383 for a 67 cuda

[xingcuda]

Hey everyone,
I have a 67 barracuda I want to drop a 383 in. Here is what I have and what I am looking to get out of it.

383 block with 413 heads. Still waiting to hear back from the machine shop to let me know how much over the bore will be. Wanting to put a 440 stroker kit from 440 source into it with roller rocker cams.

I am looking to get 500+ hp out of this engine. This is my first engine rebuild so anyone have any experience and recommendations to add on to get the most out of the engine. I want to stay with pump gas so nothing outrageous.

Thanks for the ideas and recommendations.

 

[BBBCUDA]

If the 413 heads are just run of the mill passenger car heads, they are likely small exhaust valve, small port heads. If you are looking for 500+ HP, you will be hampered by them. I currently have a 383, (non stroker) in my '67 Barracuda also. Good luck.

 

[65Val]

If you're looking for 500 hp out of a 383..on pump gas..., those heads ain't gettin' ya there. Better consider Eddy's or Indy's, etc.

You'll need more than heads to get 500+

You'd better consult an EXPERIENCED engine builder. This build is NOT for a newbie! You can't just throw a bunch of parts together that your buddies tell you.

 

[xingcuda]

You'd better consult an EXPERIENCED engine builder. This build is NOT for a newbie! You can't just throw a bunch of parts together that your buddies tell you.

That is understandable. I know I just can't throw parts together. Hence the reason for my post. Thank you for the information.
If anyone else has some pointers or good advice I would appreciate any experience and advice.

 

[65Val]

That is understandable. I know I just can't throw parts together. Hence the reason for my post. Thank you for the information.If you can keep you condescending comments to yourself that would be great.


If anyone else has some pointers or good advice I would appreciate any experience and advice.

"If you can keep you condescending comments to yourself that would be great."


WTF??? Great attitude!!...from a newbie w/ 2 posts...and a 1st time engine builder!! Find your own answers.

 

[xingcuda]

I have been doing a lot of research on the internet and found that most people are getting about 400 - 450 out the 383. There looks like a lot of different modifications and upgrades that can be done. Different cam's, lift's, head's, compression ratio's. Is there a logical process to organizing a build? I have the block and know I want to put in the 440 crank. From here it is head's, then lifter's and cam's, then valve's and intake? Thanks guys. Sorry VAL65 for the misunderstanding that was my bad.

 

[BBBCUDA]

If you want to stick with the 383 block, the longer 440 stroke will help with getting you to 500+ Hp. I believe 434 cubes is what that combo nets. For that power level, I think something along the lines of a mildly prepped set of Edelbrocks RPM heads should be plenty. Make sure you have a decently high compression ratio. Stock stroke 383's are hard to get decent compression with, I assume the pistons that go with the stroker kit will address this. I would shoot for 10- 10.5:1 compression. Good intake and headers, and I would run a cam in the 240° @ .050" with .525-550" lift. I'm not a professional engine builder, but I would bet that will meet your goals easily.

 

[moper]

What is your budget for this engine?

 

[titanium]

If the 413 heads are just run of the mill passenger car heads, they are likely small exhaust valve, small port heads. If you are looking for 500+ HP, you will be hampered by them. I currently have a 383, (non stroker) in my '67 Barracuda also. Good luck.

What are you using for heads??
Thanks

 

[BBBCUDA]

What are you using for heads??
Thanks

The same crap... 8) I have "516" casting heads, which were used on alot of 413 passenger cars. Mine have the 1.74" exhaust added, a light mill job, and a bunch of porting. For the money to have another set made, Edelbrocks would probably be cheaper. The closed chamber on these do get me to 10:1 with flat tops, which I understand is difficult to do with many heads in a 383.

 

[xingcuda]

What is your budget for this engine?

My budget for the whole car is about 15k to 20k. I was going to put about 7k to 10k in the engine, trans, and rear end.

The same crap... 8) I have "516" casting heads, which were used on alot of 413 passenger cars.

I checked the cylinder heads I have for the casting number and they were 2206324. After looking around it shows them as 1961-1962 Intake 2.08 Exhaust 1.60.

