Bracket engine, what would you build and why?

[dusterdoug]

Simple and cheap...like me!

 

[mopar65]

mopar65,

Thanks for the compliment. It's no show car, has a few battle scars. lol
Sounds like you built a real nice engine. Mid 10 sec. pump gas street car on a little tire is very impressive! What rpm do you shift and trap at? What was the difference in trap rpm going from the 4.10 - 4.30 gears.
I have heard nothing but good about Dwayne Porter. I will talk to him about heads and a cam, for sure. I was planning on a set of ez's but I am really interested in Trick Flows new head.
There is a lot of weight that can come off a Duster, just depends on how far you want to take it. I could easily get another 200 off. Safety glass windshield, alternator, carpet, iron heads and water pump housing, funny car cage, heavy scoop, 3 lbs of rubber in the tubs. lol
What trans. are you using?

thanks for the info. i cant take credit for the short block becasue i bought it used off a guy from moparts. he built it for his street 66 B-body and then decided to build a 500 for his car. i only payed 2800 for it and thought it was a great deal at the time.now the roller cam and heads i bought brand new from porter racing heads. well between the short block and the heads i have about 6200 in it. i did install the heads etc. the trans is a TF727 built by me with cope racing transmission parts. sorry i don't really remember what the rpm threw the traps were its been to long, but if i remember at the time i was shifting at 6500 when i had the 4.10 gears and i think my friend was shifting at around 6200. well if i ever get my back fixed( i have 4 herniated disc in my lower back, started getting spine shots and have one left. the doc said if they don't fix it i will probably have to get back surgery.) I hope to start swapping parts over from the dart to the duster. it is a all steel 73 duster that i put the front-end from a 72 on it. it does have fiberglass fenders though. when i get the money i am going to get a fiberglass hood and bumpers for it etc. I was thinking about using lexan for the windows but not sure if i want to go threw all the trouble of keeping them clean etc. i dont have a shop so my car sits out side all the time.here is a few picks of the dart. thanks Bobby also threw a few pics of the duster its the red car.

 

[mopar65]

There's a lot of "ink" that you should go big, 500+ inches. While there are good points to that, (especially if you're starting with nothing) sometimes we lose sight of SIMPLE and CHEAP, right? One of the best bracket combos I ever had and would repeat run after run...it was DEADLY consistent and made over 300 runs before I sold the car. All it needed was a driver...LOL.

.030 over 440
OE crank
prepped LY rods (gasp!)
TRW replacement 440 4 bbl pistons (GASP!) w/hand made valve reliefs. Right at 11:1 as bolted together.
Crane R280 roller cam (WAY to big, but that's what I had on hand)
906 heads, 2.14/1.81 ported. Flowed mid 260's on Holton's bench
MP M1 single plane 4150 intake
Adaptor and 1050 Dominator (no changes other than jets)
OE Mopar elec distributor and MSD 7AL
2" Hooker headers run open, no muffs.

Alum drum, roller 727 (only footbraked)
8" Munsinger converter
8 3/4 with 4.86's and a spool
Ladder bar with 14x32 rubber

73 Cuda right at 3300 with me on board...

10.40's @ 127 almost everywhere we took it at sea level. Best of 10.38 @ 128 on a cool July morning at Somona. High 10.90's at Fallon one fall I drug it up there.

dusterdoug very impressive car and times.:cheers::burnout::burnout:

 

[mopar65]

I don't know if it is good enough to see put here is a pic of the cam card.

 

[1Jeff]

thanks for the info. i cant take credit for the short block becasue i bought it used off a guy from moparts. he built it for his street 66 B-body and then decided to build a 500 for his car. i only payed 2800 for it and thought it was a great deal at the time.now the roller cam and heads i bought brand new from porter racing heads. well between the short block and the heads i have about 6200 in it. i did install the heads etc. the trans is a TF727 built by me with cope racing transmission parts. sorry i don't really remember what the rpm threw the traps were its been to long, but if i remember at the time i was shifting at 6500 when i had the 4.10 gears and i think my friend was shifting at around 6200. well if i ever get my back fixed( i have 4 herniated disc in my lower back, started getting spine shots and have one left. the doc said if they don't fix it i will probably have to get back surgery.) I hope to start swapping parts over from the dart to the duster. it is a all steel 73 duster that i put the front-end from a 72 on it. it does have fiberglass fenders though. when i get the money i am going to get a fiberglass hood and bumpers for it etc. I was thinking about using lexan for the windows but not sure if i want to go threw all the trouble of keeping them clean etc. i dont have a shop so my car sits out side all the time.here is a few picks of the dart. thanks Bobby also threw a few pics of the duster its the red car.

