Champion radiator - I cut her open

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So is anyone running a 440 in a 67, A body using a mechanical fan like the one pictured, a mopar shroud and 2 or 3 core radiator.?

Anyone know how much air the factory fan moves at a certain rpm??

After reading all this and going through the other posts about cooling systems, I'm now leaning towards going back to basics and use a factory setup. So if I run this mechanical fan and the right shroud, should I go a 2 core or 3 core radiator.
 
Can you run a clutch fan?
I am using an 18" 6 blade flexalite clutch fan about $38 from summit, and a fan clutch from a 1990 shaguar XJ-6 from rockauto for about $35. It comes with a centering bushing for the mopar water pump snout, and the bolt thread is SAE its 3/4" shorter than a stock mopar fan clutch to clear the thicker aluminum radiator. This is on a small block. Not sure how much room you have w a 383 compared to a small block. Oh and be sure to run a fan shroud, and the rubber flap on the under side of the hood that closes agains the radiator support. Ram air will always choose path of least resistance.

I have a thread in heating and cooling on here called "fan shroud questions" do a search. It details how i made my own fiberglass shroud to go with a ECP aluminum radiator and my 18" clutch fan.

Hope this helps
Matt
 
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What engine are you running and are you happy with the quality and install.?
this is in my 68 coronet. .030 over 383, mild cam , 9.44:1 comp. I am extremely happy with the performance, as for the fit...... it took a little trimming to make me happy. I am also using a factory fan shroud and fan clutch ... here's a write up i did on my install over at FBBO, its on the 2nd page ....http://www.forbbodiesonly.com/moparforum/threads/22-vs-26-radiator.132976/page-2
 
This doesn't even make any sense. First, it should have run over 180*. So if you were holding it below 180* with the fans you weren't doing you or your engine any favors. Second, running pushers in front of a mechanical fan is a lousy idea. The pushers obstruct airflow through the radiator, which makes the mechanical fan less efficient. It's just silly. If the mechanical fan can't keep up in traffic, increase the CFM of the mechanical fan at low speeds. Don't sabotage it at higher speeds by jamming crap in front of it.

If you need to add electric pushers in front of a mechanical fan, it's because your mechanical fan or cooling system (or both) is undersized. If somehow that works and your car doesn't overheat at speed, it means your cooling system is fine, but your mechanical fan is inadequate. So at that point, you should either drop the mechanical fan, because it's just wasting power, or upgrade it and drop the pushers. Running both is just wasting energy.

no, with a 160 thermostat it will not run over 180. I installed the pushers as an insurance policy. in the end I removed them as the mechanical did all I needed.
if I needed to cool it between rounds I just dropped a box fan in front of the car. this was pretty much a bracket car we occasionally cruised.
 
no, with a 160 thermostat it will not run over 180. I installed the pushers as an insurance policy. in the end I removed them as the mechanical did all I needed.
if I needed to cool it between rounds I just dropped a box fan in front of the car. this was pretty much a bracket car we occasionally cruised.

A thermostat doesn’t change how hot an engine gets. Thermostat’s set the lower operating temp, not the upper. Which is why 160* thermostat’s are stupid. Why would you want your thermostat open before your engine is up to optimal operating temperature? A properly sized cooling system should be able to maintain temperature, even if the thermostat opens at 195* like the stock ones do.
 
So would an ECP 2 core, 1 inch, painted black to blend in, an A body mopar shroud and my 7 blade mechanical fan. Would that do the trick?
Or would you go twin spal 12" thermo fans with a fan controller hidden.
 
So would an ECP 2 core, 1 inch, painted black to blend in, an A body mopar shroud and my 7 blade mechanical fan. Would that do the trick?
Or would you go twin spal 12" thermo fans with a fan controller hidden.

It should. Most of these cars can be cooled with a decent sized 2 core radiator with a good mechanical fan with shroud and a fan clutch. I think your 440 would be pushing the limits of a 22" 2 core, a 26" 2 core would probably work though. Painting it black to blend in might hurt your cooling some though, as the paint adds thickness. Painting the tanks would be ok, but I wouldn't paint the fins.

I would not use Spal 12" fans. They're super expensive, and they don't work any better than much cheaper options. A single Spal 12" fan costs almost as much as the OE Ford Contour dual fan set up I run. And if you're talking about 12", 1300 cfm fans, they don't combine for a high enough CFM rating. I don't think you can pull off a stand-alone electric fan set up that flows less than 3500 cfm for a driver. For a 26" radiator I wouldn't do anything but the Contour set up. They flow more, they're proven reliable, and they cost less. It's a great set up, especially since the fans are like $130 and flow up to 5,000 cfm Dorman Electric Fans 620-104. My whole installation is here My "new" '74 Duster- or why I need a project like a hole in the head

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@goldduster318 made a fantastic PDF for this install too, it's attached below.
http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/attachments/electric-fan-26in-radiator-pdf.1715101084/
 
I have to agree on the Contour fans. I had tried everything I could think of to try to keep my 499" cool including mechanical and several electric fans even with water wetter. Nothing worked until I followed that link with the Contour fans and Dakota controller. I had to trim the shroud in between fans to clear water pump shaft but overheating problem is finally solved. Thanks to Goldduster 318 for sharing, Joe
 
