Blown alcohol small block?

[Duane]

They made the switch to methanol as it is so easy to get around here from your choice of vendors which are friends that race. I’m pretty sure they all get it out of nearby Ohio. The price I pay includes top end lube which is in when I pick it up approximately 5-7 miles from my house. Sometimes I pick up one barrel sometimes two. I also buy my Penn Grade oil from him. Like I have said I gave up the street scene over 30 years ago but if I did still play two years ago E85 is at my local Sheetz station five miles from my house.

You mention that you like certain oils. Can you talk a little about that. Are there specific formulations that are better to use with alcohol(methanol)

 

[Duane]

I'd use E85 I'd I could get it. In a heart beat. If you can get it, I'd use it. But...don't know the laws in Canada but down here, it doesn't have to be 85%. It can be much less so you have to test it to verify what you're getting from the pump.

I live in a border city near Niagarafalls New York.
There is a local Mobil one that has E85 all year round and he is the sole supplier to the local military base who's vehicles are all E85.
He tells me there is a summer and a winter blend. The winter blend is E70 which they tell me is brought out the end of March.
I also checked with custom who have no problems with me bring that fuel over the border. I can also get E85 from all my local race fuel distributors as well but at a much higher price. Those same distributors have very attractive prices on alcohol fuel and going with a drum, you know what your getting.

 

[pittsburghracer]

You mention that you like certain oils. Can you talk a little about that. Are there specific formulations that are better to use with alcohol(methanol)

I started using Kendal Oil over 40 years ago. Over the years it had gone from through about three name changes. Still green, still great formula. Several of my friends have tried the new kids on the block but usually come back home to what is now Penn Grade.

 

[Duane]

View attachment 1715426556


I started using Kendal Oil over 40 years ago. Over the years it had gone from through about three name changes. Still green, still great formula. Several of my friends have tried the new kids on the block but usually come back home to what is now Penn Grade.

I will rephrase my question. Is there something specific about why you use this oil with alcohol or is this just your personal preference for oil.

 

[pittsburghracer]

Not all year round but in the late months like low 50,s high 40,s
Would be the worst case scenario I guess

In those temps again if I was driving my high performance car on the street E85. Drag race only alcohol but that’s just me. I’ve raced with Alcohol in late October at Norwalk in 20 degree weather. Do I like it no, will I do it again yes. I’m not guaranteed 40 more years of racing so it’s go time. Lol.

 

[pittsburghracer]

I will rephrase my question. Is there something specific about why you use this oil with alcohol or is this just your personal preference for oil.

Man you aren’t reading between the lines. When I drain my oil after 3 months of racing it looks great. Other guys have tried other crap and it mixes like crap with alcohol or gas. But if you run your car cold or rich God himself can’t help you. You are going to hurt parts.

 

[Duane]

Going to jump around here some. ALL combustible fumes are poisonous but alcohol fumes not only stink but also make your eyes water, bad. Watery eyes and cutting a good light don't mix well. Plastic 8 gallon fuel cell which I removed the foam. Barry Grant 400 fuel pump set at 5.5-6 pounds pressure. Number 10 black fiber line ran to front, number 8 to front and back of carb out or regulator. I do not use a block heater as the system I posted above works for me. My son has a water heater in his block that goes into a soft plug and are sold by jegs. If I prime my carb, give it 3 pumps to the floor mine starts well for me so I use this technique for my first start up of the day. If it's 20-30 degrees out I use the above technique plus I may dump a small amount of gas into the carb. Nothing special between races or at the end of season. Float are Polyurethane and listed for alcohol use at Summit. Stainless steel or titanium needle and seat. If I had a toilet set-up I WOULD have a primer plus system to aid heating and to save fuel but I don't.

I am posting this just to share with others reading this thread. It is not directed at you. This was a private conversation I had with another member who told me how he uses alcohol. I took photos of the conversation so that I could show it.

 

[Duane]

Man you aren’t reading between the lines. When I drain my oil after 3 months of racing it looks great. Other guys have tried other crap and it mixes like crap with alcohol or gas. But if you run your car cold or rich God himself can’t help you. You are going to hurt parts.

Ok thanks

 

[pittsburghracer]

I will add one thing to keep in mind. If you can’t tune a carb or won’t add a EGT system to at least one header tube you are better off with gas. Some guys are lucky they can start a lawnmower without flooding it so with the volume of fuel you are dealing with, alcohol will pollute the engine like in the example above.

 

[Duane]

I will add one thing to keep in mind. If you can’t tune a carb or won’t add a EGT system to at least one header tube you are better off with gas. Some guys are lucky they can start a lawnmower without flooding it so with the volume of fuel you are dealing with, alcohol will pollute the engine like in the example above.

