Body work /paint prep tips

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fredsmedina

fredsmedina

6 Dart 7 MOPAR OR NOCAR
Joined
Aug 29, 2009
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Sacramento / Elk Grove CA
Starting bodywork on my dart this week. any tips for me? all of the panels are alligned pretty good right now. there already seems to be some bondo on the rear quarters. and i'll probably need to use a little bondo in other areas of the car. I've never done any body work at all before. So any tips would be helpful!not going for show quality bodywork. Just want it to overall look straight. I should shoot the whole car with an epoxy primer before I begin any body work. right? going to be painting it a gloss silver metallic..
 
concentrate on one panel at a time,grind out old filler because A)you don,t know what it is or how long it's been there B)you don't know what's under it. remove any trim before you start nickel looks real bad with orbital marks on it,get an old fender or door and practice every step of the way,trim removal,sanding,grinding,mixing/applying filler priming,putty,blocking get a feel for pressures and patterns and most importantly be PATIENT good bodywork takes time and skill,skill can be developed,patience has to be learned.Also go to any of the other resto threads and read every word/study all pictures good work requires following a procedure/following steps without skipping any,after all good looking body/paint is all prep work.
 
What grit do you start with..my a body has no rust..just a few small dents..do you wet sand first ? is there a good book or web site for this..

Ian.
 
Ian,really depends on what you're trying to do.I stay away from orbital sanders as much as I can,prefer to hand block,it's slower but gives nicer job depending on starting cond,remember don't sand with your fingers always use a soft block or hard block and avioid making ripples or finger grooves,what coarse depends on paint cond you don't want to cut to deep and make extra work,there are all kinds of books for this.I think maybe some are available through HP publications(the comp. that publishes the Larry Shephard books)try amazon or try the library thats where I got my first one.Also try Can.Tire maybe Chilton's.
 
Oh,yeah save the wet sanding for the end,start coarse(dry) and finish wet.
 
Strip any old filler off. I would do one panel at a time, Strip it to bare metal, etch or epoxy primer, then either 2K primer or polyester. Then move on to the next panel.

When all the panels are primed spray some guide coat and start blocking. I go with 180 for the first round. High spots can be tapped down, Low spots can be fixed with a 2 part putty (one part putties shrink to much.)

Reprime and block again (and again) I work my way up to 800 grit wet. 180,220,320,600 wet, 800 wet.
 
Thanks for the fast response.

the kid's car, for all intents, has no rust and the existing paint is very good..excellent, if you factor in it age..

It has three stripes..one going down each side and a rear one.

I was going to take a hair dryer and pull off each stripe. Remove the badges and chrome.

I understand the concept of blocks..do you use the ones that are flexible like what eastwood or I have several hard rubber that I use for wood.

I have been told about paint strippers like I use on wood..but for cars. Does this leave giant mess ?

Do I need to go down to bare metal or just rough up the existing paint ? I will use a rattle can if expose bare metal.

I was told that under 200 was a no-no..but I am not sure if the guy telling me had ever painted a car :) ...so if I follow the above, I am ok.

Do I sand blast between the front door and car since you cannot get a sander in there..and do I take off the trunk ? Or just over spray that as well..

Thanks
ian.
 
You can use paint stripper if you like but its messy. I grind the spots I know need filler and D/A the rest of the panel to bare metal with 80. I wouldnt use primer in cans.

Technically you can paint over the existing paint job if its in good shape, No checking, cracking or peeling. If thats what you plan to do, You can fix what needs to be fixed , Prime and block those areas (use a 2K primer) and paint it.

We do quick jobs like that at the shop I work at often. I D/A the car with 320 to prep it and paint over the 320. No blocking, no wet sanding but these are quick jobs that dont really look that great.
 
Similiar to woodworking,soft blocks for contour work/hard for large flat,like Adam said if paint is good then judgement call,seen a lot of cars down to bare metal that didn't look so hot.My truck wasn't done this way paint is 8 years old and still flat/shiny.I would't blast doorjambs unless you're stripping whole car to bare body,clen the are remove any undercoat,oil,grease etc.sand the same as the rest.First time I would not use stripper or D/A sander but that's up to you.
Sidstruckfrontforad.jpg
 
Sorry nightshift is getting to me,as an example this truck was done in 02 and was not stripped to bare metal,and still looks good,and I drive it everyday.
 
Yes..I hated night shift..

What does D/A stand for ?

Why wouldn't use primer from a rattle can to hold you to the place where you are going to be painted ?

Thanks
ian.
 
D/A dual action,rattle can stuff will react with your other products and make a mess.Get a small cheap gun from princess auto(for example)and use compatable products(same line of).
 
thank grassy! I would be asking all of these same question. every single question that you've asked I was going to ask..

just makes it even easier for me to read about doing this stuff
 
Hello Fred,

The most important thing to remember is "have a little patience". You're not a seasoned pro like some of these guys. This project will take a little longer due to your present abilities. You will get faster with more practice.

The second most important thing to remember is use the right tools for the job at hand. When in doubt ask a question before proceeding. As you can see there are a lot of helping hands on this website.

And lastly, use good quality materials. Some of the stuff (repair material) out there shouldn't be used on a dog house.