I would run that 7-blader from post 25, in direct drive, with a hi-flow pump and matching 195 stat, and 100% water, with a low-pressure cap. Then a 26" rad like described earlier. This will provide max-cooling. Then get your engine sorted; Probably a little more initial timing, and lean out the low-speed circuit.Get it tuned for the new minimum coolant temp.
And I can't stress enough,fresh cold air into the carb. If she's sucking hot underhood air,when stopped,and at idle, that's just an endless cycle of increasing heat generation;like a runaway breakdown in a nuclear reactor. And moving slow in traffic is very little better.
After you have a rock-solid system, THEN, you can start dicking around with a thermostatic fan-clutch, and %-antifreeze, and number of fan blades, etc, each of which is likely to decrease cooling system efficiency. You can experiment with the decreasing efficiency until it is no longer efficient enough, and then go back to the last known good-working combo.
Don't forget; the thermostat sets the minimum working temp, and the rest sets the maximum. If ,in Adelaide, it is possible to successfully run it at 7psi, then your hoses and such will thank you for it. I see no advantage to run more pressure than that on a system than never reaches the boiling point. I understand that in your location, a higher pressure can provide a little extra protection on a marginal system.
And within reason, the hotter you can successfully run her,the more power she is likely to make; if you tune for it.

The advantage to running a Thermostatic clutch, is that it can automatically control that maximum running temp.And it does it without electrical controls. I found a very nice reliable clutch that maintains my system at 205*F. It's off an early 2000 Ford pick-up truck; an F-150 IIRC. It's been on there since about 2002/3. and that is over 60,000 miles I'm guessing. I highly recommend that one. It fit right on the Mopar 7-blade A/C fan, and was the perfect depth to center it in the shroud. Forget about power-loss with a clutched 7-blader.On the run to redline the fan will lag behind very significantly, as the fluid slips. Then as soon as the rpm stabilizes, and if the air-temp thru the rad has exceeded the clutch elements set-point, then the fan will lock up and go to work. With in a few seconds the air-temp will fall and the element will relax and the fan will go back to slipping. It will continue to cycle like this until the clutch element finds a happy place. The happy place varies with ambient temp, air-speed thru the rad and engine loading, and it's all automatic.
After the warm-up period, my system runs rock-solid at 205, under any and all conditions; which brings true peace of mind. I never look at that gauge anymore, except, I make it a practice to do so after every run to redline,lol, in case the belt were to flip off. So far it never has, since it first hit the road in 1999.
Sad to say I almost never look at that gauge anymore.I may have become too complacent,I know. It could happen to you,too,lol.
It occurred to me that you might want to know what I'm running;
It's a 367, 68 Barracuda with a manual trans and 3.55s. It goes 93 in the 1/8 at 3467#, which the Wallace calculator thinks is 433hp. (Well goes is maybe misleading; it went 93 one time, the only successful run of 4 that I made that day, that one and only time I ever tracked it. I didn't believe it either, so I immediately went to the timer window and inquired, and they verified that it was accurate. So then I went to visit the guy I ran against to get his opinion, and he verified that his time was accurate. So I did my due-diligence and retired the car for the day.Then went to the bleachers with my son and enjoyed our time together. He was 20 that fall.) IDK or care,it's never been dyno'd. And I'm confident it could idle indefinitely on the hottest days of summer, which here in Manitoba, rarely exceed 99degrees.lol. And it nicely survives multiple runs to redline and crawling along in traffic. With my starter gear,10.97, it will idle down to 4mph @550rpm, on flat level ground,heehee, so parades are possible.
It runs a 26" Factory A/C rad circa 1973.
Going back to the hi-flow pump, mine is a Milodon. It appears to very similar to the factory-type 8-vane pump to which they have attached an anti-cavitation plate. This is nothing more than an appropriately sized,thin,round,sheet-metal plate. You could fab up something down there and plug-braze it on for super cheap.The plate seems to increase circulation by shrouding the water in between the vanes, to prevent it from slipping off. It really helped my system and I highly recommend the plate. The Milodon has been on there since about 2000/2001, and has accumulated over 100,000miles, so,.all-in-all, even tho it was quite pricey, it was/is a good investment.No factory non-plated pump was doing the job for me.
Long story again, I know: novella # five thousand and four hundred and thirty-two
 
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I plan on doing the high bypass disc to my water pump impeller as well. Going to use flat stainless steel sheet, and monel steel solid rivets.
 
Update:
So o was bored and impatient yesterday and wanted to put some of the suggestions to a test.
I went down to the car wreckers and found a early 2000's ford courier radiator. 26" wide and the hose locations were identical. Top and bottom tanks, but very thin. The hose width was a bit smaller but I managed to find other hoses that would work.
I put my 7 blade 18" fan on, but didn't have a shroud that would work.
Filled her up and bled the system, started her up and let her idle for a while. Filled her up some more and put the cap on. She didn't get above 190f the whole time it was sitting there idling, which was about 20 mins while I adjusted timing etc. I'd have to fabricate the correct mounts to match the rad, so I just used a bunch of zip ties. :)
Went for a cruise to get some fuel and then back home, temp all good.
Checked everything when I got home and all was still in place.
Went for another short drive in traffic near the beach and she still didnt overheat...

I couldn't believe this thin Lil radiator would cope, but it did. Thought, ok, let's try highway drive, so I drove to our workshop, about 15mins up the highway and temp sat at 176f the whole way and back.

So in summary, a 26" thin radiator, with a mechanical fan and no shroud cools my engine. I definitely need to make a shroud and Mount it correctly, but I think I'm well on the right track now.
Thank you so much everyone for all your help.

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Check out my shroud making thread. I recommend if theres enough room to put a clutch fan on it, otherwise you leave HP and a little fuel economy on the table. If its tight in there a 1990 Shaguar XJ6 fan clutch fits perfectly. About 1/2"-3/4" shorter than the OEM. Will give you a little more clearance. Glad you found something that works. Those stock aluminum radiators really shed the heat much better than the old copper/brass ones.
 
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