416 issues - losing patience

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I searched the web for an affordable set up to cool my BB. Though some other forms I came across this set up. The radiator is a 26" 2 row 1" core from JEGS. The fan is out of a 2000 Ford Contour V6. I didn't fit with the fan shroud in stock form. I had to trim the outer lip which gained me about 3/4" The center water pump pulley was really close to the center rib... But there is plenty of meat there to take out and still keep the structure.
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ken5124 said:
Derale mechanical fan worked for me too.. Pulls a LOT of air thru the rad.. Flattens slightly at higher rpms. Has deep pitch blades.
Added a homemade shroud.
it runs at 180 . and stays there.
Click to expand...

Do you think this fan pulls more air at idle than the stock steel 7 blade non clutch fan?
 
Take a picture of it and let us look at the set up...
I think all you need is a shroud and a large fan with a 180* thermostat and 16lbs radiator cap, and a good mix of 50/50. and you should be good to go.
Check the hoses for collapsing * 2000 rpm?
Just My 2 cents
 
we shall see - new parts are coming in today
Derale 17' fan, Hayden 2765 clutch
Milodon Hi Flow pump, Milodon Ho flow thermo
Summit Universal shroud
plans are to remove the electric fans and start swapping things out, keeping my fingers crossed.
Also will re-check timing - i think my initial is way off !
 
72ScampTramp brings up using factory style electric fans, which is a great way to do it-there are literally thousands of these probably in your local salvage yards that would work...downside is the minor fab work and the drain on the electrical system. If you're only running a standard 60A alternator and no wiring upgrades, you'll overtax the alternator and battery.

In a nutshell, if you're still running a stock charging system, go for an engine driven fan with a shroud.

Just my .02
 
I have more luck drilling 2 holes in the thermostat a scoop def. will help and then back to the block was it all cleaned inside ,before and after machining to not plug the cooling system any wheres , and I have also had same problem that turned out to be the head gaskets were plugging my water flow, just a thought ive had it happen to me ,new isn't always correct as some 1 stated cook that thermostat once ,had that problem before also GL hope you find the problem soon
 
340kid said:
water pump is new - don't remember what brand, im thinking it was an autozone pump

i ordered a new Milodon hogh flow pump and 180 degree hi flow thermo

should i drill a weep hole in the hi flow thermo ???

if yes where on the milodon - it looks different from other thermos ive seen
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The milodon pump just a new pump you get at autozone with a anti-cativation plate welded on the back of the vanes and milodon checks and resets if necessary the measurement of the back of the vanes to the machined housing surface.

It's better that a stock new pump. But I don't think that is going to make the significant difference to why you are getting hot.

I didn't drill any holes into the milodon thermostat I run.

I still think a stock 7 blade fan will move more air than that Derale aftermarket fan. But I guess that's easy as clicking on a screen and delivered to you door.
 
dwire67 said:
How big is the carb? I would toss some 82 jets in the primary side and put some 86's on the secondary side, toss out vacuum advance distributor and get a old mopar race electronic or MSD , a distributor that you can lock the advance.
And as others have said get a mechanical fan & shroud also.
To me it seems like it is too lean along with too much timing
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found my sheets from dyno run - baseline out of box for the quick fuel ss750 was 74 primary/80 secondary 6.5 power valve total timing 36 with 1" spacer - we messed with jetting and timing and it wanted more timing - 37-38 with 81/72 for jetting gave us the best numbers and brought the average a/f ratio to high 12's low 13's
 
340kid said:
we shall see - new parts are coming in today
Derale 17' fan, Hayden 2765 clutch
Milodon Hi Flow pump, Milodon Ho flow thermo
Summit Universal shroud
plans are to remove the electric fans and start swapping things out, keeping my fingers crossed.
Also will re-check timing - i think my initial is way off !
Click to expand...

well made some progress ,maybe - parts came in but i failed to realize when i ordered the derale fan that there is a different fan for manual vs clutch type - i ordered the manual so the hayden 2765 will not bolt up to it. we got the new pump, thermo etc installed and test fitted the "manual fan" the 17" derale fan is really nice.. right now with the fan mounted on the snub of the pump i have about 2.5" clearance from tip of fan to the core of the radiator. will test it tomorrow, bought a summit univeral shroud but i'm thinking it wont work, may have to make a custom one.
 
Your best dyno numbers were with 72 jets in the front and 81 jets in the rear ???? You wrote 81\72....I assume you ment 72's in the front primary.
A stock fan is the best for cooling but takes a little power from the engine.
Check the plugs just to make sure it isn't lean.
I bet the electric fans are most of the problem.

