Best tire set up - 1973 Dart 440.

[72bluNblu]

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Good info on the wheel wells; do u know how wide a tire will work on the 68 fastback w/ the inner wheel wells just moved to the frame ? Like I said, I have 295 65`s under it now. Really not interested in moving the springs inboard. Looks like it would give about 2" more tire. ????

A mini-tub without the spring relocation? Wouldn't buy you much. The springs and frame rails are in the same place on all of these cars, it's the outer wheel well and width of the quarters that's different. I know that on my Duster the inner well is slightly more limiting than the springs with the offset hangers, but, it's not enough to allow for a wider tire. I only have about 3/8" to the springs with my 295's, and the addition of a rear sway bar kept the tires from rubbing on the inner wells. Moving the inner wells to the frame like with a mini-tub would give the 295's some space, but, you couldn't go any wider because of the spring clearance.

Pretty much no point in doing a mini-tub without the 3" relocation, just like there's no point in doing the 3" relocation without the mini-tub.

 

[74SwingerA]

I like the idea of a A833 under there but I figured with the cost and the price to have the transmission done right too it would be well outside my price point. I decided to go with a Cope Racing Trans 727- Plan to order that after the S60 next month, either going with the 4.10 or 3.55 gear set but not sure yet.

Listen to 72blu - he knows what he is talking about. Just spoke to a guy locally about wheels and he basically told me the same thing he did. Guy knows his stuff.

 

[famous bob]

A mini-tub without the spring relocation? Wouldn't buy you much. The springs and frame rails are in the same place on all of these cars, it's the outer wheel well and width of the quarters that's different. I know that on my Duster the inner well is slightly more limiting than the springs with the offset hangers, but, it's not enough to allow for a wider tire. I only have about 3/8" to the springs with my 295's, and the addition of a rear sway bar kept the tires from rubbing on the inner wells. Moving the inner wells to the frame like with a mini-tub would give the 295's some space, but, you couldn't go any wider because of the spring clearance.

Pretty much no point in doing a mini-tub without the 3" relocation, just like there's no point in doing the 3" relocation without the mini-tub.

Not so on my 68, the inner wheel house is at least 2" outside the frame, but u are right about the springs now that I think about it. I have about a good 1/2" clearance on my springs/caltrac monoleafs. Matter of fact , that's about what I have everywhere, maybe a hair more on the front of the tires. But I`m only running 8" rims ( the minimum according to the dealers) w/ 22lbs. of air on the street. They seem to be wearing all the way across/flat. Its not a corner carver w/ a drag racing front end under it anyway. Just a in ur face type hotrod that looks stock, "well almost"!

 

[72bluNblu]

Not so on my 68, the inner wheel house is at least 2" outside the frame, but u are right about the springs now that I think about it. I have about a good 1/2" clearance on my springs/caltrac monoleafs. Matter of fact , that's about what I have everywhere, maybe a hair more on the front of the tires. But I`m only running 8" rims ( the minimum according to the dealers) w/ 22lbs. of air on the street. They seem to be wearing all the way across/flat. Its not a corner carver w/ a drag racing front end under it anyway. Just a in ur face type hotrod that looks stock, "well almost"!

So, what I meant wasn't that the inner tub and frame rails were in the same place, it was that the inner tub and frame rail location is the same on all of the A-bodies 67-76. Ie, on all of the A-bodies it's about 2.25" to 2.5" from the inner tub to the frame rail depending on where you measure. Otherwise we wouldn't even have to mini-tub our cars, because the inner tub would already be even with the frame.

But, even if you have the offset spring hangers, the springs aren't perfectly even with the outside of the frame rail, and the springs are 2.5" wide, so, the springs would still be in the way. You might gain a little clearance because you need more clearance to the inner tub than the springs because of the way the suspension can move, but, not enough to run a significantly wider tire.

 

[famous bob]

So, what I meant wasn't that the inner tub and frame rails were in the same place, it was that the inner tub and frame rail location is the same on all of the A-bodies 67-76. Ie, on all of the A-bodies it's about 2.25" to 2.5" from the inner tub to the frame rail depending on where you measure. Otherwise we wouldn't even have to mini-tub our cars, because the inner tub would already be even with the frame.

But, even if you have the offset spring hangers, the springs aren't perfectly even with the outside of the frame rail, and the springs are 2.5" wide, so, the springs would still be in the way. You might gain a little clearance because you need more clearance to the inner tub than the springs because of the way the suspension can move, but, not enough to run a significantly wider tire.

Agree.

 

[74SwingerA]

@72bluNblu I have gone ahead and decided to go with the 18x9'' Rims. I have gone ahead and picked out some rims and I was hoping if you would tell me if these would work or not with my application. I am going to have the QA1 Tubular UAC and LAC along witha 1/2'' Spring relocation OR a possible mini tub in the rear. Me and my father have spoken and we will be rolling the fender lips and if need be we will shave the fenders.

These are the two rims I am leaning towards -

Wheels for Sale Website = BOLT PATTERN: 5x114.3, offset of 35 and a hub of 73.
OR
Wheels for Sale Website - Same bolt and offset but a hub of 72.6

I will probably run Hankook Ventus V12 at 275/35z/R18 - Hankook Ventus V12 evo2

What are your thoughts?

 

[72bluNblu]

With 18x9's the 35mm offset should work fine, that's what I run on my Duster. You may need some spacers to adjust your offset, it will depend on how your offset is changed by the Wilwood brakes. On my car I run Dr. Diff's 13" cobra style kit, which adds 5/16" to the track width. And I run a 3mm spacer on top of that, so, compared to a 73+ disk my effective offset ends up being ~27mm. The wilwood kit you said you ordered has a .00 offset change according to them, so, my initial guess would be that you might want to look into some 5 or 8mm spacers.

