deep grooves in the bore. Emery cloth around a socket works to clean them up. I measured lift at the valve and they were inconsistent to .015 lift. With mopar small block geometry, I lost .030 total lift.
I don't think you're going to be able to tell the difference from rocker to rocker of the same ratio. If anything, I would have the rocker tip resurfaced if you can. Longevity will suffer with the adjusters at different adjustments. But that would effect new rockers too. Even more reason to run what you have.
I don't think you're going to be able to tell the difference from rocker to rocker of the same ratio. If anything, I would have the rocker tip resurfaced if you can. Longevity will suffer with the adjusters at different adjustments. But that would effect new rockers too. Even more reason to run what you have.
j par
Well-hung Member
At this power level and lift you think he should "call someone" or just run some stock stamps ? Personally, I think this is getting over thought...
dibbons
Well-Known Member
I would just like to comment on how I prefer the 273 factory jam type adjusters, just turn 'em and leave 'em. The lock-nut type are a pain in comparison. I used the jam type with a .580 lift camshaft back in the 1970's and never had a problem. That's my experience anyway.
j par
Well-hung Member
Back in the seventies the jam nuts were less than 10 years old and still probably worked. Now the jam nuts are over 50 years old and they're getting a little war out and they're not jamming anymore! That's why you have to go to the aftermarket, they work and hold 10 times better anyways. My experience is that the set that I have now would not hold the Jam at about three of them. I was not going to let a $6,000 stroker go down tubes because I didn't want to buy $50 lock nuts....
Yes, Gary, super nice guy.
After reading everyone's opinion on this, I may just buy new non adjustable and bolt em on.
The preload being all over the place (from zero to as much .080) didn't inspire confidence in the non adjustable system dodge uses.
Checking the preload isn't a fun job either. I used welding tip cleaners to find preload,not easy to get the wire in there, rotate engine 90 deg, do it again, come up with head scratching numbers.......
After reading everyone's opinion on this, I may just buy new non adjustable and bolt em on.
The preload being all over the place (from zero to as much .080) didn't inspire confidence in the non adjustable system dodge uses.
Checking the preload isn't a fun job either. I used welding tip cleaners to find preload,not easy to get the wire in there, rotate engine 90 deg, do it again, come up with head scratching numbers.......
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j par
Well-hung Member
Yes I just bolted a 318 together recently with some 360 heads that were shaved .050 and about it 450 lift cam and I just slapped it all together and I wasn't happy with the tension on the pushrods at all, but all in all it's actually running extremely well. Remember I do have that set of adjustable rockers I could have put on there but it would have just been a waste of some good rockers. I had two sets of non adjustables and just went with the best-looking set. Like my ad says no big deal if I don't sell those I'm sure I'll have a motor worthy of putting them on one day.
Also with those adjustable rockers they really should be adjusted almost all the way in. I can't imagine what having some adjusted out and some adjusted in a significant amount would throw off geometry even worse than it already is likely that and the more you adjust them out the more you open yourself up to one snapping off and I've seen that happen here on the forum.
Also with those adjustable rockers they really should be adjusted almost all the way in. I can't imagine what having some adjusted out and some adjusted in a significant amount would throw off geometry even worse than it already is likely that and the more you adjust them out the more you open yourself up to one snapping off and I've seen that happen here on the forum.
j par
Well-hung Member
Likely you have some thick assembly Lube down there that could be sticking the lifters just a little bit or spacing the lifters just a little bit off the cam. When when I say sticking I mean in a gooey tacky sticky kind of assembly Lube way, not jamming up?
What I found that I didn't like: three were at zero preload, the retainer wouldn't last long. One was .080 preload. .020 too much. With the valve moving up in the head over time that only gets worse.
With the new pistons, I don't want to rotate it any more than I have to without oil pressure/lube. Having to check and recheck the pre load has me rotating the engine more than I would like.
If I go with non adjustable and they're all over the place again,I guess I'll just take the heads off again and take them back to the shop that rebuilt them, make them get it right.
Getting different length pushrods for every valve is ridiculous.
I can't just slap them on there and hope they're right.
With the new pistons, I don't want to rotate it any more than I have to without oil pressure/lube. Having to check and recheck the pre load has me rotating the engine more than I would like.
If I go with non adjustable and they're all over the place again,I guess I'll just take the heads off again and take them back to the shop that rebuilt them, make them get it right.
Getting different length pushrods for every valve is ridiculous.
I can't just slap them on there and hope they're right.
j par
Well-hung Member
And we're sure this is a case where the lifters haven't been pumped up yet or something? I'm certainly not telling you to slap it all together and hope for the best! That's just something I did on a cheap $50 Craigslist motor. LOL I remember you saying something about the Machine Shop being in business for a long time? And you're contemplating taking them back for a second time? I wonder if this is how they been business so long ? LOL what I can't get over is how you have a brand new cam with a stock base Circle brand new lifters that should all be the same brand new pushrods that should all be stock length and you can lay a ruler across the tops of your valve stems ? I'm just not seeing a reason for there being 3 or 4 different Rod lenths ?
="MOA, post: 1971739863, member: 45258"]What I found that I didn't like: three were at zero preload, the retainer wouldn't last long. One was .080 preload. .020 too much. With the valve moving up in the head over time that only gets worse.
With the new pistons, I don't want to rotate it any more than I have to without oil pressure/lube. Having to check and recheck the pre load has me rotating the engine more than I would like.
If I go with non adjustable and they're all over the place again,I guess I'll just take the heads off again and take them back to the shop that rebuilt them, make them get it right.
Getting different length pushrods for every valve is ridiculous.
I can't just slap them on there and hope they're right.[/QUOTE]
="MOA, post: 1971739863, member: 45258"]What I found that I didn't like: three were at zero preload, the retainer wouldn't last long. One was .080 preload. .020 too much. With the valve moving up in the head over time that only gets worse.
With the new pistons, I don't want to rotate it any more than I have to without oil pressure/lube. Having to check and recheck the pre load has me rotating the engine more than I would like.
If I go with non adjustable and they're all over the place again,I guess I'll just take the heads off again and take them back to the shop that rebuilt them, make them get it right.
Getting different length pushrods for every valve is ridiculous.
I can't just slap them on there and hope they're right.[/QUOTE]
nm9stheham
Well-Known Member
Hmmmm that IS all over the place. Either the pushrods or the rockers are variable. BTW, I would kinda expect to find some .080" ones from time to time..... the overall piston compression is typically about .120" and I would expect the factory to put them around .060" (mid-range) and it vary +/- around that. It is the zero ones that are the issue. And as things wear, the preload may well get smaller; the rockers and shafts and valve tips wear.
Have you put all the pushrods in a go/no-go gauge made by setting up a couple of stops on a trough that you can drop the p-rods into one at a time and see the variations?
And could it just be that you are not quite on the heel of the lobe when you found the .080" one(s)?
As for the prelube on the lobes, if you are using a moly paste, I would not worry about it so much. One turn of the camhsaft, either by hand or cranking, and it is all piled up under the face of the lifter and gets slowly fed into the gap under the lifter's curve. See here:
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