caster problems

-
P

palousedust

Member
Joined
Jun 24, 2014
Messages
13
Reaction score
0
Location
Colfax, Wa.
This winter replaced tie rods, ball joints, upper and lower bushes, steering box, pitman arm, idler arm. Got it all together and took it in for alignment and they're having problems. Car tracks to the left and the shop says that the passenger side tire needs to be another 1/2 inch back to get it to the place for it can be aligned. I bought the car last summer as a project so really don't know the history of it. Don't think it has been in an accident. I've tried to address the problem with off set bushes. I discovered the ride height was way off because of settling of the suspension and corrected that so it is spot on now but haven't taken it back and according to my measurements it didn't seem to move the tire back. Front cam bolt is way out and back cam bolt for upper control arm is way in. I've loosened the k-member bolts and tried to get a little movement that way w/o luck. Switched tires around to see if that would make a difference but didn't. Car tracked fine before I took it apart. It just had the normal sloppiness of a front end that had never been rebuilt. Any other suggestions you can lob my way? Can a torsion bar in some way hang up the lower control arm from moving as far back as it should? Looking at it, it seems to me that if you have been able to get it back together it should not be an issue. But I'm only looking for a 1/2 inch somewhere.
 
Are you running poly strut rod bushings and or lower control arm bushings?

Did you replace any of the strut rods themselves? The 63-72 is a slightly different length than 73-76 A-body. Also B and E body are a good 1/2" plus longer but look the same (been there done that).

Need to get two accurate measuremnts per side from given point on lower control arm near end and center to given point on k-member on both sides.

Next would be measurement from front to rear tire each side.
 
Bushings on strut rods and lower control arms are NOT poly. Did not replace strut rods, but again, who knows the history of this car? Making said measurements would be a good idea.
 
Another vote for checking your strut rods and/or bushings.
What year is your car?
 
Find another alignment shop.
 
Or learn to align it yourself. BELIEVE me, when I tell you I'm getting very lame, but I can still align my own car. Yes, it hurts, and yes it takes me a lot of time.

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showpost.php?p=1970847993&postcount=7

67Dart273 said:
"Close enough?" HELL YOU CAN ALIGN IT YOURSELF. There are plenty of stories on here about poor alignment shops who cannot comprehend or "won't" align these cars properly.

There is about 10 tons of "stuff" on the internet about DIY alignment. I did it and I'm old. It hurts. It's painful. But I did it.

WHAT YOU NEED

1...A flat place to work. I did mine by !!! leveling up !!! my car trailer !!! and using that for a work platform, "alignment rack."

2...You need a CAMBER gauge. This is nothing more than an accurate level from which you can figure degrees of tilt. You can buy these all over the place. You can make your own or buy them reasonably. I found an old Ammco caster camber gauge on CL with some other stuff

My old Ammco gauge

attachment.php


You are ACTUALLY measuring CAMBER. CASTER is derived by measuring the difference in camber change when turning the wheels out and then in. Very very very simple.

You turn the wheels out 20 degrees by means of a simple protractor. You measure the camber. You turn them IN 20 degrees and again measure camber. Take the difference between the two, and multiply by 1.5 This is your CASTER figure.

For radials you want the tires IN at the top, as opposed to the OLD figures for bias tires which had the tops of the tires OUT at the tops. What you want is "negative" camber with radials

3....You need some method of turning the wheels and if you search this, (DIY alignment, etc) there are lots of ways, including pieces of greased sheet metal, using salt between tiles, I don't know what all

4...Toe: You need a method of marking the tires to obtain the rotating plane. A simple scribe made from a nail and scrap lumber works, you can mark the tire itself or pieces of masking tape. Then just use a tape front and rear of the tires, if you have two guys. I don't I "remade" a toe gauge I bought the pieces of

Nothing but a fancy tape measure:

attachment.php


Read this:

http://www.allpar.com/history/mopar/front-end-alignment.html

"What we" go by around here is the "skosh chart" at the bottom of the page

289d4j7.jpg


Some other links

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=195810

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=248235

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=204118

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=227050

There is TONS of caster / camber gauges available reasonably, and you can make them

https://www.google.com/search?newwi...sedr...0...1c.1.64.img..0.24.1379.DJVuA6nNi2c
Click to expand...
 
Or you could find a tech in your area that knows what
he's doing and can diagnose and repair.
Look for a company with a frame rack and does a good job.
Ask around at several quality body shops.
 
PoisonDart74 said:
^ #-o
Click to expand...

Not everybody has the time, expertise or tools to do
this type work.
I was a B&A tech for several companies in the 70's/80's
and I wouldn't do my own alignment today without a rack.
It's nearly impossible to get an alignment right without squaring the car.
Its alright if you just want to set the toe and let it go.
 
longarm said:
Not everybody has the time, expertise or tools to do
this type work.
I was a B&A tech for several companies in the 70's/80's
and I wouldn't do my own alignment today without a rack.
It's nearly impossible to get an alignment right without squaring the car.
Its alright if you just want to set the toe and let it go.
Click to expand...

You are not gonna find many alignment shops that want or will or have the ability to "square" one of these old girls, either. And, I don't know why you "need" a rack. String and plumb bobs, to put it very simply, are just as accurate today as they ever were, and for the short distances "here" they are certainly as accurate as anything else
 
You don't "need" a rack to do the adjustments but by
the time you've leveled, squared, checked ride height
and wheel runout just to start the alignment, a rack starts looking pretty
easy to work with.
Also if there is a problem, setup and readjusting is very quick.
A magnetic hub guage will take care of the runout but you still
have all the other stuff to contend with.
I've worked on plenty of cars that didn,t track right or the steering
wheel is off center but the alignment was dead on spec wise.
 
67Dart273 said:
You are not gonna find many alignment shops that want or will or have the ability to "square" one of these old girls, either. And, I don't know why you "need" a rack. String and plumb bobs, to put it very simply, are just as accurate today as they ever were, and for the short distances "here" they are certainly as accurate as anything else
Click to expand...

The job I had last where I got hurt I was the alignment mechanic. We did everything. If it was a truck too big to fit on the rack, I did it in the parking lot. Probably done 100 or more like that.
 
If you do not have slip plates, don't forget to roll the car and recheck measurements.
Most all settings are not independent, repeat procedures. It is much about making accurate measurements.
 
I just took my dart to get it aligned and I was there for 8 hours. All new parts q1a upper control arms, with 3 degree of caster built into the a arms. They said they could only get 1 degree of positive caster in it. The guy lowered my ride height without asking me and never made it level from side to side. Said that was the only way he could get positive caster. Asked the guy where he worked before and he said this was his first job after graduating from a tech school. I don't know where to go and who to trust when it comes to working on old school suspensions.
 
We've done alignments on the floor with gauges and turn plates after we've set ride height and checked for any squaring issues. A little more time consuming than a rack but despite two or three places in my area with racks, not one of them can do an alignment properly.
 
I don't like to bash anyone because I know everyone has to start somewhere. He had more knowledge than I have, because I know very little about front end geometry, but I could tell he was having issues figuring this torsion bar suspension out. I had my own way I wanted it because it is a strip only car, and he still kept trying to get everything in the green on the computer. I would remind him and he would try to make the corrections to my specs. He was a real nice guy, and I felt sorry for him, because he worked all day on it. Couldn't get it right so they never charged me. I felt bad demanded I pay them something.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
-

Back
Top