I have seen several posts which talk about ride height with regard to front tire clearance. Do you raise or lower the ride height to gain front wheel clearance? My first instinct was to raise it but di to the contour of the wheel opening in the fender, i am wondering if you should lower it.
do i raise or lower ride height to get more
- Thread starter freshayr
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green67cuda
Well-Known Member
lowering it will bring the top of the spindle rearward, away from the front fender. this will also increase positive caster, and when yo go to get it aligned, they will probably want to dial in stock caster, which will put it right back where it was....
SO...best thing to do there is to find out how much caster you want and be sure they give it to you. mine used to rub, and the new strut arm bushings pushed the lower arm back, and they could barely get zero caster, and couldn't get any positive. so what I will do is fix the bushing problem, since it's puting my lower arm bushing in a bind. that will give me positive caster, and the tire will still not hit anymore because i have lowered the ride height and will get them to set 2 or 3 degrees positive caster.
...and if it does....here comes the cut-off wheel
SO...best thing to do there is to find out how much caster you want and be sure they give it to you. mine used to rub, and the new strut arm bushings pushed the lower arm back, and they could barely get zero caster, and couldn't get any positive. so what I will do is fix the bushing problem, since it's puting my lower arm bushing in a bind. that will give me positive caster, and the tire will still not hit anymore because i have lowered the ride height and will get them to set 2 or 3 degrees positive caster.
...and if it does....here comes the cut-off wheel
green67cuda
Well-Known Member
we may have different bushings...mine are 2 piece poly and they only go in one way. i wouldn't change the lower arm setup...like i said, my bushings pushed the lower arm back at the spindle end because they are too thick, and it has the inner bushings on the lower arms twisted and they look like they're in a bind.
i'm going to take my strut arm bushings out and cut about 1/4" from them to get the lower arms straight with the inner bushings. THEN i'm going to work with height/alignment to be sure the tires don't rub.
i'm going to take my strut arm bushings out and cut about 1/4" from them to get the lower arms straight with the inner bushings. THEN i'm going to work with height/alignment to be sure the tires don't rub.
OldVart
Well-Known Member
green67cuda:
It sounds like you've had quite a time with those poly strut bushings. I was considering using them on my 66 Dart, but after reading your other post, I think I'll just go back to the original rubber style. From reading other discussions on the subject, it seems the rubber bushings have also change in design over the past couple of years to a split design, but I haven't heard of them putting the LCA's in a bind. Good luck with the cutting and fitting on yours. Love the look of your car - good job.
Sid
It sounds like you've had quite a time with those poly strut bushings. I was considering using them on my 66 Dart, but after reading your other post, I think I'll just go back to the original rubber style. From reading other discussions on the subject, it seems the rubber bushings have also change in design over the past couple of years to a split design, but I haven't heard of them putting the LCA's in a bind. Good luck with the cutting and fitting on yours. Love the look of your car - good job.
Sid
dgc333
Well-Known Member
I had the poly strut rod bushings and they squeaked and groaned like hell. Replaced them with Moog replacement parts.
I never did see any appreciable improvement going from rubber to poly in the handling department.
FWIW, the orignal bushings I removed from my 68 Barracuda (and the 73 Dart I stripped) were split and the replacement Moog's were split. The thing that was different was the large washers that retain the bushings that came in the kit. They were marked "this side to bushing" which resulted in them curving away from the bushing instead of cupping them.
I never did see any appreciable improvement going from rubber to poly in the handling department.
FWIW, the orignal bushings I removed from my 68 Barracuda (and the 73 Dart I stripped) were split and the replacement Moog's were split. The thing that was different was the large washers that retain the bushings that came in the kit. They were marked "this side to bushing" which resulted in them curving away from the bushing instead of cupping them.
OldVart
Well-Known Member
I've followed quite a few discussions on different boards, even on different vehcile makes, and came to the same conclusions :notworth: you just stated. The poly squeaks, doesn't provide any better ride or control, and is just generally more of a PITA than it's worth.
I've also followed threads about the washers being reversed in the replacement sets as opposed to the originals. I'm not sure why they have them marked for installation in that manner, when it's clearly reversed to the originals. However, I'll definitely be sticking with the rubber replacement parts for my front end rebuild. Thanks for taking the time to discuss your experiences with both types of rebuild kits.
Sid
I've also followed threads about the washers being reversed in the replacement sets as opposed to the originals. I'm not sure why they have them marked for installation in that manner, when it's clearly reversed to the originals. However, I'll definitely be sticking with the rubber replacement parts for my front end rebuild. Thanks for taking the time to discuss your experiences with both types of rebuild kits.
Sid
OldVart
Well-Known Member
That's quite a nice setup you have there lenweiler, but a little too much for me for a 99% street machine. That 65 of yours is really coming along great guns - keep up the good work.
