We always do that! They’re startin’ not to believe us!
Copper vs. Aluminum
- Thread starter Mean416
- Start date
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lead69
hopeless car junkie
The difference is the copper will weigh more/have more rows to cool the same as aluminum. I would never buy into the triple pass stuff, the longer the water sits in the radiator the longer it sits in the block, at low rpm that is a no go.
lead69
hopeless car junkie
I used them a few times in the past but the last time I called them to build me one for my duster I left it up to them to build me the best radiator for my setup. That's how I wound up with a triple pass desert cooler deal and had overheating issues at idle/slow cruise. I talked to the local radiator shop that used to do my recores (before the price of copper went through the roof) and they agreed it was a poor design. I bought a 3 core champion off ebay to see what difference it would make and problem solved, didn't have to change anything else.
On a carbureted gas truck? I think it would be very little return for the investment.
Yeah, I plan on making it clear I don't want any double or triple pass voodoo. That's marketing hype, IMO.
I think maybe you meant to post this.
Tech Tip #5: Radiators & External Plumbing - Stewart Components
Radiators Thicker radiators do have slightly more airflow resistance than thinner radiators but the difference is minimal. A 4″ radiator has only approximately 10% more airflow resistance than a 2″ radiator. In past years, hot rodders and racers would sometimes install a thicker radiator and...
www.stewartcomponents.com
67Dart273
Well-Known Member
Sorry this theory about "water going too fast" or "too slow" through the rad is bullshit.
If it was going too slow, it was a bad water pump, restriction, or slipping belt.
you can't drive it too fast so far as the rad itself, although a rad company (DO NOT ask me which) posted up they claim that too much pump can cause sort of turbulance in the block which degrades heat exchange. This gets to the old tale about needing a restrictor.
I will tell you THIS. OldManMopar posted that he thinks that some old rads can crack the tubes loose from the fins for various reasons. That seems to be EXACTLY what happened to my original 67 rad.
I have no idea what "they" did with modern rads, but the last gas 3/4T 5.9 V8, the old Dakota 5.2 I still have, and the 01 Diesel I still have---ALL are/ were run with NO pressure in the rad because the heater cores all leaked. They work just fine. NObody was more amazed than I
lead69
hopeless car junkie
So your saying that forcing coolant to pass through a radiator multiple times isn't leaving the coolant in the block longer to build more heat?. Seems to me like that could be considered "moving too slow" in laymans terms. The triple pass radiator was a big restriction to overcome and I was using a flowkooler pump so no it was not a pump issue, maybe you misunderstood what I was saying.
I read it. I don't disagree with it.
Demonic
Well-Known Member
The real issue is you don't see the whole picture with one temp gauge. If you had a gauge that read accurately on the lower hose, you could see how well the radiator was cooling with the temperature drop. Return temp goes up at idle - airflow or shroud issues. Temp climbs with rpm - flow or radiator size/capacity issues.
jos51700
Green Bearing thread connoisseur
Exactly this, actually. Read on.
Use an infrared camera, not a thermometer. I have one on my phone because I literally pay my mortgage by building large scale heat exchangers. It's a game changer when it comes to understanding these things.
Aluminum the material is not superior to copper (Brass is harder to nail down, there's many types of brass) in regards to heat transfer. That said:
Most radiators, including the OEM in our cars, were BRASS, which isn't that great. Copper radiators aren't great, primarily due to cost, but also because copper has other manufacturing requirements that make it less desirable. Brass is terrible at heat conduction.
Aluminum allows the use of different tube sizes to make a more efficient radiator, via thinner tubes and fins....and it's lighter to boot.
-If your radiator is too thick (where the air passes through), you end up with virtually no change in temperature by the time the air reaches the tubes in the back, and it's just wasted coolant and radiator at that point; you're either going wider or taller.
-If the tubes are too small, you can't flow enough coolant and you end up needing more tubes to get your flow back, and then you run into my previous sentence about the radiator being too thick.
-If you have to make the walls of the tube thicker to resist the pressure, wind load, vibration, and other conditions of the application, you either lose air flow between the tubes, or have to space them so far apart that....my previous two sentences start shaking your tree.
And remember, unless you take the Thermostat out of the car, most of the time your flow is partially regulated to the radiator anyway. The new Rams have (tried?) that active grille to regulate airflow over the radiator because it wasn't needed all the time and they were trying to increase aero efficiency. If the radiator is spec'd to handle your car at its' most severe requirements, you're basically done. Bigger/better radiators beyond your max need aren't going to make you faster, better, or smoother with the ladies, and your radiator isn't used to capacity except in the worst of cases.
It's a radiator, and the rule of diminishing returns still applies.
Remember, all this talk about material-this and conductivity-that is moot. You have to look at the system. I have heat exchangers with stainless steel tubes, and they work great for the system and the application.
For most street cars, a properly designed aluminum radiator will be superior, and more importantly.....Just Fine For What You're Doing.
It's funny you can advise these cats to get simple tools like the hand held temp gun (under 20 bucks) but most of them turn a deaf ear and just stumble on in the dark. I've gotten to the point where I just let them.
Newbomb Turk
Well-Known Member
I disagree with your premise. I thought the red X explained that.
Heck the other day I couldn't convince a guy to take the cap off (cold) and see if the pump was working....
Yeah, I mean the good God knows none of us is right about everything....in fact, I admit I'm wrong about probably much more than I am right, but here we are usually on the other side of the country, ONLINE trying to help people who give little to no information and THEN refuse the good advice they're given. It's like on a recent slant 6 carburetor thread. I made a recommendation based on SOLID recent experience. ....and it's not about being right, or an individual doing what I, you or anyone else recommends. I couldn't care less whether they choose my recommendation or not. But they could at least act like they appreciate it. It's like Del says all the time. Nobody gets paid around here. lol I'm to the point now where if someone wants my advice anymore, they can PM me, call or come by.
No, it didn’t. Most time people fat finger it.
Newbomb Turk
Well-Known Member
No, I clicked on it intentionally.
Newbomb Turk
Well-Known Member
Cry much? Giving me a bunch of red X’s just because I disagree with you shows a serious issue with your maturity level.
I know you’re the new red X guy. Usually men real men like to explain the red X.
I disagree with your premise. I thought you understood that and what the red X stood for.
LOL
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