That dart is a sweet looking car and the duster looks like solid car to build. Back trouble sucks! Good luck with the injections, hope you can get healed up soon and back to working on you're car.
Lexan is lighter no doubt, but I would never use it for a windshield. It gets scratched and sandblasted over time. The glare is horrible!

 

[1Jeff]

There's a lot of "ink" that you should go big, 500+ inches. While there are good points to that, (especially if you're starting with nothing) sometimes we lose sight of SIMPLE and CHEAP, right? One of the best bracket combos I ever had and would repeat run after run...it was DEADLY consistent and made over 300 runs before I sold the car. All it needed was a driver...LOL.

.030 over 440
OE crank
prepped LY rods (gasp!)
TRW replacement 440 4 bbl pistons (GASP!) w/hand made valve reliefs. Right at 11:1 as bolted together.
Crane R280 roller cam (WAY to big, but that's what I had on hand)
906 heads, 2.14/1.81 ported. Flowed mid 260's on Holton's bench
MP M1 single plane 4150 intake
Adaptor and 1050 Dominator (no changes other than jets)
OE Mopar elec distributor and MSD 7AL
2" Hooker headers run open, no muffs.

Alum drum, roller 727 (only footbraked)
8" Munsinger converter
8 3/4 with 4.86's and a spool
Ladder bar with 14x32 rubber

73 Cuda right at 3300 with me on board...

10.40's @ 127 almost everywhere we took it at sea level. Best of 10.38 @ 128 on a cool July morning at Somona. High 10.90's at Fallon one fall I drug it up there.

Nice looking car! 4.86's and a 727, what did it 60ft. and what rpm did it trap at?
I agree with the loosing sight of simple and cheap. I'm starting from scratch by choice. I've got some stuff laying around, just not what I want to run. I think, lol.

 

[1Jeff]

I think going back to a 3sp, at the expeced weight of a B wedge with some alimunum will really mess with your suspension tuning and it will be slower even when you eventually get it to work. Your choice - but I'd leave the 'glide.

Here's a "for instance" on a B stroker:
383 + .030
full block machining but stock caps and main studs
pump gas (91 w/10% ethanol)
Stealths - Level 3 hand ported
Muscle Motors 4.25 stroker kit (4.25 x 4.280 bore is 496")
modified stock wet sump oiling w/stock pan & windage tray
port-matched RPM dual plane
custom Comp solid flat tappet, under .530 lift, under 244° @ .050, 1.5 rockers
belt driven water pump & p/s pump
Factory exhaust manifolds, 2.5" modified stock type full exhaust
Stock factory air cleaner (car won 1st in Stock Appearing at Carlise)
This is a low maintenance, pump gas engine, running street type carb, intake, and exhaust. It's made about 430hp to the tires, 450tq. Depending on your math that's around 510-520hp.
With .070 more bore, a real cam, race intake, and race headers I would imagine another 50-80hp is easy to get on the same fuel without exotic oiling, vacuum pump, or alcohol. It's barely touching it's potential as it was built as stock appearing and all street duty. The 383 is not my first choice for block - the 400 would be stronger.

I'm keeping the glide!
Thanks.

 

[dusterdoug]

dusterdoug very impressive car and times.:cheers::burnout::burnout:

Right back at ya, SGT Miller! You're doing better than I did...heads and t-ram are way ahead of the junk I had.

On another note, good luck and best wishes with the back!

 

[dusterdoug]

Nice looking car! 4.86's and a 727, what did it 60ft. and what rpm did it trap at?
I agree with the loosing sight of simple and cheap. I'm starting from scratch by choice. I've got some stuff laying around, just not what I want to run. I think, lol.

