Desk Top Dyno

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Newbomb Turk said:
Why would I ask you that? You don’t test. I wouldn’t waste my time.
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I test more in a Winter month than you do in a year. Both at home and at the track during the summer. Did you find that Unicorn ET slip yet MAD. Ohhhhh that’s right. You retired from racing and now just “run” your mouth. Lol
 
MOPARMAGA said:
John, since a flow bench is just really for air flow improvement or correction and basic " tell what a head has for cfm", what kinda flow numbers do you think a bench would show if the camshaft lobe was involved, opening on its particular ramp, and at speed ?
Because I see guys on there flow bench running a particular lift for 10 seconds or longer, a valve isn't open at that particular lift for longer than, id guess way less than a second. I imagine the entire lobe -valve lift is done before .050 of a second ( wild *** guess)
Probably need some high speed cameras and other cool stuff to test like that. It seems that would be a more real world test.
Do you know or heard of anyone trying to test like this ?
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The answer is a flow bench can never duplicate what happens in a running engine. No matter what you do it just can’t. That’s a limit of the tool.

That doesn’t mean you can’t use one and learn and make more power. As I have repeated probably a thousand times, not every number coming off the flow bench is the truth. Just like a dyno. You know what it’s like looking at all the data.

As for the question of low lift flow and guys wetting theirselves over “low lift” flow, all you need is a degree wheel and some time.

Plot out the curve, AT THE VALVE because that’s really what the engine really sees. Then let’s say you have a .600 lift cam. Look at the TIME the valve is open from .400 lift on the opening side to .400 lift on the closing side.

That’s where most of the cylinder filling occurs. The valve is moving so fast from cracking off the seat until about .400 lift that the valve moves through those low lifts so fast that the valve is really still in the way. It’s always in the way, it’s just worse at low lifts.

And, the piston is in the way at those lifts too.

And again, the pressure drop the port sees is far greater at lower lifts so flowing a port at a simple pressure drop can make the numbers look bad when they aren’t bad.

You need to bring home that flow bench, get it set up and start using it. You’ll learn so much so fast your head will spin. And you’ll most likely learn that most of what you read about flow testing is pure bullshit.

One of the best investments I made was my flow bench. It proved out who was telling the truth and who was lying.
 
pittsburghracer said:
I test more in a Winter month than you do in a year. Both at home and at the track during the summer. Did you find that Unicorn ET slip yet MAD. Ohhhhh that’s right. You retired from racing and now just “run” your mouth. Lol
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Yeah, piss poor testing. No time slips. Don’t forget, you haven’t seen any Brett Miller time slips and you aren’t qualified to even look at his grinders let alone critique his work.

Your arrogance is disturbing but what’s even more appalling is your inability to understand you aren’t as trick as you think you are.
 
Newbomb Turk said:
Yeah, piss poor testing. No time slips. Don’t forget, you haven’t seen any Brett Miller time slips and you aren’t qualified to even look at his grinders let alone critique his work.

Your arrogance is disturbing but what’s even more appalling is your inability to understand you aren’t as trick as you think you are.
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Once again MAD what are your results. Earth to MAD, Earth to MAD come in.
 
DionR said:
Sorry, I didn’t get to sit down with my laptop and mess with the flow numbers like requested. Might be tomorrow before I do.

On the topic of port flow numbers and my version of Desktop Dyno 2000, I know it does some extrapolation of things like cam info, so I suspect it does the same with the port flow numbers. I can plug in numbers at certain values but no idea what it does if the valve lift exceeds those numbers or what it uses between them. My guess is that it extends the curve if the lift exceeds the entered numbers. But if the flow numbers end just before the numbers “drop off” ( :D ) I bet it gets it wrong. So, in this case the more info the better and if they include the 0.050 data points even better.

I have the manual for my copy of DD and it talked about the extrapolation of the shape of the cam lobe and how DD is going to give a more accurate result if the advertised numbers are entered. I was going to review the manual again to see if it said anything about the port flow numbers but have done so yet.