Make sure your gauge is right by using a infrared thermometer.
Harbor Freight sells them and they are really useful.

http://www.crawler.com/xfb_redir.as...KTcO15OGx0vRn_sijqTn2PduOIm258Ny3Hn7Hz62LWpo@http://www.crawler.com/xfb_redir.as...KTcO15OGx0vRn_sijqTn2PduOIm258Ny3Hn7Hz62LWpo@
 
T67POWER said:
Your best dyno numbers were with 72 jets in the front and 81 jets in the rear ???? You wrote 81\72....I assume you ment 72's in the front primary.
A stock fan is the best for cooling but takes a little power from the engine.
Check the plugs just to make sure it isn't lean.
I bet the electric fans are most of the problem.

Make sure your gauge is right by using a infrared thermometer.
Harbor Freight sells them and they are really useful.
Click to expand...

yes 72/81 - sorry its late
 
flyfish said:
Well, like I was saying in the other post, lets start with the free stuff (or almost free stuff).

1. Make sure there is no air in the system. Get the car on a slant, or jack the front end up so that the radiator cap is the highest point on the engine. Open the radiator cap (with the engine cool obviously). Warm the car up with the cap off. Get it hot enough to open the T-stat, see water running by, lightly rev the engine a little....do this for a few minutes after the T-stat opens (add water as needed)...this should get any air bubbles out of the system, and it's free.

2. I'm a fan of Water Wetter, usually good for at least a 10 degree drop (about 8 bucks).

3. Might want to look into a better water pump. I can't say for sure that is an issue because I ditched mine years ago before I built my stroker...but it probably won't hurt. Mine is a Milodon mechanical pump (about 80 bucks).

What oil filter are you using? I use to have low oil pressure with my motor too~ 15 hot at idle and ~50 above 2500 RPM (10-40 conventional oil). This might sound strange, but I switched oil filters to a Fram HP1 and now I have 25 hot at idle and 70 hot above 2500RPM....just something to try.

Totally unrelated, most strokers I have seen (mine included) like ~34° total timing...just food for thought.
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fly- we originally were running a Napa Gold 1068 then switched to Napa gold 1085 for shorter length, we have TTi step headers and the oil filter clearance sucks ! I have a Fram HP1 and a Wix 51515R filter on the shelf but i don't think it will clear with the headers.. i'm running the same 20/50 in my cuda 340 (non stroker) and i have hot idle pressure over 25/30 and cruising pressure over 50/60... on the stroker i am running a Canton filter adaptor plate which maybe causing a liitle clearance issues but the TTi's are causing problems everywhere !
 
T67POWER said:
Make sure your gauge is right by using a infrared thermometer.
Harbor Freight sells them and they are really useful.
Click to expand...

Or a meat thermometer in the top of the radiator. :D
I used this on the stove to check the stat.....the wife kiboshed my taking it to the garage.
But don't discount the bad gauge idea.......it sure wouldn't be the first.
 
good news - took the 10" electric fans and shroud off, replaced the the water pump and thermo with the Milodon high flow units and put the the derale 17" flex fan on - motor runs much cooler - had it out yesterday for s decent drive, maintained around 180-190. Highway 180, the creeped to 190 or so in city driving, this is mostly because there is no shroud on it yet.
 
Nice work! :D Those are great temps. I doubt that a shroud will help you any from where you are now. Just my opinion is all.

What size spacer did you use if any? How close it the fan to the Radiator?
 
Mad Dart said:
Nice work! :D Those are great temps. I doubt that a shroud will help you any from where you are now. Just my opinion is all.

What size spacer did you use if any? How close it the fan to the Radiator?
Click to expand...

No spacer, no clutch fan - fan is sitting about 2" -2 1/2 " from radiator, this fan pulls so much air !!
 
340kid said:
good news - took the 10" electric fans and shroud off, replaced the the water pump and thermo with the Milodon high flow units and put the the derale 17" flex fan on - motor runs much cooler - had it out yesterday for s decent drive, maintained around 180-190. Highway 180, the creeped to 190 or so in city driving, this is mostly because there is no shroud on it yet.
Click to expand...

Also drained all fluid and added 3/4 bottle of water wetter, with 50/50 antifreeze mix and some water !
 
340kid said:
should i drill a weep hole in the hi flow thermo ???
Click to expand...

I drill three 1/8" holes in my thermostat cause I had air lock happen to me. Great thing about the holes in the thermostat is you can fill the cooling system to full capacity with out running the engine. Put everything together, fill it up, start it up and you are done. No topping off needed.
 
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