early 904 question

[vitamindart]

ok, so i have collected a Pile of parts to assemble my Valiant.
both the 4 speed parts and the 904. leaning tward the auto ( limited clutch options for the early a small bellhousing.
the 904 i have is from a 65 Barracuda.
it has the ball and trunion output.
should i use this trans or find a later slip yoke trans?
its going behind a 65 or 66 273.
are convertors ( stall ) availible for that early trans?
what about valve bodies for the cable shifter?

the car is going to be a street cruiser not a bracket car or racer.
i am just going to warm over the 273 and put a cam and some head work in it. but you never know down the road.

i know i would have to machine the register in the crank for the later convertor.

 

[zijmer]

what year of car is all this stuff going into?

 

[vitamindart]

sorry, its going in my 66 valiant.

 

[BillGrissom]

Pretty sure that 65 cable shifts are unique in that they have the modern shift pattern (P-R-N-D-2-1). The ball & trunion is on the driveshaft, i.e. it is the the front "U-joint" plus axial slip in one, also termed "Detroit" for the company that made them. Do you have the driveshaft? Rebuild parts for the ball & trunion are ~$180. Some have had a trans shop fab a slip driveshaft that bolts to their tranny output, but why bother if you can get a later tranny? How would you connect the cable shifter? You would need a steering column or floor shifter from a 65. One advantage of the early trannys is that they have a rear pump, so can be push started. Wonder if that makes them more rugged too.

 

[zijmer]

well, imho, if your starting from scratch biulding a hot rod street car. i would go 4spd. companys like macloed make awsome clutch kits these days. along with their hydrolics, makes a pretty strong package. not cheap tho but when done improves the value of your ride.

 

[65 Dartman]

the 904 i have is from a 65 Barracuda.
it has the ball and trunion output.

The 65 904 is basically a one year only transmission. It's dual cable operated - one cable for the park and the other for everything else. You would need to use either a 65-only dual cable column shifter or a 65-only cable floor shift.

should i use this trans or find a later slip yoke trans?
its going behind a 65 or 66 273.

If it were me, I would go with a 66 or later 904. 66-67 and maybe real early 68's used convertors with the small snout witch would fit your crank.

are convertors ( stall ) availible for that early trans?

Yes but most likely will be a custom order.

what about valve bodies for the cable shifter?

They are different than later ones.

If you go with the later 904 and use 66/67 buckets, you can use the 66-up console and floor shifter. If going with a column shift, you'll need to use the 1 year only 66 column shift. Might be able to adapter the 67 and later column, but haven't tried that.

 

[67Dart273]

I would do none of this

Use later stuff. You may very well find "a deal" on a later engine, and you'd have to build a bushing for the early trans snout

66's were not push button, so that trans is not "native" to anything you are dealing with. Besides, push button stuff is getting more difficult to find each year, and you'd either have to find a good shaft with "the boot" or have one (expensive) built with a built-in slip joint

It should NOT be tough to find a SB either 904 or 727 fairly cheap locally.

Drill the crank, if you want to use the 273, or I think some ATF people sell converters with the smaller snout, but I would drill the crank for the reasons stated.

If you go 4 speed, CAREFULLY check the crank DEPTH as some were not drilled deep enough Many gag, but the usual solution "back then" was to cut 3/8" or so off the 4 speed shaft.

I've REALLY grown to like a TF and I used to LOVE 4 speeds. But my legs no longer "support" heavy clutches, so I went that way "by design." I found a manual/ reverse shift body and just LOVE it.

(A side note, if this is a winter driver, using a manual VB would be GREAT in the winter, as you can lock it in 2nd or even 3rd to "kill torque" for those slick starts.)

WHAT engine is coming out? I believe if it's either a 6 or 273, and you get a 904, you can use your existing driveshaft, I'm guessing this car was not a stick?

 

[vitamindart]

i have the cable operated console for the trans from a car i parted.
i also have the driveshaft from that car but it will need to be shortened 7 1/4 vs 8 3/4 now. i also have/ plan to use the 65 buckets from the car i parted as well.


zijmer, my concern is the lack of clutch choises for the small earll a bellhousing.
i have only seen a couple options availible. if i decide to go bigger than the 273 down the road i dont think that little clutch could hold the power.

the was a 4 speed with a slant, but it was a cobbled together mess from someone else. i have the correct parts for it now. but as stated above that clutch is tiny.
and the ease of the auto is appealing.
i did not know that the 65 904 was an odd duck, almost fitting sine my 66 sedan is a odd duck.

 

[zijmer]

it's all up to what you want. you can make the '65 stuff work. cables were a problem in the past, but now they are being remade. the only differance i can think off at the moment is the speedo cable end.

 

[vitamindart]

i realy like the idea of the 4 speed, but i am concerned i wont be able to find a reliable clutch option for that early bell/small flywheel. or if i do i will need a monster leg to push in the clutch... LOL

 

[zijmer]

thats the advantage of useing hydrolics. makes the pedal effortless.