Crazy idea for 318

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Replicaracer43 forgive me for not being the pro that you are. I thought that this was a place to ask questions and get advice. So that is what I did and will continue to do. It was an item that was discussed and I wanted positive opinions. I will continue to ask until I am clear on what I need to do like it or not. Thank you for your positive responses and input let's keep them that way. Please.
 
I think the real truth is starting to come out a little here.............. You are happy cause your 84 318 block can be bored? And gonna look into 360 heads? We have all been telling you what you need, you just gotta listen, an overbore and factory casting heads aint gonna get you where your wanting to be....
 
I was questioning it myself but I thought I would ask. I will look at better heads, maybe even aluminum if I can't find anything else that will work better priced.
 
He has been helpful and positive, but grows frustrated at your apparent direction of backwards even though a pathway has been lit up for you to go forwards.

The mentions you make show your inexperience, and that is OK since we all have been there.

Someone here is selling an engines book. Grab that or run down to your dealer or Jegs/amazon, etc... and get an engines book along with the newest addition of How to Hot Rod your Small Block MoPar.

Spend some time with an engine builder. Get him at lunch time and buy him a big lunch so he'll just want to sit and talk about this project instead of going back to work.
 
308 heads are 1.88/1.60 stock and flow better than 302's....
 
and its still relevant to the (3) C's:

Compression
Camshaft
Carburetor

11-11.5:1
.600 lift
750-850 cfm

7500 rpm

less than 3000lbs

4.10 gear
Loose Convertor
 
It's really not that hard to do. Back in the early 70's I ran a G/gas 67 Camaro with 283 cu. in. and ran 10.65 et's. It's mainley weight to HP. This was before today's tech. so doing it with a 318 is a doable goal.
 
You are correct. I stated in the very beginning of all of this I know nothing about the combos. I have always just done the assembly part of it. Been given a box of parts and told put it together. That is why I am asking for all this help in getting a good perception of a good recipe. I know how to spend money too, but I just need to hope that someone shoots me in the butt with diamonds soon to get all the stuff I need, LOL.
 
this project will take money and experience
what one lacks in money can sometimes be made up with experience
what one lacks in experience can not always be made up with money
 
Prine said:
and its still relevant to the (3) C's:

Compression
Camshaft
Carburetor

11-11.5:1
.600 lift
750-850 cfm

7500 rpm

less than 3000lbs

4.10 gear
Loose Convertor
Click to expand...

Converter is going to have to flash to at least 5000 rpm...small engine...
Gears going to have to be at least a 4.56 with 28 inch tall tire....

you are going to have run about 120 miles per hour....use a rpm/gear/ tire calculator
 
rumblefish360 said:
Someone here is selling an engines book. Grab that or run down to your dealer or Jegs/amazon, etc... and get an engines book along with the newest addition of How to Hot Rod your Small Block MoPar.
.
Click to expand...

gipperco said:
Rumblefish, YES I would like a copy of the tips you talked about. How can I get it?
Click to expand...

The MoPar engines book should be available through your MoPar dealer, AKA Chrysler/Dodge dealer. Also, via Amazon or Mancini racing, Jegs racing, summit racing, hold on, here a link;

(Engine "Tips" inside this book)
---> http://www.summitracing.com/parts/DCC-4876826/


How to Hot Rod your small block MoPar--> http://www.summitracing.com/parts/HPB-HP1405/

And this book for more info--> http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SAD-SA104/

Basic rebuild;
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SAD-SA143/
 
Got this one....How to Build Big-Inch Mopar Small-Blocks

I have the others.

BTW: Just became Gold; it is great. LOL
 
gipperco said:
Got this one....How to Build Big-Inch Mopar Small-Blocks
Click to expand...

So now you're thinking about a stroker? :scratch:

I kinda of agree with replicaracer43 here, seems like you kind of don't really know what you are asking.

Sure, a 318 has limitations, especially in a mild build where displacement can make up for lack of performance. However, if you build anything without compromise, it should be able to run a number. Like I said before, be prepared to spend almost as much money on the things that don't actually make horsepower.

Spend some time doing some research. Find out why W2 heads or whatever head you choose would be good for your stated goals. Start looking into what cams do. I've been devouring books, (including the stroker book you mentioned above) magazines and reading and digesting things on line for years and years. Get an engine dyno emulator and start plugging in flow numbers and cam profiles. Use online calculators like the ones on Wallace Racing that relate to horsepower, weight, mph and ET. These ideas will eventually lead you to gear selection, tire size, shift points and all kinds of cool stuff that you can figure out on paper before you spend a dime or turn a wrench. You will start to see trends when you narrow your focus.

IMO, your key idea right now is to find out how much your car weighs so you can calculate how much horsepower you need at the wheels (not at the flywheel) to go 11.00. That should lead you to the conclusion that you need somewhere in the neighborhood of 475-500 horsepower before you factor in frictional driveline loss. Can it be done with a 318? Sure! Figure out what it would take to make around 1.6 hp/cubic inch. We've all told you essentially how it can work. It's a race engine so it shouldn't be that difficult.

