distributer cap mods?

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No,Don is a very knowledgeable guy,I just don't agree with him running full manifold
for vacuum advance. I'm sure he has his reasoning.
But Chrysler engineers hooked vacuum advance to ported vacuum. That's fact.
I tend to think,they knew what they were talking about.
 
According to don the goverment forced everyone to run vaccum advance off of ported vaccum to increase exhaust tempatures for less emissions in the air.
But anyhow, i'm pretty sure this is a vaccum leak, because like i have already said the symptoms are the exact same as before when it had a vaccum leak around the intake.
Last time i cleaned the heads and the intake, i used a very fine sqaure piece of sand paper and i lightly sanded all the old gasket material off of the intake and the head.
I would love to have it checked with a straight edge, but i do not have one, and this is my only vehicle at the moment. But i will do my best to check it out, maybe have a friend take me to a shop who has a straight edge to get it checked out. I would hate to have to buy a new manifold, this one is basically brand new and its 300 bucks for a new one.
 
But i would think if something is tweaked it would be the manifold before it would be the heads, an aluminum intake would probly go out of shape before an iron cylinder heade would, correct?
 
What kind of intake manifold are you using??

Have the intake manifold locating pins,, located in the centre of the front and back intake gaskets, been removed..???
 
its a dual plane edelbrock rpm air-gap manifold, And i do not recall seeing any locating pins, When i installed the intake i just put studs in the corners and slipped the intake over the studs and put the rest of the bolts in.
But i forgot to re-torque the bolts after running it and letting it cool down, wich i could not believe i forgot to do that, And also i'm told you have to torque the intake bolts in sequence, does anyone know the correct sequence? And i torqued them to 15 ft lbs.
 
Johnny i dont take don's word as the gospel, he says edelbrock carburetors are junk and blames all my problems on it, but i'm still running my edelbrock carburetor. He also said i need to run 16 degrees initial timing 34 degrees total timing with 14 degrees of timing added to idle from vaccum advance for a total of 30 degrees of timing at idle, i dont do that. I run 15 degrees initial 33 degrees total and 10 degrees of timing added at idle for total of 25 degrees at idle.
The only reason i have stuck with running the vaccum advance off of manifold vaccum is because it truely does run better that way, if i could get it to run better off of ported vaccum i would run it off of ported vaccum....
 
We want to help you...We really do. You have a track record for not allowing us to do so.When your ready to wave the white towel,and allow us to assist you,let us know.
 
I'm ready lol, While i was on my lunch break, i decided to grab my torque wrench and torque the intake manifold bolts to 20 ft lbs pf torque, they were all well under that, I have 3 studs in instead of bolts and i can not torque them to 20 ft lbs or they will break. Ask me how i know that... They must be real old and brittle, But after torquing all the bolts to 20 ft lbs it did help my idle, but it didnt solve it, so that is making me an even bigger believer that it is a vaccum leak at the intake manifold.
I bought a new fel-pro intake manifold gasket set and a bottle of the right stuff gasket maker.
My plan, This saturday afternoon sometime, pull the truck into the shop and pull the intake off, clean everything as well as i can, Only use the old studs as a way to make sure i put the intake on straight as possible. Then i will take the studs off and use only 5/16 bolts all torqued at 20 ft lbs. I will let the right stuff gasket maker that i plan to use dry over night saturday night, then i will fire up the engine sunday afternoon some time and run it at full operating tempature for around a hour os so, then i will shut it off and let it cool all the way down and then i will go re-torque all the bolts to 20 ft lbs again. Does this sound like a plan?
I'm pretty sure them stupid studs are causing a problem because i am not able to torque them down, i have broken 2 studs before at 20 ft lbs of torque, and i had to use an easy out to get the broekn studs out and it was just no fun at all, so i dont go near them studs with the torque wrench, i just tightend up with a 3/8 drive ratchet and socket and called it good, but aparently they must all be torqued or it will leak.
 
Oh, and i forgot to add, i will apply the edelbrock gasgacinch to both sides of the intake manifold gasket. One i get this vaccum leak under controll then i am open to getting my vaccum advanced tuned properly on ported vaccum source.
 
Ok....So it sounds like we got your attention.
Before you go tearing your manifold off,let's make sure that you have a leak.
1. Take your vacuum advance off. Plug all ports on the carb.
2. Warm car up,and set your initial to 12btdc (just for testing).
3.What is the car doing ? Is it idling good at this point ? Does it sound erratic ?
4. Take some WD,brake cleaner,carb cleaner,an spray quick squirts around the manifold,also spray it around the carb/spacer if you have one.Does the motor speed up. If it does,you have a vacuum leak,and we will proceed from there.Start here,and report back to us with your findings.
 
ok, i will be at work all day today and wont have time to do this today, but tommarrow afternoon i will have a fire in the garage and i'll be ready to figure this out. I'll report back tommarrow after i set the initial timing down to 12 degrees and spray wd-40 around the intake manifold and the carburetor spacer.
 
yes, and i assume this is to drop the idle down lower so i will be able to hear a change in idle when sparying wd-40 along the intake manifold and the base of the carburetor, correct?
 