Understand your reservations about that setup. But my uppers were bent (typical) along with bum oe struts. The cost was about twice what everyone wanted for used stuff. And I suppose that's why I nolonger restore cars.
hey fellas
got a question. i have a 72 duster 340. in the service manual it refers to a couple bolts on the front lower suspension as "ride height adjustment bolts" for height adjustments. does anyone one know anything about these? are they effective in raising or lowering height any substantial amount or are they talking very small increments? my front end seems to be somewhat lower in the front then some other dusters ive seen. tires/wheels are stock 14 inch. just curios if maybe they are out of adjustment. what do ya think.
got a question. i have a 72 duster 340. in the service manual it refers to a couple bolts on the front lower suspension as "ride height adjustment bolts" for height adjustments. does anyone one know anything about these? are they effective in raising or lowering height any substantial amount or are they talking very small increments? my front end seems to be somewhat lower in the front then some other dusters ive seen. tires/wheels are stock 14 inch. just curios if maybe they are out of adjustment. what do ya think.
I think you are referring to the torsion bar adjusting bolts. Yes, they will change your ride height. There are specs as to how far you can go. My experience is you need to take the weight off of the bolt before you try to change it. I have also had luck adjusting it side to side to level the ride.
OldVart
Well-Known Member
ltrripp11, there is one height adjustment bolt on each side of the car. If you look at the bottom of the lower control arm, sort of tucked into the split area, there is a bolt that is pushing on a cam lever, for want of a better description. If you tighten these bolts, it raises the front end, and if you loosen them the front end lowers, and this is accomplished by increasing or decreasing the tortional stress in the tortion bars themselves. If you do raise your front end with these adjusters, I suggest that you take careful measurements before starting, and then ensure that you turn each bolt in the exact number of turns in order to keep both sides at the same level. If you make any significant height changes, you may need to have the front end realigned afterwards. Hope this helps.
'64 Cuda
Well-Known Member
I've heard people complain about the squeaking from polyurethane bushings for years. What about the graphite polyurethane bushings. Do they take care of the squeaking problem, or is the graphite just marketing hype?
:burnout:
:burnout:
K
krabysniper
Guest
The service manual tells to measure the distance from the floor to the bottom of the ball joint, then measure from the floor to the lowest edge of the adjusting blade (thats the "cam" he was refering to and is in between the edges of the control arm. The difrence from the inner height to the outer measurement (ball joint) is supposed to be 1 7/8" +-1/8" (for 73 Dart Swinger, yours may be slightly difrent height requirement) to be at factory ride height, but u can play with it a little more than that, you just have to be sure to get it aligned when your done, also all measurements are done with the vehicle weight ON the suspension so you have to measure it while laying on the ground. Also dont worry about the bolts being the same side to side, actual ride height side to side is way more critical than how much thread is sticking out because if your bars are factory original one may have twisted more than the other over the years.
GotDart
Well-Known Member
The ride height adjustment is really about setting the lower control arms at a prescibed angle. This adjustment is the first thing you should set when you align the front end of the car. Your actual ride height is really based on the diameter of the tires. Altering the ride height setting to accomodate non-stock tire sizes or personal preference will affect the suspension geometry as well as your alignment settings.
The strut rod bushing washers are suppose to face outward-they look reversed but it keeps them from binding/limiting the movement of the bushings. The best book on Mopar suspensions is by Tom Condran. After reading it, I went to Burien Frame and Axle and pestered Jerry and Mike about the content. They agreed w/ Tom's writings and gave abit more explanation on why he was right. Not only is the book a great primer on Chrysler suspensions, but the interchange info is pretty darn useful. :salut:
GotDart
Well-Known Member
6t8 Dart said:
Thanks for the tip on that book, I didn't know it existed. I just dropped a money order in the mail. :book:
1968FormulaS340
Well-Known Member
Poly bushings, like most high performance parts, are only a benefit if you push the car hard enough for the parts to do their job. In a normal driven street car stock rubber bushings are fine. When you move up and start pushing the car such as auto-x and other arenas that generate high cornering loads you will need and notice the benefit of better bushings. Poly bushings deflect less than rubber and prevent alignment changes caused by rubber bushings compressing. When I was drag racing my car I had my alignment done with the front raised 4. At rest the car was out of alignment but when running down the 1/4 under power the alignment would be in.
If you run meats and streamers with SS springs in back and low in front your car will never corner very well (or as well as it could or should, for you guys that think your car corners great with this combo). My car rides on E70-14 red line tires and 14x5.5 rims. It sits level, with no clearance problems. IMHO the car (340 Formula S) works very well in its stock form. This coming from a BMW E30 M3 driver.
If you run meats and streamers with SS springs in back and low in front your car will never corner very well (or as well as it could or should, for you guys that think your car corners great with this combo). My car rides on E70-14 red line tires and 14x5.5 rims. It sits level, with no clearance problems. IMHO the car (340 Formula S) works very well in its stock form. This coming from a BMW E30 M3 driver.
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