Would you say that an egt is a better way to gauge the mixture than an oxygen sensor. Reason I ask is I will be running a power grid system and msd just released a new dual channel ntk type oxygen sensor kit for there grid. They claim the ntk sensor are much more accurate with alcohol fuel and that alcohol ruins the Bosch style sensor. The kit is pricey though. I hVe lots of friends wanting to go fuel injection. I want to stay carburetion cause I can fix it lol.

 

[pittsburghracer]

Would you say that an egt is a better way to gauge the mixture than an oxygen sensor. Reason I ask is I will be running a power grid system and msd just released a new dual channel ntk type oxygen sensor kit for there grid. They claim the ntk sensor are much more accurate with alcohol fuel and that alcohol ruins the Bosch style sensor. The kit is pricey though. I hVe lots of friends wanting to go fuel injection. I want to stay carburetion cause I can fix it lol.

I got mine very close with a O2 sensor but really zero’d in on it when I added a EGT to my RacePak. I never harmed an O2 sensor but like I said I run my stuff lean.

 

[yellow rose]

I will rephrase my question. Is there something specific about why you use this oil with alcohol or is this just your personal preference for oil.

Here is the RULE for using alcohol based fuels. If you violate them, you will be punished by dirty, junk oil, an oil that is coming apart during use, and a mutitude of other oil related failures, that don't look like oil failures. I'm not even going into ring seal, because I don't feel like typing a complete "scientific" expose on it.

The RULE is this: never EVER use a Group IV or V synthetic base oil with alcohol. Some guys claim they run synthetic base oils but they don't. They don't know the difference between base oils. You should learn for yourself rather than take my word for it.

You CAN use (on alcohol based fuels this is what I use) a blended Group IV or V base oil with a high TBN mineral oil developed for alcohol based fuels. It's not as expensive as a real, full synthetic, but it is formulated for the more than double amount of alcohol it takes to make the same power that gasoline does.

Saying synthetic on the bottle doesn't mean a thing. The United States Supreme Court fucked that up for everyone in this country.

 

[Duane]

Here is the RULE for using alcohol based fuels. If you violate them, you will be punished by dirty, junk oil, an oil that is coming apart during use, and a mutitude of other oil related failures, that don't look like oil failures. I'm not even going into ring seal, because I don't feel like typing a complete "scientific" expose on it.

The RULE is this: never EVER use a Group IV or V synthetic base oil with alcohol. Some guys claim they run synthetic base oils but they don't. They don't know the difference between base oils. You should learn for yourself rather than take my word for it.

You CAN use (on alcohol based fuels this is what I use) a blended Group IV or V base oil with a high TBN mineral oil developed for alcohol based fuels. It's not as expensive as a real, full synthetic, but it is formulated for the more than double amount of alcohol it takes to make the same power that gasoline does.

Saying synthetic on the bottle doesn't mean a thing. The United States Supreme Court fucked that up for everyone in this country.

Yes that's what I was trying to ask Pittsburgh. I thought there were specially formulated oils specifically for use with alcohol.
Thanks for the post.

 

[Duane]

Here is the RULE for using alcohol based fuels. If you violate them, you will be punished by dirty, junk oil, an oil that is coming apart during use, and a mutitude of other oil related failures, that don't look like oil failures. I'm not even going into ring seal, because I don't feel like typing a complete "scientific" expose on it.

The RULE is this: never EVER use a Group IV or V synthetic base oil with alcohol. Some guys claim they run synthetic base oils but they don't. They don't know the difference between base oils. You should learn for yourself rather than take my word for it.

You CAN use (on alcohol based fuels this is what I use) a blended Group IV or V base oil with a high TBN mineral oil developed for alcohol based fuels. It's not as expensive as a real, full synthetic, but it is formulated for the more than double amount of alcohol it takes to make the same power that gasoline does.

Saying synthetic on the bottle doesn't mean a thing. The United States Supreme Court fucked that up for everyone in this country.

Here is a good 3 part YouTube series on racing with alcohol.

 

[Garrett Ellison]

I'm loving the $3.06/gallon bulk fuel price. Instead of going through with a separate fuel system gasoline, would it be feasible to use VP or Rocket regular unleaded fuel and mix your own M80 to M90 fuel to both warm up and run on?

 

[Duane]

I'm loving the $3.06/gallon bulk fuel price. Instead of going through with a separate fuel system gasoline, would it be feasible to use VP or Rocket regular unleaded fuel and mix your own M80 to M90 fuel to both warm up and run on?

Your referring to the octane?

 

[Garrett Ellison]

No, referring to a fuel known as M85, basically the same thing as e85 but methanol instead of ethanol. I came across some older blogs about it were some racers were really enthusiastic about it but it seems to have been upstaged by e85.