318 Won't Start

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tuckinauster

tuckinauster

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First a little back story.

I took my '73 Swinger out of storage a few weeks ago and everything was good. It started fine after sitting for 6+ months, and made the hour and a half drive home with no issues.

The other day, I took it out to run some errands and out of nowhere it lost power and died. I was stopped, waiting to turn into a parking lot when it cut out. When I attempted to re-start it, the engine seemed to be cranking faster than normal, and it didn't sound right at all. The engine is turning over when the starter is engaged

When I finally got it home (thanks to friends with a flat bed) I pulled a spark plug and checked for spark. There was spark, and it seemed adequate. The carb is working as it should, and the car is getting fuel. Also, the distributor cap/rotor, spark plugs/wires, the coil and resistor are all fairly new.

Right now I'm lost. It still doesn't sound right while cranking and doesn't even attempt to fire. Below, I've attached a video so you guys can hear what it sounds like. I'm all ears to any suggestions.


[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l04VH9IxAqQ"]Broken Dart - YouTube[/ame]
 
Sounds like your lacking compression. Whats the condition of the oil and coolant? Have you checked for vacuum leaks and is your timing correct as in did the distributor get moved?
 
Get a timing light. Check the timing while cranking. Alternatively, Wrench the engine up to the timing marks, and if you know "where the timing was set" bring the marks up to that. If not, bring them up to say, 5 or 10 BTC. Open the cap after marking the dist. under the no1 plug wire tower. Look and see, the rotor should just be approaching the mark, and the points should just be open, or if electronic, the reluctor tip should be aligned with the center of the pickup coil.

You may have "slipped" the timing chain.

If you can get a compression tester, check a couple of cylinders for compression.
 
dano said:
Sounds like your lacking compression. Whats the condition of the oil and coolant? Have you checked for vacuum leaks and is your timing correct as in did the distributor get moved?
Click to expand...

There is no milkyness to the oil or coolant, and no vacuum leaks that I could find. I checked the distributor and it is tight, so I doubt it moved.


67Dart273 said:
Get a timing light. Check the timing while cranking. Alternatively, Wrench the engine up to the timing marks, and if you know "where the timing was set" bring the marks up to that. If not, bring them up to say, 5 or 10 BTC. Open the cap after marking the dist. under the no1 plug wire tower. Look and see, the rotor should just be approaching the mark, and the points should just be open, or if electronic, the reluctor tip should be aligned with the center of the pickup coil.

You may have "slipped" the timing chain.

If you can get a compression tester, check a couple of cylinders for compression.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the tip. I'll try to acquire a compression tester and a timing light this weekend.
 
The timing chain is jumped or broken. Sorry.
 
Also, the distributor cap/rotor, spark plugs/wires, the coil and resistor are all fairly new

I am sure you looked inside the new cap and cleaned off the flaked up stuff that builds up on the electrodes (white).. you will get a good spark but it will not spark all the time , I have had this stuff build up over a season and do the same thing before
 
Turn it over with the distributor cap off.
That'll answer if it's broken when the rotor does'nt turn.

Sure sounds like it's broken in the video.
 
Put the engine at TDC, where are the timing marks.
This most likley is a timing chain.
As mentioned before, does the rotor on the distributor spin.
You could also turn the crank bolt back and forth and see how much play is in the rotor button.
How many miles on the motor? Stock fiber tooth chains are good for about 80K
 
sireland67 said:
Put the engine at TDC, where are the timing marks.
This most likley is a timing chain.
As mentioned before, does the rotor on the distributor spin.
You could also turn the crank bolt back and forth and see how much play is in the rotor button.
How many miles on the motor? Stock fiber tooth chains are good for about 80K
Click to expand...

There's probably somewhere around 60-70k on the motor.

I should get some time to mess with the car this weekend, so I'll be able to report back on what I find. The more I think about it though, the more a timing chain issue makes sense.

Thanks for all the help so far!
 
My daddy always said if you got fuel, and spark its gotta start, unless it jumps time.
 
Has anyone here seen a "jumped" timing set? Not trying to be an ***, but I've never seen one. I have seen the plastic toothed silent ones fall apart into the pan.

OP, what is the history of your engine?
 
dano said:
Has anyone here seen a "jumped" timing set? Not trying to be an ***, but I've never seen one. I have seen the plastic toothed silent ones fall apart into the pan.

OP, what is the history of your engine?
Click to expand...

Then you've seen a jumped one. How do you think those teeth came off? The chain gets slop in it and mows them off. I've torn down countless engines like that.
 
dano said:
Has anyone here seen a "jumped" timing set? Not trying to be an ***, but I've never seen one. I have seen the plastic toothed silent ones fall apart into the pan.

OP, what is the history of your engine?
Click to expand...

I have never seen one that was actually off the gears, but I have seen ones that jumped time from streching and the nylon gone of the cam gear.
 
Sounds like the lower end is the only thing turning with the starter. I'm on board with the timing chain cutting loose.
 
dano said:
Has anyone here seen a "jumped" timing set? Not trying to be an ***, but I've never seen one. I have seen the plastic toothed silent ones fall apart into the pan.

OP, what is the history of your engine?
Click to expand...

It sat it a garage for 7 years before I got my hands on it. Before that it was a father/son project, so it's anyone's guess. The engine runs good and strong (when it starts), and doesn't show any signs of neglect or abuse.
 
My guess is that it had the original nylon coated cam gear on it and it has failed. Unfortunate really because the small block is an interference engine. Meaning it probably has bent valves, so the heads will have to come off too. A compression test will verify it as well as checking out the distributor timing as mentioned.
 
I found the problem:

null_zps9decfcd6.jpg


Most of the nylon on the cam gear is gone and it appears the chain has slipped a handful of teeth. A new Edlebrock timing set is on the way, along with a new water pump, t-stat and some other odd and ends. From what I've read there shouldn't be any valve damage, but I'll be keeping my fingers crossed after I get it back together.
 
tuckinauster said:
I found the problem:

Most of the nylon on the cam gear is gone and it appears the chain has slipped a handful of teeth. A new Edlebrock timing set is on the way, along with a new water pump, t-stat and some other odd and ends. From what I've read there shouldn't be any valve damage, but I'll be keeping my fingers crossed after I get it back together.
Click to expand...
yah , that will do it. nows a good time for a fresh cam and lifters
 
tuckinauster said:
I know, and I tried convincing the wife it would be a perfect time for it, but in order to maintain homeostasis in the marriage it's not in the cards right now.
Click to expand...
at the very least you should replace the lifters, im sure they took a beating. I know I would just for peace of mind, especially since you are already in there
 
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