273 upgrade to 4bbl?

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Thank you everyone for the imputs! Keep them coming!

I know how to build FAST cars, I just don't need this one to be fast. All I want is a little more pep for a daily cruiser. I have just never had a 273 before. I have had some pretty bad 500" Mopar!

My 70 Belvedere 4-door 225 "3-on the tree" feels more responsive than the Dart (probably my imagination, but may be the stick shift)

I also have a 70 GTX 440 car that I am finishing up for when I feel like going faster.

I do have a background/job in race cars. I am crew chief for a 5 car NHRA drag race team. We run 3 SuperComp and 2 TopDragster. (6.10@234mph - 3.88 1/8 mile)

This Dart is currently just a nearly perfect car for me to use regularly as a driver. Nice enough to get looks, but not so nice I am afraid to drive it daily.

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Well ya, it's like a teen. How much can you do without building a performance specific engine. With a 273, a 4 barrel will help. so will a distributor curve. (probably the biggest improvement for the lowest dollar invested) A HP single exhaust or a dual system will help. A steeper rear gear won't add horsepower but it will make it spunkier or faster. We all know the next step with the hipo pistons, bigger cam, ported heads, and high stall converter. This has been discussed to death.
Exactly! All ready has an aftermarket electronic distributor and dual exhaust (stock manifolds). And I have a buddy upgrading his Hellcat 68 Dart to a 9" rear, so I am working out a deal to get the 8-3/4.
 
Best bang for the buck, off the line, is a higher stall convertor.
Hands down on a low-compression tiny-cammed engine, it will beat a 4bbl every time.
Second best, is to mod the trans or the linkage, whatever it takes, so it will actually allow the engine to wind up to where the power is.
Third best; is gears, that will allow your handicapped engine to get to shift rpm quicker. and
Fourth; is more intake airflow, which will almost invariably also require more exhaust flow, so you kindof need to do those together.

If you're planning ONLY a 4bbl upgrade, do your self a favor and
FIRST
do some TIMED first-gear speed runs to whatever mph you would like to see an improvement in. then do the swap, then repeat the tests. It is all too easy to be fooled by the 4bbl sound, into thinking your car is so much faster, when in reality, it is only sounding like it.
Then, later, when you figure out that the 4bbl with factory stall/hiway gearing, is almost no quicker in any first gear speed contest nor even below about 50 mph; and you decide to put a 2800 convertor in it, repeat the tests again. After you get thru that, disable the secondaries and repeat the test again.
now you have some data to process; and not some seat of the pants bs.

How does it work?
Well lets say your 2bbl-273 is able to muster a whopping 150 hp at 4000 rpm and let's say at a stall of 2000, the power is just 50. I chose these numbers cuz I can do the math in my head. and so can you, so you can follow along.
Ok so let's say the power is linear. Thus, the power of this 2bbl engine will be, from 50 to 150= 100 hp over 2000 rpm = 5hp per 100 rpm. So then you can predict the power increase at any rpm. At 2800, we can predict an increase of 8 x 5=40 hp; woohoo! that's almost double.

Let's compare that to the 4bbl, with no other changes.
At 2000 rpm, your 2bbl is still adequately sized, so the 4 bbl even WFO will get you zero hp. even at 2800 that stinking 4bbl carb is barely adding any power. Let's be generous and say that at the power peak, it generates IDK say 20 hp, and at 2000 zero. so we can predict 1hp per 100 rpm. So then, when you take off, with the 4bbl screaming, at a stall of 2000 rpm, if it doesn't bog, you will be taking off at par with the 2bbl. If yur lucky, that 4bbl will add 1 hp per 100 rpm so by 4000, yur looking at plus 20 hp.
Sounds great right. Well , yes and no.
If you have 2.76 gears, then 4000 rpm will be about 40 mph. When the trans shifts, the rpm will drop to about 59%= 2360 which will be 3.6 hp over 50=53.6 hp, and that's that.
If you have 3.23 gears, then 4000 will be about 34mph, and again, on the shift, the Rs will fall to 2360, and again adding just 3.6 hp.

But; no matter what gear you have in it, if you have a 2800 stall, then; when it shifts at 4000, the Rs are not likely to fall below 2800,
which is (5hp x 8) plus the base50 =90 hp.
Now, 90/53.6= 1.68,
so,
with the 2800 convertor, your 273 is likely to send 68% more hp into the driveshaft at every take off .
a 4bbl can't touch this.
Now recall that, the numbers I chose, were for ease of calculating and ease of understanding and may not reflect your engine at all; nor do I know what gearing you currently have. But;
the principle is still the same.
Happy HotRodding
 
I agree. AND i think the port mismatch is not as big of an issue as most make it out to be.
The factory put the large port four barrel manifold on the small head 318 engines from 78 up.
It worked OK although not totally optimal.
It is that particular set up on my 318 Stock Eliminator Aspen O/SA Wagon that set the National Record
in the 11s and I would not worry about it very much on a street car.
 
I would say port mismatch depends on the intake flange where gasket sits. If gasket isn't supported well....
 
The other way would be worse in my minds eye. More turbulence. Big to small will just shear. We had a big discussion about this already. Maybe a moderator can link that discussion.
 
The factory put the large port four barrel manifold on the small head 318 engines from 78 up.
It worked OK although not totally optimal.
It is that particular set up on my 318 Stock Eliminator Aspen O/SA Wagon that set the National Record
in the 11s and I would not worry about it very much on a street car.
GTX John...did you have a car at Indy this year?
 
