74 to 65 Drivetrain Swap!

[Valkman]

I've been doing searches on this forum and there's too much to information! And my brain is only so big! So I need some help!

I have 65 Barracuda 273 auto. It has a 318 with later model (linkage) 904 trans and a 7¼ rear end with a large bolt pattern. I don’t have much history about this car so I don’t know what all this came out of.

I also have a donor car. It is 74 v8 Duster column shift. I want swap out the good running 340 attached to a 904 trans along with an 8¼ Sure Grip rear end that’s in it.

Can some of you that have done a swap like this tell of anything special I’ll need?

Also how hard is to pull the engine and trans together?


And please no post about needing a stronger drivetrain, I’m on a budget and this going to street driven car so I’m OK with what it is for now

 

[grumpuscreature]

You can use most of what you have now for the swap (exhaust manifolds, driveshaft, etc.).
The only "special" parts you will need is a driver's side motor mount bracket (the ears on a 340 block are different from the 318) and possibly a radiator with a thicker core for more cooling capacity. The mount is available from Schumacher (engine-swaps.com).
Pulling the engine and trans as a unit is actually easier than pulling just the engine. Hope this helps.

 

[Valkman]

Thanks grumpuscreature!

What’s the best way to pull the engine and trans together, I figure the radiator and hood need to be removed, would it help to raise the rear of the car?

 

[1970Duster]

Thanks grumpuscreature!

What’s the best way to pull the engine and trans together, I figure the radiator and hood need to be removed, would it help to raise the rear of the car?

Drop the entire front suspension and lift the up and pull the motor, tranny and suspension out for under it.

 

[BillGrissom]

If you also need to rebuild the suspension and steering, it is actually easier to unbolt the K-frame (4 bolts), drag struts, UCA's, and tranny support, then lift the body up and roll the engine, suspension assembly out. Several posts w/ photos.

Best to get a fold-up engine lift off craigslist for ~$100 and sell it again for ~$100 when done. I have lifted several engine w/ tranny using a cheap come-along and a thick beam in a garage. Heaviest was a 383/727.

Read-up on the engine mounts. I vaguely recall that only the 360 was different among SB's, but maybe that was just the oil pan.

 

[Valkman]

The front end seems to be in pretty good shape, and I’d rather not get into all that and have to replace suspension components and pay to get it realigned and such, remember I'm on a budget. I’m thinking that pulling it from the top might be the route I should go again I’m asking you all that have done this before.
Because I don’t know much of the history of the Cuda, it has later model front disc brakes it might be possible it had a K-member swap already. Can anyone tell me what to look for to confirm if this is the case? I’d like to know what I have before start buying new mounts and such and get only what I need to get the job done.

 

[C130 Chief]

You'll also need a conversion shift cable to use your original shifter with the later transmission.

I don't think it would have had a k-member swap, all 63-66 k-members were the same. Later k-members won't fit.

 

[chryslerfat]

After reading your original post. I see you already have a 318 and linkage shift 904 in it you are pulling out. You are swapping motor trans. and axle from another A body. It will be a direct easy swap as your car is already set up for it. On the left [ drivers side ] motor mount just put a couple washers under the one bolt that will need a small space taken up. On the right I dont recall your 318 block ear setup but you may need to cut one ear off the mount on the engine side on the mount and weld it to the front side of the mount. You may also need to grind a little from the head boss and the manifold on the left rear so you dont break the manifold when you bolt it back if you still have the rear dump 273 manifolds.

 

[chryslerfat]

Unbolt the hood and it will go in and out the top being you said you dont want nor have the money to go out the bottom.

 

[Valkman]

Thanks chryslerfat, could you be more specific on what to grind on? I have a set of Magnum manifolds I was going to use, but the Cuda has the stock manifolds on it now. I was going to leave them on until I could drive to a to a muffler shop to rework the exhaust to fit the Magnums.

 

[chryslerfat]

For the magnum manifolds you wont need to grind. For the early manifolds that dump to the rear look at the port on the head. The rear port there is a raised part below the port which is drilled and tapped on vehicles with air injection into the exhaust. On the early 360 like my 74 is is cast but not drilled. Grind some off that raised cast and some from the manifold to clear and do it out of the car because I found out after it was in the car. Do not take it all from the head or manifold take off from both trust me spraying coolant from the head while grinding is not pretty.

 

[jnf105]

make sure you check the drivers manifold before you change the pipes, early a body v-8 cars have a specific drivers manifold that wraps under steering shaft.

 

[Valkman]

make sure you check the drivers manifold before you change the pipes, early a body v-8 cars have a specific drivers manifold that wraps under steering shaft.

The 340 in Duster has headers so I can't use them anyway. Are all Magnum manifolds the same, mine are of a 96 Ram?

 

[Valkman]

I found this chart and it seems to show that 73+ are slightly narrower by almost 2".

 

[Bill Dedman]

I've been doing searches on this forum and there's too much to information! And my brain is only so big! So I need some help!

I have 65 Barracuda 273 auto. It has a 318 with later model (linkage) 904 trans and a 7¼ rear end with a large bolt pattern. I don’t have much history about this car so I don’t know what all this came out of.

I also have a donor car. It is 74 v8 Duster column shift. I want swap out the good running 340 attached to a 904 trans along with an 8¼ Sure Grip rear end that’s in it.

Can some of you that have done a swap like this tell of anything special I’ll need?

Also how hard is to pull the engine and trans together?