It was a slug at 60'. With 2500 leave and a 5100 converter flash, it would only go low 1.40's. On the positive side, thats why it was so consistent, it always hooked. Anywhere.

Right at 7000 in the lights, about 7200 in really good air.

You mentioned the alternator in your list of removable weight items. Don't do that! Nothing better than 3 days of racing and never needing a battery charger! It's 5 lbs. costs no HP and it's one less distraction on race day.

 

[flyfish]

Thanks again for all the replies, keep them coming!
No Chebby in my mopar ever, can't see starting with a inferior engine.
I know there are sooo many variables to consider when you're off a few on the big end, but I figure [usually gets me in trouble lol] that the best time to consider everything you can is when building. Agree on the no radical ramps, can anyone suggest someone to spec. a cam for me that understands the difference between a bracket engine and one built to make the most power possible.
I may be wrong but I think with the old engine going through the traps around 6,500 with very close to stock 452's the engine was past peak power and that could contribute to the inconsistencies in the last 320. I video taped my tach, around 5,100 at the hit, shift 56-59,000.
Thinking better heads and less gear to have engine making good power in the last 320?

Flyfish
Awesome looking car, love that body. What does it weigh?

Sorry for the late reply (family in town). I have not weighed the car in a long time, but I believe it is between 3250-3200 lbs. The last time I weighed the car (about 10 years ago) it still had the original hood on and it was 3275 with me in it. It currently has a race weight hood with a Hemi scoop.

 

[Hot Metal]

Thats a nice looking car Jeff, like it......personally I think a nice simple 440 would be the way to go for consistent 10.0's, as has been said though there's many ways to skin this cat...as you are only at 2560lbs race weight, it should be a simple cost effective motor, something similar perhaps to what I ran back in 1990, was a '69 Cuda at 3000lbs all in, back halved L/bars-coil-overs, with 14x32 Hoosiers/4.88's with 35sp spool/shafts, manual 727 with a 4500 8", all a bit overkill for such a tiny motor but it was real consistent, the motor specs>

+.030" stock 440-6pk bottom end (man that was heavy), balanced/printed..around 9.9:1CR
Mild ported 906's with 2.14/1.81, approx 260cfm
The Old CC solid flat tappet cam .650"/.650", [email protected], for top end
Team G intake, 850DP, 2" fenderwells
Single line Milodon external.

Not the spec I'd have today but it worked well, pulled like a train top end, this motor made only 485 fly hp and ran 10.71@124, reckon there was .60 or 50 in it with some more messing, shifted at 6400 ran through at 6500, 60's were 1.46's.
Something like that old plodder of a motor in your weight would run 10.1's, but there's a ton of better parts you could add to that these days, like carbs and intakes, a pair of ootb Eddys at 288cfm and a bit more CR and even less cam than I had and you'd be too quick for that 10.0. Keep it simple and cheap, all the best with it.

hers's a pic....

 

[1Jeff]

It was a slug at 60'. With 2500 leave and a 5100 converter flash, it would only go low 1.40's. On the positive side, thats why it was so consistent, it always hooked. Anywhere.

Right at 7000 in the lights, about 7200 in really good air.

You mentioned the alternator in your list of removable weight items. Don't do that! Nothing better than 3 days of racing and never needing a battery charger! It's 5 lbs. costs no HP and it's one less distraction on race day.

Thanks for the reply!
7000 rpm would scare me with a stock block 440, but hey you made it work!

I wouldn't think of removing the alternator. I was just trying to show mopar66 what is on the car that some would say isn't necessary. I can sit at the line for a looong time with the fan and water pump running, engine temp. doesn't go up and the volt gauge doesn't go down.

 

[Spun Bearing]

I'd like to see what some of these (similar) combinations would do with a pair of the new Trick Flow
Power Port 240 cylinder heads (OTB) when they become available after Memorial Day.

http://www.trickflow.com/pressreleases/powerport240cylinder/

http://bangshift.com/general-news/n...ock-chrysler-cylinder-heads-new-option-wedge/

 

[Big Dad]

I just built a 470

It isn't a wild piece , just nice new basic stuff

Box stock victor heads , makes nice power should live a long time