5.2 Magnum into a '72 Scamp-tips?

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txstang84

txstang84

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Hello everyone, I've been looking for answers as to which oil pan to use on a '98 5.2 I received for a favor. I'm prepping it to drop into my '72 Scamp to replace the tired 318 2 bbl currently residing in the bay and starting to make death noises. I'm not looking to turn this thing into a firebreather...just wanna enjoy the car without having to worry about the engine locking up

I wound up on this website before while trying to find out for sure what pan to use for this endeavor only to find out the info I picked up in about three different "Google" searches wasn't accurate. I read several threads here and elsewhere stating the 5.2 and 5.9 will both take the LA360 pan w/360 pan gasket when swapping to A bodies. So, an order to Jeg's was dispatched and a few days later, the friendly UPS guy dropped off a shiny new irridited pan and gasket. I found out shortly thereafter the pan and gasket combo was wrong-GIGANTIC gap between pan rail and rear main cap. No big deal, I figured. I picked up a pan gasket for a 5.2 Magnum, '98 Dakota (donor vehicle) and tried that. Again, no joy-the Magnum pan gasket was indeed thicker, but not enough to fill the gap...ok, so what am I missing here? Did I purchase the wrong pan? Wrong gasket? Can I just use my old pan? I'm sorry to say I don't have any pictures available right now...

Someone please assist before I waste any more money buying the wrong parts.

Among the other things I plan to use, I know I need to use my old timing cover, and fuel pump arrangement. I already purchased the Hughes cam snout extension doohickey, but I am slightly confused about which timing set to use, or if there's a difference between LA and Magnum timing sets.

I also noticed some folks chose to run the serpentine setup-is there anything special I'd need to run this in my car with the original timing cover/water pump setup? Other parts interchanges? Any suggestions or help is greatly appreciated.
 
Timing sets are the same.Use your old pan.Buy a LA oil pan gasket.I don't know on serp setup.Could mock up on your current setup.Search small block tech,it has been done.
 
If I am not mistaken, the water pump flows the opposite direction from a magnum motor to an LA motor. Dont quote me on this, I remember reading a post about this awhile back. If you do decide to use the surpentine belt and accesories, would be nice to know about.
 
Yes, the Magnum has a reverse flow WP, but you can install the LA timing cover & use the LA WP if you want to run a Mech. FP, but you'll need the cam snout extention from Hughes engines unless you change the cam to an aftermarket with the extended snout built in. I'm sure they offer a serpentine set-up for the LA engines if you want that, or just use the Magnum T-Cover/WP & serpentine, when i install a 360 magnum in my 71 dart, i just used the LA set-up off my LA 318 with the snout extention.
 
Heres a comparison pic of thie difference between the 318 and 360 oil pan.318 on the right. Yes it uses a larger seal than the 360.
 

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You have to use a 360 pan on the 5.2 and 5.9 Magnum engines I know because I had the same problem you have.
 
Ok, I'll confirm the part number I ordered as soon as I get the chance-the parts are at a friend's house, but if the 318 has the bigger opening then Jeg's must've put the wrong pan in the box...dammit...
 
Yeah, I checked the part number-according to Jeg's it's supposed to be a 360 pan, but the rear opening is huge...doubt I'll be able to return it since it's been friggin' months since I ordered it. But, now I'm reluctant to order one that's the "correct" part number, since I thought I already did...
 
Jegs and Summit were on "backorder",5 months ago,Find a stock 360 pan.I pounded my old one back out,that was in late August.
 
Oil pan issue resolved...while I was mocking up the pan to the block, I didn't have a timing cover...if you can't see yet where this one is going, I'm an idiot and tried to put the pan on backwards:banghead:...I've never messed with an engine where the pan would actually line up both ways. I'm used to seeing a larger opening on the rear of an engine, not the front. Regardless, the pan I bought from Jeg's is GTG, and I already have a gasket that fits. I still plan on running a mech pump timing cover, and I've already bought the cam snout extension from Hughes (expensive little bugger!). I'd like to have the engine ready to just drop in when the old one comes out, so I'll probably go ahead and get a new timing cover, fuel pump, and all associated hardware for it so all I really gotta swap will be accessories, water pump, and some hoses and stuff.

Thanks anyway for all your assistance. I might have to police up some little doo-dads here and there when it goes is, but for now, the head scratching is over.
 
Ok, so the engine is now in the car. I ran into a couple issues-both of which I'll tackle as the time comes available.