And please no post about needing a stronger drivetrain, I’m on a budget and this going to street driven car so I’m OK with what it is for now

I did this swap in '72. Engine, bell-housing, tranny, driveshaft and 8.75" rear from a '71 Demon donor car into a '64 Valiant 2-door sedan.

The left fromt motor mount was different, but I made the early mount work; can't remember how.

I used EVERYTHING (it was a 4-speed car and my '64 V8 Valiant was 3-speed manual.)

I could NOT get the engine to drop into place with the 340 manifolds on the engine; they hit the inner fender panels on both sides. I put on a set of cheap fenderwell (Hedman) headers.

The driveshaft worked without cutting.

The rear end bolted into place with no modifications (8.75")

The bottom radiator hose conection was on the wrong side of the radiator, so I just ran a long hose and some 90-degree bends over to the other side.

The speedometer cable had to be spliced (it worked!) and the oil pressure gauge had the wrong kind of sender.

Hope this helps!!!
FUN CAR!!!
:wack:

 

[C130 Chief]

All A-body rears are 51.4" EXCEPT the 9" drum 7 1/4" SBP axles typically found on pre-73 slant cars.

A 1966 speedo cable housing should have the threaded cups on both ends to work with the later trans and earlier speedometer.

 

[VDART]

take pictures-- to assist yourself-- your swap sounds pretty straight forward-- a 318 for a 340-- you should have all the parts already at your disposal.


not sure if the cars wheel base are the same, if so- your donor car has the drive shaft you need (8.25 vs 7.25)

if both sets of rear springs are the same (used)--- leave the rears attached & unbolt the rear shackle & the front mount-- then roll the assembly out/in-- much easier than lifting!!
Lawrence

 

[jacksdodges]

Before you take the hood off I marked mine by drilling a hole between the two bolts on the hinge. Then you just use it for a guide. Made it easy to line it all back up.

 

[Bill Dedman]

take pictures-- to assist yourself-- your swap sounds pretty straight forward-- a 318 for a 340-- you should have all the parts already at your disposal.


not sure if the cars wheel base are the same, if so- your donor car has the drive shaft you need (8.25 vs 7.25)

if both sets of rear springs are the same (used)--- leave the rears attached & unbolt the rear shackle & the front mount-- then roll the assembly out/in-- much easier than lifting!!
Lawrence

The really weird part of my swap was that the driveshaft was the right length but it should not have fit because the donor car (1971 Demon) had a 108" wheelbase and my '64 Valiant had a 106".

WHY WAS IT THE RIGHT LENGTH?

It should have been too long.

But, it wqn't; it fit perfectly, so I used it.

Go figure...:wack:

 

[Bill Dedman]

Before you take the hood off I marked mine by drilling a hole between the two bolts on the hinge. Then you just use it for a guide. Made it easy to line it all back up.

That is great advice because you can use drill bits stuck in the holes you drilled for a perfect re-alignment.

Worked for me...:blob:

 

[Valkman]

tspringspictures-- to assist yourself-- your swap sounds pretty straight forward-- a 318 for a 340-- you should have all the parts already at your disposal.


not sure if the cars wheel base are the same, if so- your donor car has the drive shaft you need (8.25 vs 7.25)

if both sets of rear springs are the same (used)--- leave the rears attached & unbolt the rear shackle & the front mount-- then roll the assembly out/in-- much easier than lifting!!
Lawrence

That's great advice, the springs on the Cuda are HD so I'll keep them on the car.

 

[rj72cda]

I dont care what anyone tells you if you are going to have teh engine out or really anytime teh BEST BEST BEST thing i ever did to an old car is to get a full suspension rebuild it will make more pleasure driving than adding 50 HP. rebuild the front end and if you can get it do tubular uppers but MOST DEFF do the front end skip the rest

 

[Valkman]

I got the drive train installed and I thought I'd update my results. The rear end and drive shaft (from the 8 1/2") fit just fine with problems. The 318 had the new style aluminum water pump and the radiator (which I'm sure came another car) lower outlet was on the same side. The only real modification was the motor mounts. The left (drivers) side just needed about 3 washers, and for the right I just made a spacer with a piece of black pipe and used a longer bolt.

I've attached a pictures of my motor installed.

 

[Bill Dedman]

I got the drive train installed and I thought I'd update my results. The rear end and drive shaft (from the 8 1/2") fit just fine with problems. The 318 had the new style aluminum water pump and the radiator (which I'm sure came another car) lower outlet was on the same side. The only real modification was the motor mounts. The left (drivers) side just needed about 3 washers, and for the right I just made a spacer with a piece of black pipe and used a longer bolt.

I've attached a pictures of my motor installed.

Looks like you did a great job fitting it in there!


Tell us about the exhaust manifolds, please.:blob:

 

[Valkman]

Looks like you did a great job fitting it in there!


Tell us about the exhaust manifolds, please.:blob:

That will be another thread. When it I get it all sorted out I plan to do a "how to" to dicuss the ins and outs because there seems to be so much scattered information about this topic on the forum.


One other thing I thought I should point out. My car originally had a floor shifter and the 65's still used the cable shifters (with 2 cables) that I don’t think will work with the newer tranny. In order to convert to a newer factory linkage shifter you would have to route the linkage on top of the hump cut a big hole in the floor and then you'll need to cover it with a full console (like Chrysler did from 66-on cars) to cover it up. I went with an aftermarket Hurst Racket floor shifter that works with the later linkage transmission with single cable so it only requires a single small hole. I think it looks closer to the original shifter anyway, beside I can "slam gears" with the Hurts!