Can the heads be opened up and if so by how much?

 

[BBBCUDA]

My budget for the whole car is about 15k to 20k. I was going to put about 7k to 10k in the engine, trans, and rear end.


I checked the cylinder heads I have for the casting number and they were 2206324. After looking around it shows them as 1961-1962 Intake 2.08 Exhaust 1.60.

Can the heads be opened up and if so by how much?

I believe they are the earlier version of my 516's. For your power output, the small ports and the work necessary to get them to flow isn't worth the effort in my opinion. If you want to stick to factory heads, any of the newer designs, 915's 346's 906's 452's etc. have much more flow potential. Unless you get a deal on a used, PROFESSIONALLY done set, ( home hogged out, big valve factory heads often flow LESS than if they were left alone) You really need to know what you are doing to get good numbers. The Edelbrocks, Stealths, etc. will be cheaper than most professionally prepped factory heads. I have a set of 906's that I have $1,500 in, and they were done 10 years ago.

 

[titanium]

The same crap... 8) I have "516" casting heads, which were used on alot of 413 passenger cars. Mine have the 1.74" exhaust added, a light mill job, and a bunch of porting. For the money to have another set made, Edelbrocks would probably be cheaper. The closed chamber on these do get me to 10:1 with flat tops, which I understand is difficult to do with many heads in a 383.

I'm building a 383 also ,for the pure stock drags,( building a 67 gts-gotta use the 516's heads) and was just wondering what I could hope to achieve with a .30 over stock motor.
Thanks

 

[BBBCUDA]

I'm building a 383 also ,for the pure stock drags,( building a 67 gts-gotta use the 516's heads) and was just wondering what I could hope to achieve with a .30 over stock motor.
Thanks

Whats their definition of "stock"? Blueprinting only? any headwork allowed? If truely totally stock, with some tweaking and really good machine work, my guess would be around 350 Hp. This assumes you have to use the stock intake, 516 heads, bone stock cam and exhaust. I would think it would be pretty hard to make any major power improvements while truly staying "stock". Sounds like a difficult class!

 

[titanium]

Whats their definition of "stock"? Blueprinting only? any headwork allowed? If truely totally stock, with some tweaking and really good machine work, my guess would be around 350 Hp. This assumes you have to use the stock intake, 516 heads, bone stock cam and exhaust. I would think it would be pretty hard to make any major power improvements while truly staying "stock". Sounds like a difficult class!

Blue printing -yes,heads-gotta be stock valve sizes,a little room on the cam,allowed 2.5 inch exhaust, gotta run stock carb,intake, and exhaust manifolds. Total comp. can be 1.5 over stock and over bores are allowed to .60 over. So you can get them to run better-I think. Some cars really respond well to these upgrades allowed well others not so much. Hoping to be mid 13's??

 

[BBBCUDA]

Blue printing -yes,heads-gotta be stock valve sizes,a little room on the cam,allowed 2.5 inch exhaust, gotta run stock carb,intake, and exhaust manifolds. Total comp. can be 1.5 over stock and over bores are allowed to .60 over. So you can get them to run better-I think. Some cars really respond well to these upgrades allowed well others not so much. Hoping to be mid 13's??

I hope this hasn't veered too far off the origional post, but... I think traction will be your only problem running mid 13's or likely much better. I put a bone stock, 60,000 mile 1965 383 (2 bbl), in a 1972 Valiant 4 door. I added a cast iron 4 bbl intake, and a 600 cfm. carb, 2" exhaust off the tiny log style manifolds. Car was complete in every way, stock interior, steel wheels, a used 727 (120,000 miles), with a gigantic stock converter, and an 8-3/4 with 2.76 freeway gears. It ran 14's the first trip to the track with no tuning whatsoever, and turned 94 Mph. in the 1/4 using only 1st and 2nd gear. Your car will be MUCH faster.