1) Fuel pump no worky. Not sure on this one as I can't see whether or not the fuel pump eccentric is actually spinning, but it would appear as such since I know the pump did work when I pulled it from the old engine, and I'm running a Hughes cam snout extension for my new engine. I can touch the new eccentric, but I can't tell if it's secure nor do I know if it's actually moving the pump arm. So, the front end of the engine may have to come back off....Grrrr

2) I went to put on the alternator only to discover the old swing arm bracket doesn't bolt on the head because the mounting pad where it should go is about an 1" too far forward. Ok, no biggie I figure...I can modify the bracket to fit the new engine. Then comes the really fun part-the alternator-I installed the pivot bolt on my a/c compressor brackets only to find out the the alternator won't even swing down far enough to allow me to use it even if I had modified the bracket because it actually contacts the cylinder head. This wasn't something I'd read about in regard to Mangum swaps. I guess more people do non-a/c vehicles, or keep the accessories as installed on the donor engine.

If you guys have any suggestions, I'd like to hear them.
 
txstang84 said:
Ok, so the engine is now in the car. I ran into a couple issues-both of which I'll tackle as the time comes available.

1) Fuel pump no worky. Not sure on this one as I can't see whether or not the fuel pump eccentric is actually spinning, but it would appear as such since I know the pump did work when I pulled it from the old engine, and I'm running a Hughes cam snout extension for my new engine. I can touch the new eccentric, but I can't tell if it's secure nor do I know if it's actually moving the pump arm. So, the front end of the engine may have to come back off....Grrrr

2) I went to put on the alternator only to discover the old swing arm bracket doesn't bolt on the head because the mounting pad where it should go is about an 1" too far forward. Ok, no biggie I figure...I can modify the bracket to fit the new engine. Then comes the really fun part-the alternator-I installed the pivot bolt on my a/c compressor brackets only to find out the the alternator won't even swing down far enough to allow me to use it even if I had modified the bracket because it actually contacts the cylinder head. This wasn't something I'd read about in regard to Mangum swaps. I guess more people do non-a/c vehicles, or keep the accessories as installed on the donor engine.

If you guys have any suggestions, I'd like to hear them.
Click to expand...

My fuel pump did that not too long ago, acted like it didn't have "prime", so I just added a little gas to the carb and got it to start and after the engine was spinning it started to pump gas. Just a thought.

As far as #2....check this article out http://ramchargercentral.com/articles/?sa=view;article=81
 
Toss that mechanical pump BS and run the Magnum accessories with an electric pump and regulator. It's ten times better than the V-belt crap and mechanical pump and it's SO easy to find parts in the future.

Got Power Steering? If yes, get the B-van power steering pump bracket (it sits lower). You may need a power steering pump housing from a mid-90's Dak IF it hits your battery tray (It clocks toward the motor a little more). If your battery is in the trunk, run the truck PS pump bracket if you like. Your original PS pump should bolt to the Magnum bracket and pulley. Mine did (my donor was a '99 Ram).

Got AC? If so, you're set. Run the compressor and proper belt and carry on. If not, Do NOT run the cheesy belt mis-routing. It invites pulley slippage. March down to the dealer (or salvage yard, but good luck), and order the alternator bracket for NON-A/C Rams n' B-vans. (It repositions the idler pulley just enough to matter). It's spendy but you'll be able to remember what belt it is in 100,000 miles...ANY Ram truck or B-Van, with Magnum, No AC, 93-03!

Run the Magnum alternator, straight up bolt-on at this point. I run the output directly to the stud on the starter relay (WITH FUSIBLE LINK, natch), hook the fields up, and you're done. I even run the Magnum coil, via extended wires, and I got the Magnum cap adapter to run Maggie distributor cap n' wires. Pure cakewalk.
 
Bkbond, I thought about that, and I did attempt priming the carb. About that time, I was running into issues with timing (probably 180* out) and decided to call it a day. I'll re-attack that as the opportunity comes available.

Jos, the engine (longblock minus accessories) was free to me, and for the cost of a reground crank and some gaskets, this is all I've spent on parts. I chose to run a mechanical pump on purpose because I didn't want to run an electric.

Up until now, I've not had any issues with throwing of belts-IF using Magnum accessories is my only choice, then I guess the car will be down until such time I can actually locate all the pieces.

Surely someone else out there has dropped a carbed Magnum 5.2 into their A body and kept v-belt driven accessories...anyone?
 
I finally got a chance to read the link you posted up there-interesting solution. I don't think mine will be quite that much of a chore though. The only thing I'd really have to do would be to make the alternator mount higher...or as suggested, just acquire a magnum engine front end.
 
Anyone else got any ideas, or do I need to start searching junkyards (or eBay) for a Magnum accessories donor...?
 
