340 in a 65 Barracuda

[RussDavis]

I know this is been done before.
But every thread drifts around till you can't follow it.
I need to know what (stock parts) I need to do this. Modified or not. I have 72 340 mounts and 273 mounts and biscuits. Straight forward what I need to do this. Photos are best. Thanks everyone.

 

[Professor Fate]

The '72 mounts don't work on the '65 K frame. Assuming the 273 mounts are from an early A, you'll need a ~5/8" spacer on one bolt to bolt the driver's side bracket to the 340's mount ears. on the passenger's side you need to add a piece to the upper rear section of the bracket to bolt it to the 340. Done.

 

[searcher1990]

I just put a 340 in my 66, it was fairly painless once you alter the original early A mounts. There is a thread on here somewhere ( probably in the How To section) showing how to do it that has a really good drawing with dimensions and everything that really made it idiot proof. Once that was done it was pretty much plug and play.

 

[Professor Fate]

The '72 mounts don't work on the '65 K frame. Assuming the 273 mounts are from an early A, you'll need a ~5/8" spacer on one bolt to bolt the driver's side bracket to the 340's mount ears. on the passenger's side you need to add a piece to the upper rear section of the bracket to bolt it to the 340. Done.

Oops, forgot to attach. Mod for pass. side mount.
Motor Mount Bracket - dwg I.jpg (600×800) (cloudfactory.org)

 

[Cuda416]

Oops, forgot to attach. Mod for pass. side mount.
Motor Mount Bracket - dwg I.jpg (600×800) (cloudfactory.org)

This is exactly what we did to put a magnum into a 65 Valiant. You'll see some writeups that show modifying the other mount. I found a writeup explaing that was a mistake made made by some engineer who thought the "right" side mount was as viewed from the grill, i.e. the drivers side. Not sure of thats true, but the correct one to mod is the more "square" one like this diagram shows.

 

[grimreaper]

Was the car originally a six or 273? What's in it now?

 

[Professor Fate]

And with a 340, you may want to consider this instead of using the old 273 biscuits.
earlycuda.org/techdocs/JimBowenTheHolyGrailofMotorMounts.pdf

 

[65 Cuda 340]

Besides motor mounts, if you have a 340 with the long aluminum water pump and passenger side lower radiator hose, just use 273 timing cover and timing tab, damper, water pump, pulleys and alternator bracket. You'll have room enough with that setup to run a clutch fan. You can use the later long water pump setup, but will have to change radiators or at least move the lower hose outlet to the opposite side, and you won't have room for a clutch fan.

 

[RussDavis]

Besides motor mounts, if you have a 340 with the long aluminum water pump and passenger side lower radiator hose, just use 273 timing cover and timing tab, damper, water pump, pulleys and alternator bracket. You'll have room enough with that setup to run a clutch fan. You can use the later long water pump setup, but will have to change radiators or at least move the lower hose outlet to the opposite side, and you won't have room for a clutch fan.

View attachment 1715682998

The mounts side to side have got me confused. It was a 273 car. this is what is going in somehow.

 

[65 Cuda 340]

The mounts side to side have got me confused. It was a 273 car. this is what is going in somehow.

View attachment 1715683002

View attachment 1715683003

Put the passenger side 273 bracket up to the 340 passenger side ears. Easy to see that the 273 bracket has two holes in the rear, one in the front. Just add the piece shown above so that you have two holes in the front part of the bracket. Here's mine, not a clear picture as it was difficult to squeeze the camera down there, but maybe you can see the addition I welded to it well enough.

Driver's side is easy, just slip a few washers in if you don't want to be bothered making an actual spacer.

 

[grimreaper]

Another version of photos of stock 273 mounts with modifications:
Left (drivers) side. Two extra heavy washers fill the gap.

Right side showing welded triangle.

 

[RussDavis]

Another version of photos of stock 273 mounts with modifications:
Left (drivers) side. Two extra heavy washers fill the gap.
View attachment 1715683008

Right side showing welded triangle.
View attachment 1715683009

Thanks that will work.

 

[valiantwagonguy]

What are you doing with exhaust manifolds.The pre 67 engine bay is a couple or 3 inches less in width which is why 273's from 64-66 have that strange drivers side ex manifold .It wraps around the steering to connect to the y pipe. there isn't a lot of room in there .You can bolt it to a 340 but the ports are smaller so it will react to that.

 

[65 Cuda 340]

What are you doing with exhaust manifolds.The pre 67 engine bay is a couple or 3 inches less in width which is why 273's from 64-66 have that strange drivers side ex manifold .It wraps around the steering to connect to the y pipe. there isn't a lot of room in there .You can bolt it to a 340 but the ports are smaller so it will react to that.

340 manifolds will fit, although it's close. I have TTI headers now, but ran 340 manifolds for years (I've owned my 65 since 1968; it's been a 340 since 1973).

The late (71-up) passenger side, center-outlet manifold clears well. The early (68-70) hi-po passenger side manifold will barely fit if you clearance the lower inner fender where it folds around the upper control arm, and it may not clear some engine compartments give the the sloppy dimensional standards of the day.