 

[demon seed]

Here is a build that shows what the 383 is capable of both if you're going to build it stock or build for 450 ish HP. First thing I'd start out with are a set of pocket ported 516 or 915 closed chambered heads with the 1.74" exhaust valve. Those will bump up the comp. almost a full point over the 906's used in the article. Any HP wishes for over 475 HP out of a 383 are require a ton of work and money to hog out a set of cast iron heads therefore a set of Edelbrocks would be the way to go accepting that they'll also need a little port work.

Needless to say this is only the beginning cuss then there's the converter/tranny/rearend/suspension/braking/cooling/sub frame connectors.:read2::read2::read2:
Been there more than once.

http://www.moparmusclemagazine.com/techarticles/mopp_0209_383_engine_restore/index.html

 

[titanium]

I hope this hasn't veered too far off the origional post, but... I think traction will be your only problem running mid 13's or likely much better. I put a bone stock, 60,000 mile 1965 383 (2 bbl), in a 1972 Valiant 4 door. I added a cast iron 4 bbl intake, and a 600 cfm. carb, 2" exhaust off the tiny log style manifolds. Car was complete in every way, stock interior, steel wheels, a used 727 (120,000 miles), with a gigantic stock converter, and an 8-3/4 with 2.76 freeway gears. It ran 14's the first trip to the track with no tuning whatsoever, and turned 94 Mph. in the 1/4 using only 1st and 2nd gear. Your car will be MUCH faster.

Sorry I hope I didn't hijak this post. Not my intention. Hoping what ideas he got I could use for my build too. Wow that is giving me some hope for my project.

 

[cuda guy]

Hey all,
If I'm not mistaken a 1970 383 hp engine out cuda had a factory rating of 335 hp in bone stock condition.
In the day we were able to do a good tune up 3 way value job, some mild porting, a purple cam, headers and we good for almost 400 hp.
So why would a stoked 383 with the same work not produce at least 500 hp?
I just built a mild 360 that is approx. 400 hp.

Rick

 

[demon seed]

Sorry I was including Titanium in my response which talks of a stock stroke 383. A stroked 383 is a whole different kettle of fish for 500+ HP and I would think the aluminum Edelbrocks would be a given as the cast iron heads would be the equivalent of a big cork.

 

[xingcuda]

I can agree with stock heads being a big cork. Really starving the engine of fuel and air. I was looking a few sets on jegs and summit racing. The only problem I am concerned with is buying a set of heads that are to big or too small. Are there any guideline too figure out what heads you will need as well as cams to maximize performance from different engine setups?
I'm not worried about you looking for answers. Thats why we are here asking the questions. and it looks like we are both working the same engine just to different levels.

 

[BBBCUDA]

The Edelbrocks take over about where a maxed out ported factory head leaves off. They can be ported quite a bit, but aren't a "big" head out of the box. Too big of a head is a real concern in my opinion, but if you do the 3.75" crank, you are only about 10 cubic inches off from a 440. There are lots of 440 guys running the Edelbrocks. You certainly can reach 500+ Hp with factory iron heads, I just think it's gonna cost you some money.

 

[xingcuda]

There are lots of 440 guys running the Edelbrocks. You certainly can reach 500+ Hp with factory iron heads, I just think it's gonna cost you some money.

I think I am going to go with an Edelbrock heads. It depends on how much over the bore is and the stroke length as to how large the ports should be and how much lift in the cam you would need?

 

[BBBCUDA]

I think I am going to go with an Edelbrock heads. It depends on how much over the bore is and the stroke length as to how large the ports should be and how much lift in the cam you would need?

You only gain about 6 cubic inches per .030", so I don't think that will make much of a difference. Going to the 3.75" 440 crank makes a bunch more cubes. The longer stroke should pull a bigger intake charge. I believe a good rule of thumb is an engine should make 2 Hp per cfm of airflow, assuming the rest of the combination is good. If that holds true, the Edelbrocks should support around 600 Hp. in stock form. One of the magazines did a 383 stroker, I'll see if I can find the article. I checked, Google:< Building a 383 stroker part 1 > Andy Finkbeiner did the build, he wrote a book on building Mopar big blocks.