I suggest you contact a body man in your area and ask him to show you the fundamentals of body repair, or better yet intern at a bump shop in your spare time, or take some classes at the local technical school.

Practice, practice , and practice some more.

FYI - I'm going to be smoothing out some 5" stretched quarters (wheel openings) on my '68 SS/AH Cuda in a week or two. Stay tuned for step by step pictures. It'll be interesting too because they are the quarter panels from J. A. Pan or Tie-one-on. One of those 3rd world quality product countries.(LOL)

sscuda
 
lol. i'll keep an eye out for that sscuda. Its too hard for me to take a body class or I would. I'm going to a university full time for mechanical engineering, and working part time as well..

i'll try getting in contact with a body guy in the area though.

From everything i'm reading, i'm thinking maybe better to plan on taking extra time on everything and push my target completion date a little later..

how hard is it to remove the front fenders? I know it should be pretty easy. The only reason i'm concerned about doing this is the allignment once i'm done.

so does anyone reccomment taking off or not taking off front fenders to paint the area inbetween the fenders and the engine bay?
 
Fred,

I understand about lack of time. I'm suffering from the same problem. A good education is more important at this juncture of your life.

In answer to your fender question. Removing the fenders (or other bolt on body panels) is easy. If you are unsure of where everything goes take pictures of each step of the removal process. Zip-Loc bag all the hardware and label it accordingly. Reverse the process when reattaching the body panel.

If you are going through for an engineering degree you already possess a certain amount of mechanical ability. This should be a piece of cake for you.

Re-alignment is only trial and error. It all takes practice.

I'll be hanging some carbon fiber body panels after the quarters are completed. There will be some step by step pictures of them as well.

Most importantly - Have fun!

sscuda
 
sscuda said:
Fred,
....Re-alignment is only trial and error. It all takes practice.
Click to expand...

how hard is it to actually re-align the panels though? for somebody who's never done it before. Is it true that it could take hours even for a trained professional to get them properly aligned?
 
Fred,

I wasn't planning on taking anything off unless I had to..I think it is a lot of work to re align everything..If you are woried .afterwards in the fall, buy one of theose "do it yourself" undercoating kits with a brand name fluid..i will be..

Yes, I have a sprayer and a compressor..so I will buy the same primer.

Will you be buying automotive paint with all the fun stuff like Cyanide hardeners? I am and haven't decided what I am going to use so I will be going to my potential supplier and ask for their product manual. It will tell you what products to use, how to prep including pre-washing, sand paper coarseness, temperatures, reducing (thinning) directions, etc..

This way, you will be able to speak somewhat intelligently on what reducer to use based on the temperature of your garage..

I have been told that the various books/manuals will make more sense once you read the product literature.

TIP I PICKED UP: If there is any chance of silicon wax on your car (and there is, trust me!), you must use a pre-cleaner to remove the wax or else you will smear it around when you sand. When you paint you will get "fish eyes" where the paint won't stick to silicon.

Thanks for all the input and I will ask more whan the time gets close.
ian.
 
fredsmedina said:
how hard is it to actually re-align the panels though? for somebody who's never done it before. Is it true that it could take hours even for a trained professional to get them properly aligned?
Click to expand...

The problems with panel reinstallation after paint is possible paint chipping on the edges, even if you tape them it can happen. Fenders aren't as bad as doors. It helps to have two people if painted.
Look at all the gaps before you take apart to see how aligned they are to begin with.
 
homecloned said:
The problems with panel reinstallation after paint is possible paint chipping on the edges, even if you tape them it can happen. Fenders aren't as bad as doors. It helps to have two people if painted.
Look at all the gaps before you take apart to see how aligned they are to begin with.
Click to expand...

the alignment isn't bad right now on the fenders, they line up nicely to the doors. Its far from perfect, but I can live with it, should I avoid removing fenders if possible? because I'm real leary about ever getting the alignment right once I remove them..

I just read a real good article on car craft (http://www.carcraft.com/howto/51979/index.html) that made me realize how much work it really is.

i'm thinking i might be better of leaving the fenders attached to the car..
 
Don't get to concerned about alignments,make sure your door pins are good.Everything is adjustable,all holes are slotted,fender top at cowl and bottom at rocker are shimmed add or subtract as required.Same for doors adjust height by loosening hinge mounts and raise or lower as required just remember that to gain a little here you'll have to give a little there.As far as gaps go check what you have now,open door keep an eye on the gap as the door is opened watch closely do not get it to close or you will pinch the edge.I like to remove anything that I can,tape them well and use caution,DO NOT RUSH you'll get there just give it time re-assembly can be slow but well worth it,properly alligning panels bare(un-worked)pays off big time when you're blocking.
 
aligning panels is a pain. I use a paint stick to set gaps. You should be able to slide it in and out of the gap. If it wont fit the gap is to tight. It should fit to loose either.

When you have the panels were you want them you can drill a few small holes next to a few bolts to help line them back up later.

Also, Dont forget to sand the edges of doors, fenders and hood. The primer will build up and after its painted and cleared you can end up with to tight of a gap and chip the paint when you open and close the doors.
 
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