The driver's side 340 manifold might hit the steering column coupler. It did on mine (with manual steering). I swapped in a power steering column, which is shorter, then used a manual/power adapter to connect the manual gearbox to the PS column. This moved the coupler back a couple of inches to where it cleared the exhaust manifold.

There are other possibilities, including late magnum manifolds and, of course, fenderwell headers.

Fenderwell headers are actually the easiest to install, if you don't mind cutting your inner fenders, and can deal with potential tire clearance problems, especially on sharp turns. I ran them for a couple of years (yes, the original inner fenders have been replaced).

 

[Professor Fate]

340 manifolds will fit, although it's close. I have TTI headers now, but ran 340 manifolds for years (I've owned my 65 since 1968; it's been a 340 since 1973).

The late (71-up) passenger side, center-outlet manifold clears well. The early (68-70) hi-po passenger side manifold will barely fit if you clearance the lower inner fender where it folds around the upper control arm, and it may not clear some engine compartments give the the sloppy dimensional standards of the day.

The driver's side 340 manifold might hit the steering column coupler. It did on mine (with manual steering). I swapped in a power steering column, which is shorter, then used a manual/power adapter to connect the manual gearbox to the PS column. This moved the coupler back a couple of inches to where it cleared the exhaust manifold.

There are other possibilities, including late magnum manifolds and, of course, fenderwell headers.

Fenderwell headers are actually the easiest to install, if you don't mind cutting your inner fenders, and can deal with potential tire clearance problems, especially on sharp turns. I ran them for a couple of years (yes, the original inner fenders have been replaced).

View attachment 1715683125

View attachment 1715683127

I like your solution to the coupler clearance issue- that's thinkin' on your feet!

 

[65 Cuda 340]

I like your solution to the coupler clearance issue- that's thinkin' on your feet!

Thanks. It did take me a while to get there. Originally (back in 73 when I was a dumb kid with little in the way of tools), I cut the exhaust manifold where it curved around the steering, turned it around 180 degrees and had it welded back together. That cleared, and lasted a long time - almost ten years - until one day I made the mistake of revving the motor and dumping the clutch in reverse. That broke the weld. Got another manifold, and just removed the coupler cap and ground down the edges. That cleared, too, but of course left the grease inside the coupler exposed to whatever dirt/contamination was out there. Then figured out the final solution after the manual/PS conversion adapter became available and I accumulated a few extra steering columns.

 

[NCmtnDWELLER]

I just put a 340 in my 66, it was fairly painless once you alter the original early A mounts. There is a thread on here somewhere ( probably in the How To section) showing how to do it that has a really good drawing with dimensions and everything that really made it idiot proof. Once that was done it was pretty much plug and play.

Are u running headers ? I guess TTI has the best drop in units ?

 

[NCmtnDWELLER]

I like your solution to the coupler clearance issue- that's thinkin' on your feet!

I have a 66 Valiant and going to install a 318 and a Quicktime bellhousing hopefully the TTI units will drop right in , would you agree the have the best off the shelf quality ?

 

[Professor Fate]

I have a 66 Valiant and going to install a 318 and a Quicktime bellhousing hopefully the TTI units will drop right in , would you agree the have the best off the shelf quality ?

Can't say. Never had the need to use headers on an early A.

 

[NCmtnDWELLER]

Can't say. Never had the need to use headers on an early A.

Thanks

 

[searcher1990]

Are u running headers ? I guess TTI has the best drop in units ?

Stock 273 exhaust manifolds. Couldn't get headers to fit with power steering.

 

[Professor Fate]

Thanks

Although I have HEARD that they fit a 904 nicely, but aren't wide enough to clear a 727's bellhousing- so I don't know if they may or may not clear your Quicktime bell. Just something to be aware of.

 

[ddartdude]

I know on a 360 magnum in a 66 Dart, the center link at the pitman arm made contact with the oil pan. Will this happen with a 340?

 

[Professor Fate]

I know on a 360 magnum in a 66 Dart, the center link at the pitman arm made contact with the oil pan. Will this happen with a 340?

Assuming you've already got the dropped V8 centerlink.
The 340 can use an original A body 273 pan which has indentations on the bottom edges to clear the pitman and tie rod ends at full lock- sorry I don't have the pan number offhand, and there may be others that work.
LA 360s and Magnums can't use those pans because of the end seal diameter being different. They require use of a 360 pass. car pan- most use a "392" pan, although it MAY need to be clearanced with a BFH to resemble the 273 pan. Or shim the motor mounts a bit, or combination of the above...

 

[65 Cuda 340]

Thanks. It did take me a while to get there. Originally (back in 73 when I was a dumb kid with little in the way of tools), I cut the exhaust manifold where it curved around the steering, turned it around 180 degrees and had it welded back together. That cleared, and lasted a long time - almost ten years - until one day I made the mistake of revving the motor and dumping the clutch in reverse. That broke the weld. Got another manifold, and just removed the coupler cap and ground down the edges. That cleared, too, but of course left the grease inside the coupler exposed to whatever dirt/contamination was out there. Then figured out the final solution after the manual/PS conversion adapter became available and I accumulated a few extra steering columns.

Sort of ironic that when I put TTI headers in, I had to return to having a manual steering column, because having the coupler in the power steering location didn't clear one of the header tubes. In the manual steering location, the coupler cleared the TTI's just fine.