BEWARE of "PA Dart Guy"

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BigSlim

BigSlim

"One Day At a Time"
Joined
Dec 17, 2008
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Location
Forest Hill, Md
OK Fellers, here’s the deal. Alan a.k.a. PA Dart Guy sold my son a 68 Valiant, $500 a real good deal. During the transaction he told us that he had a “RUNNING’ 1978 440 out of a motor home that he would let us have for $400. I told him that we would get in touch with him after Christmas.

We went to look at the motor on Sat, January 10th. When we got there Alan explained that the motor had some water in it because it was stored outside and had lost its cover. I told Alan that this build was my sons first build that I wanted something that I didn’t have to do a whole lot to, rings and bearings on the very outside. He said that any rust should be minimal and could be easily cleaned with a ball hone. We settled on $300 and took the motor home.

On Tuesday, January 13th we put the motor on the engine stand and started the disassembly. Keep in mind my 13.5 year old son is doing the wrenching, good father son stuff one would think? We took off the intake and valley pan gasket. The gasket had RTV in all the right places and needed coaxing to get off. We removed the valve covers and the rocker arm assemblies. The right hand head was the first to come off and sure enough there was a little water damage in the 4 hole. No problem, little WD40 and 5 minutes with the ball hone and 98% of it cleaned right up, things were really looking good!

We moved on to the left side where our problems began. When CJ went to remove the head bolts none of them were torqued and 2 or 3 were only finger tight. When we removed the head I noticed that there was NO HEAD GASKET!! I knew right there that we were going to have problems. In the 3 hole the piston was all the way up but had some evidence of water damage. I rotated the piston to the bottom of the hole. What I found is this; Looks like the wrist pin made a gouge in the cylinder wall 3/8” wide and .060 deep give or take , running to within about 1 ¼ from the top of the hole. There is no way that this motor was a RUNNING motor. Someone knew it was A.F.U. and went to the trouble to put it back together so it could be sold as a good motor!!!!! Just so happens that the person who got taken advantage of is my 13 year old son. He paid for some of this motor with money that he earned this summer cutting grass. I make damn sure that he works his butt off and he knows that doing this kind of stuff is a benefit and privilege resulting from hard work and good grades.

I called Alan on Tuesday evening less than 72 hours after buying the motor and told him about our problem. I told him that we wanted our money back because there was NO WAY that the thing was running without a head gasket and a big ole gouge in the #3 cylinder. He said that he would talk to his friend and partner at Chews Towing in Oxford PA, who apparently financed the motor and get back to me. I waited until Thursday and tried to call him again and left a message. As of Saturday evening Alan has not made an attempt to contact me or my son.

Alan, it’s not OK to take advantage of young guys or girls that are trying to get started in this hobby!! Especially a fellow FABO member! If something isn't as advertised it needs to be made right. I hope that this is all a huge misunderstanding and Alan contacts us and we can figure out a solution to this problem.

Here is the link that was used when he tried to sell the motor.
http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=49430

Here is the link from when he bought the motor
http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=44400
 
Very interesting. Too early to make judgement so i'll hold mine for now and see if Alan chimes in here. Don't take me wrong. On what you have told us it sounds to be credible. Great that you and the boy are doing it together. Proud of you. Could be a good lesson for him on the basics of honesty. I'll keep watching. Glad there is no name calling.
 
Hopefully he wasn't the one who pulled the head...... No doubt that was not a running engine but it may have been misrepresented to him. Let's see if he mans up and does the right thing.
 
WOW- I've met alan once at a local show he had seemed ok, but I was also on the line to buy this same deal. I had a few PM's back and forth with alan about the car and when I could come to look at it. The day I was going to look at it, I called allan and he wasn't home so I left a message. He never called back. I later found out the car had sold by checking the post for the car. No call back no PM, that left a bad taste in my mouth.
 
It's been one day shy of two weeks and still no word from Alan, aka Pa Dart Guy. So it is what it is!!! Now I have to do what I didn't want to do and that is to go completely through this motor.

Here are some pics.

DSC00487.jpg


Loose wrist pin that caused the damage. I'll bet it ran real quiet too!!!:angry7:

DSC00486.jpg


Back side of the hole also has damage

DSC00489.jpg


Thanks for working with me here and doing the right thing Alan.(I know you are lurking). $120.00 bucks for a sleeve would have been a good faith gesture. I hope that we run into one another a Cecil Co Drag strip this summer and have an opportunity to discuss this matter face to face. Its great having to look over your shoulder after you have screwed your friends and neighbors, isn't it?
 
Slim sorry to hear this wasn't taken care of, I hate that sh*t like this has to happen. Tell the boy to keep his chin up.
 
That sucks, PA Dart Guy hasn't loggen in since 1/10, hope he mans up to this. On the other hand, you still got a 440 for $300, some people can't even find one so good luck with your rebuild!
 
As well, sorry BigSlim and your son, that is bad business! I hope your son won't get too down about it and the project will keep on track as you origionally planned.