No Sir but we had four Stock/SS cars at the World finals.

Maybe next year we will get there again if my 75 year old health permits. My son has a pair of
one year old twins that were Premature and just could not find time to get away from them.
Last time we went we smoked the Z28/Mustang GTs/Pontiac 400s
to win class in the Wagon and surprised a few folks. Jon also got down to last 6 in eliminator
beating several factory stock cars before losing a close race to Peter Biondo.

We did have a great year despite have to miss a lot of races due to Family responsibilities.

God is so very Good to Us = All the time!!
 
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I like the idea of FAST . It will never hit my area or could I ever compete but I dig the competition
 
Not really, It doesn't hurt but it sure doesn't help.
While I agree that Chrysler did it with millions of 318s, my thinking on it is on the 273, it might make more of a difference with the small cubes. Kinda like a slant 6, they need all the help they can get. Not that they cannot make power, but everything needs to be "more right" so to speak. Then again, I could be slap wrong. I know if I was building one, I wouldn't want the big port intake on the small port heads. Obviously, on the factory stock 318 it wasn't an issue, but I'm thinking on a performance oriented 273, it could be a spot for reversion.
 
big inlet to small ports has a step that causes more problems than small manifold onto big ports
both cause a disruption to flow.
but the former is caused by the hard step and turbulence caused and the latter is caused by the gas stalling due to change in pressure when moving from the smaller tube to the bigger

if you can be bothered filling the manifold with JB weld or some such from the gasket face back and then blending it to the size of the 273 gasket, would give an excellent taper that smooths the path and increases gas speed into the port in the head.
I think that would keep the speed up and have a positive effect or torque at some of the rpms where it would be robbed by the mismatch.

Dave
 
find a 67 hipo 273 commando engine for parts. That will give you the cam, pistons, 4bbl carb and intake, dual point distributor. Probably about a 60HP gain for pennies on the dollar. Then put it on the bottle! LOL Thats a sharp Dart even in the daylight photo good find.
 
No Sir but we had four Stock/SS cars at the World finals.

Maybe next year we will get there again if my 75 year old health permits. My son has a pair of
one year old twins that were Premature and just could not find time to get away from them.
Last time we went we smoked the Z28/Mustang GTs/Pontiac 400s
to win class in the Wagon and surprised a few folks. Jon also got down to last 6 in eliminator
beating several factory stock cars before losing a close race to Peter Biondo.

We did have a great year despite have to miss a lot of races due to Family responsibilities.

God is so very Good to Us = All the time!!
I am pretty sure I have seen the Wagon. I worked a bit with Southland Dodge when they had 5 Challenger drag packs, and now I am with Laris Motorsports Insurance as thier crew chief.

This year we attended 5 National events and had a car in the final at all 5!

So....you do you have your race cars insured with! Lol
 
I believe the Edelbrock LD4B has the smaller ports and is a fine intake that will work for you.
 
I know if I was building one, I wouldn't want the big port intake on the small port heads. Obviously, on the factory stock 318 it wasn't an issue, but I'm thinking on a performance oriented 273, it could be a spot for reversion.
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I remember reading threads here with spirited discussions about port mismatch. I don't remember seeing time slips or dyno sheets though to prove or disprove the theory. I think it's more of a "doing it right" thing. Will it run ok with a mis match? Yes Will it run better with port matching? Probably. Will that difference be notable on a dyno, at the track, or the seat of your pants? May be.
 
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I remember reading threads here with spirited discussions about port mismatch. I don't remember seeing time slips or dyno sheets though to prove or disprove the theory. I think it's more of a "doing it right" thing. Will it run ok with a mis match? Yes Will it run better with port matching? Probably. Will that difference be notable on a dyno, at the track, or the seat of your pants? May be.
Well, why do porters port match intakes to heads? hmmmmmmm lol
 
Thank you everyone for the imputs! Keep them coming!

I know how to build FAST cars, I just don't need this one to be fast. All I want is a little more pep for a daily cruiser. I have just never had a 273 before. I have had some pretty bad 500" Mopar!

My 70 Belvedere 4-door 225 "3-on the tree" feels more responsive than the Dart (probably my imagination, but may be the stick shift)

I also have a 70 GTX 440 car that I am finishing up for when I feel like going faster.

I do have a background/job in race cars. I am crew chief for a 5 car NHRA drag race team. We run 3 SuperComp and 2 TopDragster. (6.10@234mph - 3.88 1/8 mile)

This Dart is currently just a nearly perfect car for me to use regularly as a driver. Nice enough to get looks, but not so nice I am afraid to drive it daily.

View attachment 1716171315

View attachment 1716171316
Put one of those motors in the car and call it a day.
 
If you add the 4 bbl and crank the timing ahead some Those 2 things will help your preformance
 
I have a 67 barracuda and put a cast iron 4bbl. spread bore on it with a quadrajet. The combo works great & you can easily change jet size for best performance. I had to get lil. creative for kickdown linkage.
 
@BPTracing I just bought one of those intakes like you posted the pic of in post # 7. It's a nice intake and it has the small ports. You can't beat em for the price! Next best choice would be an Edelbrock Performer, but I would find a used one if you have time to wait on one to pop up. You'll have to re-engineer the transmission kickdown linkage no matter what you use...or run a Lokar cable. Good luck to you.
 
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