Johnny, you have the patience of a saint! It's really hard to go from behaving as if one source of info is the only correct one to being open minded enough to listen to other views and try their recommendations. pcj reminds me of my own hardheaded self, but I'm getting better.

And, pcj, what's this about not torquing studs because they'll break? My advice is to give the studs the field test. Pull the studs out, step outside and throw them as far out in the field as you can. If they come back, they're OK to use. While you're waiting for that to happen, get new, properly rated fasteners, torque them per spec and check for leaks.
When you're done, check to see if those studs have come back.

ATB

BC
 
pjc360 said:
yes, and i assume this is to drop the idle down lower so i will be able to hear a change in idle when sparying wd-40 along the intake manifold and the base of the carburetor, correct?
Click to expand...

I run my cars usually around 850-1000rpms. Depends on how radical a cam.

If lowering the rpm helps you find a manifold leak,that's fine.
There is a few ways to skin the cat here. Trial and error.
 
If you get to takin the intake manifold off,, make sure those locating pins are gone, .. cuz there's no locating holes in the manifold,,.. That'll give you an internal vac leak,, that sucks oil,

I've seen about a dozen aluminum manifolds with locating pin impressions in them,

2 were bent beyond repair..
 
ok. so what are fastners? And where would these locating pins be located if they were there? are they on the heads or are they on the intake? if they are there of course. And i am going to ditch the studs for sure. I am 90 percent sure that i have a vaccum leak at the intake, brcause like i said, its doing the exact same thing it was doing the last time i had a vaccum leak at the intake manifold gasket.
Also on this fel-pro gasket, does it matter wich was the gasket is installed? It's blue and grey on one side and then just grey on the other side, and on the side with blue and grey there are etches etched into the gasket material outline the ports of the intake.
 
Just a thought here...is your torque wrench working properly?
As in calibration?
If you have beam type wrench, probably no problem.
However if you have a click-stop torque wrench, it could be off as the spring in those types of wrenches loose there strength and torque readings will be off.
It happened to me and caused an AIR LEAK on my wife's 3.5L Chrysler V6.

Just a thought!

cudamike13
 
pjc360 said:
ok. so what are fastners? And where would these locating pins be located if they were there? are they on the heads or are they on the intake? if they are there of course. And i am going to ditch the studs for sure. I am 90 percent sure that i have a vaccum leak at the intake, brcause like i said, its doing the exact same thing it was doing the last time i had a vaccum leak at the intake manifold gasket.
Also on this fel-pro gasket, does it matter wich was the gasket is installed? It's blue and grey on one side and then just grey on the other side, and on the side with blue and grey there are etches etched into the gasket material outline the ports of the intake.
Click to expand...

You are already starting to slip.....Focus !

Post #37........Do it.
 
Sorry, not trying to get ahead of myself here. I'm just almost certain this is a manifold vaccum leak, in fact i'd almost garantee it is. And altho it is very possible my torque wrench could be off, i do not think it is, because i purchased brand new in august and have only used it to torque my wheels once and my intake once. And it's a craftsman with a life time warranty.
I get off work around 2 or 3 tommarrow afternoon mountain time, then i hae to start a fire in my garage because it has been 5 below zero all day everyday for the past 3 or 4 days, then i will let the engine fully warm up idling and i will plug the carburetor accum ports, drop the initial timing to 12 degrees and see how it idles, then i will spray wd-40 all around the intake nd the carburetor base gasket, and i will report back.
 
If you are breaking 5/16 studs at 20 ft lbs, then that means they are probably stretched to their limit at 15. You need to throw away all that Ching Chang hardware you're using and buy some good fasteners like ARP brand. Edelbrock has installation instructions on their website. They recommend 25 ft lbs in a specific pattern. Get a new gasket and good hardware, follow Edelbrocks procedure and your problem should be solved.
 
do i have to use fastners? I can get brand new 2 or 2 1/2 inch long dorman 5/16 bolts with washers, wouldnt that be ok? I will discard all of the studs. But first i am going to run it all 12 degrees initial and check for vaccum leak around the intake, wich i'm about 90 percent sure thats what i've got. But i will report back later this afternoon with my findings.
 
pjc360 said:
do i have to use fastners? I can get brand new 2 or 2 1/2 inch long dorman 5/16 bolts with washers, wouldnt that be ok? I will discard all of the studs. But first i am going to run it all 12 degrees initial and check for vaccum leak around the intake, wich i'm about 90 percent sure thats what i've got. But i will report back later this afternoon with my findings.
Click to expand...
Bolts are fasteners, just different terminology. Dorman makes bolts in different grades, you need to make sure you're getting the strongest they have. Home Depot, Lowes, and better hardware stores have Grade 8 bolts. These are generally the strongest available and will work perfectly. Studs will work perfectly, it's just the ones you have are junk.
 
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