440 wont start

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richmann80

richmann80

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ok heres what i have going on i changed my heads from 906's to eddys went from the 88cc 906 to a 84 cc eddy the car ran great with the 906's now i can't get it to start with the eddys on there all i get is backfiring and when i play with the timing i get backfiring thought the carb the fireing order is right i'm getting good spark but it just wont start i'm running a .30 over six pack bottom end about 10.8:1 comp i also watched the valves open and close every thing seems to be there but no fire this is my first 440 an i missing some thing any help would be a big help thanks
 
Did you remove the dizzy? If so check and make sure it is in time correct, sounds like the timing is out or you have a wire or two crossed.
 
i never touched the distributor just changed the heads only after it wouldn't start and started backfiring thats when i started playing with the timing
 
If you "never touched the distributor" then the only thing left is valve adjustment

Seems to me it'd be pretty easy to get the wires AFU and off a "tower or two"
 
I would still verify the timing, and also check your valve timing, i know it sounds crazy but I have seen timing chains jump a tooth after a back fire.
 
Do a compression test. It sounds to me like the valves are hanging open.
 
'T fact is, it just doesn't take all that long to CHECK

CHECK the valve clearance. If you have hydraulic tappets, the pushrods should at least be rotatable with valves closed. Any chance the stem height is too tall on those new heads?

FORGET you "think" the timing is OK, CHECK it.

Pull no1 plug, stick your finger in the hole, bump for start of compression. Bump around until marks are 10-15 BTC, look where the rotor is, and make sure no1 wire starts there. Maybe you were asleep. Did you run the wires the correct way? CCW for B/ RB, and CW for SB engines.
 
67Dart273 got it.. back off the rocker shaft bolts about a turn, and maybe a little more if it still pops, this'll give you lots of Valve clearance.. then fire it up,,slowly and evenly retighten the rocker shafts while engine is running, as you tighten down the bolts,,the engine will slow.. stop tightening until it picks back up, then tighten a little more.. if you do it too fast ,, it will kill the engine, and not give the lifter time to bleed down to proper size, .. what is likely happening is valves aren't closing all the way, cuz the lifters pumped-up.. is quick easy fix.. watch out for spraying oil on exhaust manifolds.. I put soaking wet shop towels on em.. .. sounds complicated, but is easy after the first dozens times.. lol

Happened often after planing heads, or changing over to steel head gskts from composite, at times was nec to shim up shafts, or preferably shorten pushrods, but that was before adjustable pushrods..

Oh, and by the way, the dipstick makes an excellent tool to hold the pushrods up as you put rocker shafts on.. just lay dipstick across the top of all the rocker stands, pushrods above it.....
 
thanks for the help i'm going to try that trick with the rockers tommorrow it make good sence to me i have never played with shaft mount rocker before and it is a hydraulic tappet cam not sure on the lift i didn't biuld the motor niether did the guy i bought it from but its not a real mean cam
 
ok i tried playing around with the valves still the same thing poping and back firing i'm going to try putting a timing light on it and spining it with the starter and see how far the timing might be out never tried it before but at this point its worth a shot
 
You should not have to do that. There is no reason (re-read my last post) that you cannot static time the engine close enough THAT YOU KNOW IT WILL RUN insofar as timing is concerned

Pull no1 plug

feel for compression

bump the marks up to what you want for initial (15?)

Check where the rotor points, and adjust the distributor:

so the points JUST open if points

If electronic, so the reluctor is JUST on the approaching edge to middle of the center of the pickup coil.

At some point, you should be able to "over" advance it until the engine kicks back Not recommended, but at least it shows you are on the right crank revolution.

ANY chance the balancer has moved?
 
i don't think the balancer moved i just tried putting back on the victor manifold that was on it when it was running just to see if that would change any thing and the same thing popping and backfires i've gone over the firing order atlest 20 times just to make sure it was right i tried putting cylinder 1 on tdc and that all seems to line up the rotor points at number 1 both valves are closed i can spin the push rods around easly i check all the other cylinders and the same thing push rods move easy when valves are closed i would say maybe the piston was coming up and touching the head but the spark plug gaps aren't crushed or anything like that an when i checked for tdc i could feel where the piston stopped i'm starting to think i might just have to put the old 906's back on and see what happens its not and easy task but every thing i'm tring isn't working
 
also anyone think it might be possible that the timing chain stretched a bit some how short of pulling it out how would i'd be able to check that i'm just thinking maybe under the load of the starter truning the motor its justing me a some what random timing when i trun it buy hand thats alot slower then the starter truning just grabing at straws
 
Next thing I'd do is a compression or leakdown test. Any chance you bent a valve?
 
i hope i didn't bend a valve its possible but one bent valve wouldn't or 2 bent valves wouldn't couse the motor to not even try to start i'm thinkin maybe my distributor crapped out (its a 1973 with the tac drive on it ) the spark seems very random it doesn't bang consecutively even when i pump the gas and the only thing i'm running on vacuum is the pcv i'm going to borrow a distributor from a friend and give it hell i'm also running and msd 6al and a multi step retart box the car had nitrous on it i took the retart box out of the the loop running off the msd only right now
 
Popping and banging?

Try a different coil.

Any chance you whacked the ballast resistor on the firewall
when pulling the driver's side head off? Try another one anyway
(after the coil first).

Both of these 2 minute-to-change items could cause the symptom
you describe.

If one of these works, I hope you don't get a welt in the middle of
your forehead from smacking yourself!

Good luck.
 
I think your problem is in the distributor trigger/ ignition box--false triggering.

At this point I'd be trying to find something "simple" like a points distributor to stick in there and ELIMINATE a whole raft o' stuff
 
They are right on about checking the valve clearance, In all actuality the length of the pusrods may need to be checked (pushrods too long) holding the valves open and for it to be popping back..yea maybe ya crossed #5and #7....just sayin...
 
I would take a look at the distributor cap. If you had it off it may have got some oil or something in it. Make sure it is squarely on the housing. Also make sure the rotor is on the shaft correctly and not cracked or damaged. I have seen people put caps on backward when replacing them, and the vehicle would still run to the point where the rotor had worn a hole thru the cap. Also, heads are heavy, so if you bumped the distributor with one, it is possible that you can bend the shaft. I had a small block Demon with the same symptoms, and sure enough the shaft was bent.
 
thats where i'm at now tring to find a cheap distributor for testing around here its hard to find old parts in junk yards they crush most of the car after there more then ten years old ebay or craigslist are my only hope i'm also running an msd 6al and a multi step retart box the car had nos on it i have sence taken the retart box out of the loop running on msd only i'm hoping to find the magnetic pickup is what the problem is or something to that effect

also does anyone know any one running the 440 source pro billet distributor ? are they any good they look like an msd but there less then half the price
 
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