The hub bore may be an issue for you. It will definitely be an issue on the VN701's, and it will probably be an issue on the Konig's. The problem, and this is why I don't like Wilwoods most recent set of brake kits, is that they have a very large hub diameter. Even larger than the already large stock BBP mopar disks. This is the diagram for the wilwood disks you bought

You can see they list the hub diameter at the base as being 3.1". That's huge. 78.7mm in fact. So, if that's true, you may have issues. Not only with the rims you picked, but A LOT of aftermarket rims, because 73mm is a fairly standard hub bore.

So, if you have those brakes already what I would do is measure the hub diameter. If it really is 3.1" or 78.7mm where the rims will sit flat, more than likely you will have to figure on having the hub bore's on your wheels opened up. I did this on mine, not at the base but I did have to have my rims opened up to 73mm all the way through. The only thing with the wilwoods is that there's a pretty significant taper to the hub as well, so, you may be able to get around this. For example, if you have to run a 5mm spacer, you could measure the hub diameter at 5mm and 8mm or so out from the mounting surface and see what that is. If it's 73mm or less you might be ok, because you'll probably need a thin spacer and that might keep you from machining the hub bores.

Your other option, if you just ordered those brakes and haven't installed them yet, might to be consider returning them. If you go with an 18" rim you can run larger than 11" disks, and the hub on the Dr. Diff 13" kit I run is 2.7".

 

[74SwingerA]

@72bluNblu Thanks once again for your expertise. Actually I have been just ordering parts because my father is currently enthralled with a '39 Chevy 1/2 ton and painting a friend of the families Suzuki Samurai that halls their camper. They actually just got back from Alaska for a year and now are living in the Caribbeans or some tropical island for the next. Must be nice! Aside from his schedule I was actually put on a project with my company to Maryland last month for the next 8 months so I wont get to even touch the car. My father and I have been doing webinar/skype meetings at his shop to discuss things as parts come in, which makes explaining a vision/idea to him hard haha.

So the Wilwoods will be going back it seems - checking with Dr.Diff it looks like the front/rear combo comes out to about even and I get a larger front rotor anyway. I just have to wait for my dad to ship them back to Jeggs. Once I get the return I will order the 13'' kit and 11.7 rears. Do you know if Dr. Diff does a 13'' rear brake kit too or if they would be willing to make one? Probably better to ask them but you seem to know their products well. I'll probably call them tomorrow.

Do you know what spacer you bought and where?

As always thank you - If you ever come up towards where me and my dad are working the car (Chico/Redding area) We'd be happy to show you around the shop and get you some food (Obviously when I get back from the East haha. Sure my dad would be confused if I wasn't there).

Cody.

 

[Ottmundr]

@72bluNblu I have gone ahead and decided to go with the 18x9'' Rims. I have gone ahead and picked out some rims and I was hoping if you would tell me if these would work or not with my application. I am going to have the QA1 Tubular UAC and LAC along witha 1/2'' Spring relocation OR a possible mini tub in the rear. Me and my father have spoken and we will be rolling the fender lips and if need be we will shave the fenders.

These are the two rims I am leaning towards -

Wheels for Sale Website = BOLT PATTERN: 5x114.3, offset of 35 and a hub of 73.
OR
Wheels for Sale Website - Same bolt and offset but a hub of 72.6

I will probably run Hankook Ventus V12 at 275/35z/R18 - Hankook Ventus V12 evo2

What are your thoughts?

I like the second wheel design. Reminds me of...

 

[72bluNblu]

@72bluNblu Thanks once again for your expertise. Actually I have been just ordering parts because my father is currently enthralled with a '39 Chevy 1/2 ton and painting a friend of the families Suzuki Samurai that halls their camper. They actually just got back from Alaska for a year and now are living in the Caribbeans or some tropical island for the next. Must be nice! Aside from his schedule I was actually put on a project with my company to Maryland last month for the next 8 months so I wont get to even touch the car. My father and I have been doing webinar/skype meetings at his shop to discuss things as parts come in, which makes explaining a vision/idea to him hard haha.

So the Wilwoods will be going back it seems - checking with Dr.Diff it looks like the front/rear combo comes out to about even and I get a larger front rotor anyway. I just have to wait for my dad to ship them back to Jeggs. Once I get the return I will order the 13'' kit and 11.7 rears. Do you know if Dr. Diff does a 13'' rear brake kit too or if they would be willing to make one? Probably better to ask them but you seem to know their products well. I'll probably call them tomorrow.

Do you know what spacer you bought and where?

As always thank you - If you ever come up towards where me and my dad are working the car (Chico/Redding area) We'd be happy to show you around the shop and get you some food (Obviously when I get back from the East haha. Sure my dad would be confused if I wasn't there).

Cody.

No problem! And thanks!

Yeah I really like the Dr Diff kits. They add a little track width in the front, but +35 is a pretty popular 18x9" rim offset so it works out fine. I'm not aware of him having a 13" rear kit, I know I was planning on going to his 11.7" kit when I get the chance. But you could call him, I know that he's done some kits before that weren't on his website. I'm sure Cass could put something together, or at least discuss options with you.

These are the 3mm spacers I run with my Dr. Diff 13" kit up front. This company makes a bunch of different widths, they're good quality stuff.
3mm (1/8 inch) | Hubcentric Flat Wheel Spacers | 5x114.3 5x4.5 | 70.5 / 70.3 Hub | eBay