I have a 440 I built about 13 years ago, It maybe has 10,000 miles on it. It's been stored in a garage and in a trailer since. The other day I cleaned out the furniture around it because I thought I would pull the valve covers and pull off the rocker arms to give the valve springs a break. I found lots of RUST inside, the rocker shafts look terrible. It really upsets me! It was a fresh build with new pistons and Comp. Cam. It still cold areound here, I think I will try to dig it out of the trailer when it warms up a bit and see just how much damage has been done inside.
 
He's Learning At A Young Age. Be Careful.
All Might Not Be Lost.if Thats The Only Bad Cylinder You Could Have It Sleeved.
Check With Some Machine Shops For Prices.
If You Do End Up Stuck With It.

Good Luck Young Man.
 
I can't line up on either side of this one.
Somebody somewhere heard the knock and saw the smoke, pulled one head and told the customer what they found (walking wrist pin). The customer says put it back in one pile and I'll go in another direction with it.
I can remember feeling sad for folks who were many miles from home when their RV died.
The fellow who sold this engine to you may or may not have a clue as to its history.
I agree with the previous poster who said @ 400.00 you got your moneys worth.
Probably already ticked someone off so I may as well continue...
I believe in God, and omens. I dont believe junior needs a 440 in a A-body as his first wheels.
 
I'm with Redfish too. Just my 2 cents worth. My 17 year old daughter's first car lasted 5 weeks before she totaled it. $500.00 clunker but didn't last long. Now she has a $5,000 car she's paying for and drives much safer. Maybe have junior drive a beater while working on his mopar. After 12 months with the beater switch to the mopar. Gives you time to work on the car anyway.
 
I feel bad for you and your son for getting ripped off. I know I'm 16 and in school, and I may not have an A-body project going yet, but I am constantly looking at parts to finish my rampage. I can only work during the summer and have to plan what I am going to spend the money on before I even make it, so that the things I want to get done, do get done. I haven't gotten bad parts from people yet but I know it's a bad feeling. When you work hard for your money and it's wasted, well it kind of kills your interest for a while. Tell him not to give up though, and post some pics of you two and your project. Hopefully things get sorted out, nothing worse than someone running off with your money and you not getting what you expected.
 
Come on PA Dart Guy. Speak up. Let's hear your story
 
RedFish said:
I can't line up on either side of this one.


I dont believe junior needs a 440 in a A-body as his first wheels.
Click to expand...



I agree with you on the first part, Im on the fence as well.

The second part, not so much. My first legally driven vehicle was a 73 Camaro that had a balls out 66 327 with a 4 speed and neck snapping posi. I say build the kid a stroker! :snakeman:
 
you know Ive got a 440/727 lined up in pa. to buy...told the seller want to hear run...no exhaust pipes hooked up on the car...straight pipes...their asking $500 for the 440 motor and trans complete...you've got me thinking....hard
 
Sorry to hear about it. At leat you got parts, I looked at buying something from a FABO & didn't even get that.......
 
Sorry to hear you were misled on the sale of that engine. I would have removed the oil pan and looked up in every cylinder before I handed over any cash. When I bought my 340 block last year I took an inside micrometer and measured every single bore in multiple places to make sure it really was standard bore before any money came out of my pocket.
 
340sFastback said:
Sorry to hear you were misled on the sale of that engine. I would have removed the oil pan and looked up in every cylinder before I handed over any cash. When I bought my 340 block last year I took an inside micrometer and measured every single bore in multiple places to make sure it really was standard bore before any money came out of my pocket.
Click to expand...

I would not have done that the first time.. But I would now....
 
It was Jan 10th there was some water in the block and it was stored outside!!
Doesn't MD get cold?If the block is not cracked you will be lucky.Sorry to hear about your bad luck.Alan needs to make this right.
Maybe someone on FABO can help your boy out.I have a 400 block crank and rods your boy could have if you were closer.
Jim
 
This is a wake up call to anyone who is dealing parts. This sour economy and lack of money has netted some bad deals going around. I have been 'spanked' pretty good on a few myself lately and I have some crummy parts here to prove it.

Perhaps it is time to really look into a deal and make sure its all good prior to money exchanging hands. Sounds kind of paraniod but it is what it is. I dealt with what I thought were upstanding people who had some itegrity but found out I was a tad wrong in my assumptions. Things like this do happen from time to time but I wonder how many more people have had rotten deals in the recent past.

Enough about my rabble. I feel for you on this motor bud. Its your kid that is most the focus here. How does he feel about this whole thing? This mistake can be put to rest and the repairs can be made and it will all go away but what will your son get out of it in the end? Best of luck to you and I hope you guys can work through this and post a nice car with a big motor in the near future.
Chas.
 
I appreciate everyone's input. Most of you have valid point and it boils down to buyer beware.

68383GTS, thank you for your kind offer,but its not necessary.I'm going to have the block sleeved and we will go from there.

$300.00 isn't a lot of money unless you don't have $300.00. It's not about the money. It's the PRINCIPLE!!! "If you don't stand for something you will fall for anything." I won't take up any more band width in regards to this issue. Lets get back to building, driving and racing our A-Bodies only.

ChasRam, Great post - Thank You!!

Brad
 
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