Here's a pic of my 2000 5.2 magnum I put in my 65 cuda in Jan.
It was a really simple swap.
I'm happy to help you with any advice you need.

I went through all the stuff you're struggling with.
I'm no expert but I'm glad to help...
 

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txstang84 said:
Anyone else got any ideas, or do I need to start searching junkyards (or eBay) for a Magnum accessories donor...?
Click to expand...

Trucks/SUVs with magnum engines are pretty common in picknpull.

I got my engine from a listed recycler on car-part.com. Just invest in a boroscope to look in the cylinders before you do anything with it
 
magnumdust said:
Trucks/SUVs with magnum engines are pretty common in picknpull.

I got my engine from a listed recycler on car-part.com. Just invest in a boroscope to look in the cylinders before you do anything with it
Click to expand...

I really only need the accessories and that decision is still pending as I'd prefer to use a v-belt unless I have no alternative; I went through the engine already and reground the crank. Everything else, apart from some general crud/varnish was fine. They may be a little more common where you are-last time I ventured into our local yards, they were a little less common...or at least, the engines had already been harvested.
 
jameybro said:
Here's a pic of my 2000 5.2 magnum I put in my 65 cuda in Jan.
It was a really simple swap.
I'm happy to help you with any advice you need.

I went through all the stuff you're struggling with.
I'm no expert but I'm glad to help...
Click to expand...

That looks very nice-simple and perfectly functional. The engine is already in the car-I'll post up a pic or two tomorrow either after I get off work in the AM, or after I get up in the afternoon. I'd like to keep the v-belts if possible. I do have A/C and P/S. Neither of those have issues with interference anywhere-just the alternator. I thought about buying one of the nice billet brackets, but I don't know if I'd run into the same issue...
 
txstang84 said:
I really only need the accessories and that decision is still pending as I'd prefer to use a v-belt unless I have no alternative; I went through the engine already and reground the crank. Everything else, apart from some general crud/varnish was fine. They may be a little more common where you are-last time I ventured into our local yards, they were a little less common...or at least, the engines had already been harvested.
Click to expand...

I must get lucky or something then.

Personally, i'd use the v-belt setup and well i did use the v-belt setup. I had read somewhere that the stock magnum serpentine setup doesnt fit with the oem battery mount.
 
I did a Magnum swap also. I found a 73 318 in the boneyard and stripped the entire front end of the motor, cleaned it up and installed it on the Magnum. I used a 36o passenger car pan with the stock timing cover and in the front of the pan where there will be a gap, I filled it in with silicone. I also considered serpentine but was unable to find an entire, complete front set up as I was not in piece mealing a set up, and thought that there would be more aftermarket ac set ups for the v belt set up as I will be adding ac as soon as soon as I can afford it. It was an extremely easy swap, using the inexpensive motor mounts. The only technical issue was the converter/flex plate/. To run the neutral balance converter, I had to scrounge a 95 and up weighted flex plate as Mopar changed the balancing of the converter to a balanced flexplate in 95. Goopd luck.
 
Magnumdust, trust me, I'd like to stay v-belt if I can. Jos51700 says I can use the PS bracket from a van and I'd be good with battery clearance. So, it's still an option, but I'd prefer not to have to use it until it's my last and only option.

dustoff440, I'm hoping you mean you grabbed a 5.9 Magnum since you're talking about different engine mounts and weighted flex plates. It's been my understanding that both LA 318s and 5.2 Magnums both use neutral balance reciprocating assemblies. The issues with the oil pan and timing cover (along with the Hughes snout extender) have since been mitigated, and the engine is sitting in the mounts-that wasn't the hard part. I'm just curious why, with all the magnum swap articles I've read and heard about, I'd never noticed anything about needing a new alt bracket due to interference with the heads. Oh well..

All that being said, I've been looking at an aftermarket A/C setup from Bouchillon Performance out of SC. They have a couple different kits for mounting new style Sanden compressors with a v-belt, and I would love to be able to use it. I'd already decided on a kit until I ran into this little snag. However, if I can (1)use a billet alternator bracket and clear the cylinder head obstruction and press from there, or (2) modify the stock bracket to swing the alternator up so I can at least run it as it sits in the current config, then I'd be good. Otherwise I'll be deleting my A/C brackets and running just alternator and PS pump, or sourcing a serpentine setup, swapping timing covers, and installing an electric pump. I'd just like for someone with this particular setup to confirm there is a bracket or something I can acquire that will play nice with what I have before I go to frivolously spending money only to find the parts didn't fit.
 
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