Again, have fun and tell us how much it costs.
 
gipperco said:
You are correct. I stated in the very beginning of all of this I know nothing about the combos. I have always just done the assembly part of it. Been given a box of parts and told put it together. That is why I am asking for all this help in getting a good perception of a good recipe. I know how to spend money too, but I just need to hope that someone shoots me in the butt with diamonds soon to get all the stuff I need, LOL.
Click to expand...
Now I can see that you are starting to get an idea of just what it will take.I for one believe that it is a good idea especially when you are dealing with small bore and spinning the crap out of it to open up the oil galleys and bevel the oil holes in the bearings. Whatever you do-Good Luck with it.
 
I will keep you posted on what it is that I end up doing and how the project is going when I figure out just what I am going to do. I know what my end line goal is and now I have an idea what it will take to get there and it is possible to do it. Thank you all for you input and suggestions. I will weigh them all out and if I run into trouble I will be back to ask more questions.
 
Here's the 318 combo that's going into my Vintage Road Race '66 Dart:

attachment.php


I don't think it would run the number we're looking for here, with the current heads/intake. But it sure would with some ported LA-X heads and either an RPM Airgap, or single plane manifold.

attachment.php


'69 318 0.050" over bock, K1 rods, Scat 4340 crank, custom forged pistons (forget by whom right now), Hughes Engines main stud girdle.

EdleBrock LD4B Intake with a half inch open spacer and QFT road race 750

The heads are ported 1985 and up 318 ...302 castings with 1.94" intake and 1.6" exhaust valves by Ryan Johnson at Shady Dell speed shop in central PA; they flow 239.1 / 169.8 CFM @ 0.600" lift at 28 Inches of water (these will support no more than 497 HP). This motor previously made 330 HP at the wheels with the same cam & heads but less compression (was 10.1:1 now 10.25:1).

Comp Mech Roller Cam: Lift-0.630"/0.630"; [email protected]"-254*/260*; and LSA-107*.

Harland Sharp Rockers. Magnum rocker adjusters, push rods, and lifters (basically pressure oiling the push rod/rocker pivot point from the lifters and through the push rods like a Ford or Chevy small block).

I need to ask which headers where used on the engine dyno, in the car I have the TTI early A-body step headers, 3" to 2.5" X-Pipe and a pair of glass packs and 2.5" spiral baffles dumping in front of the rear wheels.

Milodon road race pan, Brad Penn 20w50 Oil, Oberg canister filter.

On 93 octane pump gas at the crank:

RPM HP FtLb
==== === ====
3100 216 365
3200 221 364
3300 229 364
3400 237 366
3500 246 370
3600 255 373
3700 265 377
3800 275 381
3900 285 383
4000 293 385
4100 302 387
4200 309 387
4300 316 387
4400 324 387
4500 332 387
4600 340 388
4700 348 390
4800 357 391
4900 364 391
5000 371 390
5100 378 389
5200 384 388
5300 391 387
5400 396 385
5500 401 383
5600 406 380
5700 411 379
5800 416 376
5900 419 373
6000 421 368
6100 422 364
6200 424 359
6300 425 354
6400 423 347
6500 421 340
6600 419 333
6700 416 326
6800 415 320
6900 414 315
7000 413 310

Graphically:

attachment.php


Some of the groups I run with require a 6800 RPM rev limit and some mandate iron heads. Also this motor was built to have fun, run safe relative lap times, and require minimal maintenance. The next motor will be similar, with better heads and a Performer RPM or LD340 intake. But that is years off at this point. I should have chassis dyno numbers some time next week.

Dave
 

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why drag up a old dead thread that had nothing in common with your build? with you dyno sheet you posted, your engine is way short of enough power to make the OP goal. Nice car and build though, bet its fun! I love the oval track/ vintage trans am/ roadcourse type builds.
 
I didn't want to start a whole new thread so i ran a search for something related. Yep, my current heads are limiting the out put, but it would only take another 45 - 50 CFM on the intake to be right there without even needing race gas. :D Also curious to see if the OP actually beat Dad.

I've autocrossed the Dart, my '66 Barracuda, and my first car, a '66 Mustang, extensively. The A-bodies are a much better place to start, but the Ford has way better after market support (which it really needs). In the last decade or so things have turned around some for the MOPARs, but its still pretty lonely for a MOPAR at Summit Point or VIR on a race weekend.


replicaracer43 said:
why drag up a old dead thread that had nothing in common with your build? with you dyno sheet you posted, your engine is way short of enough power to make the OP goal. Nice car and build though, bet its fun! I love the oval track/ vintage trans am/ roadcourse type builds.
Click to expand...
 
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