On a note about the terminology of “drop off”, I find it funny that in my mind the term was used correctly for port flow numbers that only gained 5 or 6 cfm between points. The increase of cfm “dropped off” at that point. If it had lost flow, then I would have said it “lost flow”. But I am no head porter nor am I an engine builder so not arguing that my terminology is correct, only that it was how I thought about it. :)
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The version I have that We discussed will let You input whatever lift points You choose, up to 10 reference points, & the flow data at each, and whatever depression the flow data was obtained with. Not sure if Yours is the same.
 
Newbomb Turk said:
Write a check and I’ll give you results. I’ll learn more on the dyno tomorrow than you will all year.
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No thanks I’m good. My car actually goes down the track. You have been thrown off here what five times. When you get thrown off again can I help you come up with a new name. I have several in mind.
 
pittsburghracer said:
No thanks I’m good. My car actually goes down the track. You have been thrown off here what five times. When you get thrown off again can I help you come up with a new name. I have several in mind.
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Only because of people like you.

Arrogant, snotty and just an…fill in the blank.

I could get a retarded 3rd grader to drive your car. Don’t be impressed by your car when any stooge could drive that.

Anyway, you’ve proved to everyone here you can’t learn anything new, can’t think for yourself and just waste time.

Go flow a head and fall in love with your bogus numbers.
 
Newbomb Turk said:
The answer is a flow bench can never duplicate what happens in a running engine. No matter what you do it just can’t. That’s a limit of the tool.

That doesn’t mean you can’t use one and learn and make more power. As I have repeated probably a thousand times, not every number coming off the flow bench is the truth. Just like a dyno. You know what it’s like looking at all the data.

As for the question of low lift flow and guys wetting theirselves over “low lift” flow, all you need is a degree wheel and some time.

Plot out the curve, AT THE VALVE because that’s really what the engine really sees. Then let’s say you have a .600 lift cam. Look at the TIME the valve is open from .400 lift on the opening side to .400 lift on the closing side.

That’s where most of the cylinder filling occurs. The valve is moving so fast from cracking off the seat until about .400 lift that the valve moves through those low lifts so fast that the valve is really still in the way. It’s always in the way, it’s just worse at low lifts.

And, the piston is in the way at those lifts too.

And again, the pressure drop the port sees is far greater at lower lifts so flowing a port at a simple pressure drop can make the numbers look bad when they aren’t bad.

You need to bring home that flow bench, get it set up and start using it. You’ll learn so much so fast your head will spin. And you’ll most likely learn that most of what you read about flow testing is pure bullshit.

One of the best investments I made was my flow bench. It proved out who was telling the truth and who was lying.
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That all makes sense, thanks.
 
Newbomb Turk said:
Only because of people like you.

Arrogant, snotty and just an…fill in the blank.

I could get a retarded 3rd grader to drive your car. Don’t be impressed by your car when any stooge could drive that.

Anyway, you’ve proved to everyone here you can’t learn anything new, can’t think for yourself and just waste time.

Go flow a head and fall in love with your bogus numbers.
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If BS was a class you would be world champion. Daaa I can’t race anymore because racin is hard and my ET slips make me look bad.
 
Killer6 said:
The version I have that We discussed will let You input whatever lift points You choose, up to 10 reference points, & the flow data at each, and whatever depression the flow data was obtained with. Not sure if Yours is the same.
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That I can do. I just meant that I wasn’t sure what the simulator did when the lift exceeded the data points. I would assume it just continues the curve, which could be wrong if the port didn’t gain any cfm or even lost cfm at the data point that wasn’t entered.
 
pittsburghracer said:
If BS was a class you would be world champion. Daaa I can’t race anymore because racin is hard and my ET slips make me look bad.
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Only in your wet dreams. Your ignorance is on full display.

Of course, I won’t mention you are too lazy and too stupid to shift a powerglide so it’s done for you. That’s a real driver right there.

We know two shifts and you’d wet yourself. Big time bracket poser.
 
DionR said:
That I can do. I just meant that I wasn’t sure what the simulator did when the lift exceeded the data points. I would assume it just continues the curve, which could be wrong if the port didn’t gain any cfm or even lost cfm at the data point that wasn’t entered.
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I understand, it will estimate based on the flow trend as it approaches the max-lift point, and type of cam + calculated lift rate. Anybody serious should be checking and providing flow#'s that cover the max lift tho', the less 'estimating' it has to do the better.
 
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