Eating coils...

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grassy

grassy

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We are enjoying our ride this year..a few small bugs but with other stresses around, we don't seem to have a lot of time to do the other things we wanted to do on the car but that is ok..

we had this problem recently.

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?p=1970890444#post1970890444

All was great..actually, better with the new coil. The engine really liked the new coil.

Got a call from my son about 12 pm last night ..car was dead in the middle of the boonies.. Got there with my toolkit and no spark again..i am assuming it is a coil failure...will know later today (I hope). We cannot have more than a couple 100 miles on the new coil. Hadn't had a chance to relocate it off the back of the engine to the firewall yet.

Coil was VERY hot to touch. I should mention that this coil one doesn't have an internal resistor but was told by a very long time. old school mechanic that it really didn't need one.

The coil will be relocated but I need if there is another explanation for this.

Engine is a 360 with electronic ignition. About 3500 kms on it.

You help is always appreciated.

Ian.
 
Car cold. Engine spins nicely. No start.

Will need a helper to see if there is spark. Will update.

Thought with the coil cold I may have a bump...

ian
 
yes you do but it doesn't have to be an external one...In the car' previous incarnation, I had a lot of problems with that type of set up..

nope...had and internally ballasted coil...
 
grassy said:
yes you do but it doesn't have to be an external one...In the car' previous incarnation, I had a lot of problems with that type of set up..

nope...had and internally ballasted coil...
Click to expand...

So you are running an E coil?

And no, the bracket doesn't need to be grounded that I know of.
 
EXACTLY what coil, brand and part number, do (did) you have? This is what, a mopar system?
 
I must be missing some of the posts.

Just took the coil in for warranty...no receipt.. no joy there but passed it on to a friend to test it. I can pass on the specs when I get it back..he has my box as well.

Before we did the resto mod, we were going through a ballast every couple of months...which has zero effect on what I have now because I changed essentially everything but my dislike for that piece of kit..so I wanted it gone.

Way, way back during our rebuild (see rebuild link below) I had a discussion on this board whether I could get rid of the external ballast and replace it with an internally ballasted coil. I upgraded our 360 with the orange box mopar electronic ignition with the associated dizzy. The consensus was yes...so I cut the ballast out of the system.

Tonight, I should be able to borrow another coil..to see if that is the culprit but that isn't the problem...I have gone through more coils in 3K kms I did with my MG and I owned that for just about 30 years...

We originally mounted the coil just behind the carb on the mounting position on the air manifold..I am thinking this may be the problem.Too much heat from the engine...but that is just a guess.

I shall post tonight what coil I am using,

Thanks, ian
 
You have to have the correct resistance coil to start with.Depends if you are running a external resistor or not determines what coil you need.I had a problem with the coil getting hot and leaking out liquid.After several different brands of round coils failing.I was told they where all overseas junk.I went to a protronix e coil 4 years ago and have not had a problem since.I can actually put my hand on it, its barely warm
 
downsr,

what is the model number and where did you mount it ?
thanx
ian
 
Mounted on the intake where the original one was.Got it from jegs dont have it in front of me.If you tell them what ignition you have they can tell you what resistance coil you need.Some have resistor built in them if you are not running a external resistor.If you cant touch it you got a problem with wrong resistance coil or the round coils are just bad .Mine would last about a month SO HOT IT WOULD BURN YOU
 
NOT using the built in ballast bypass circuit as designed, and NOT using an external resistor coil is in my opinion ill advised.

The manufacturers designed these originally using a resistor for a very good reason. GM, Ford, and Ma all did the same thing---external resistor coil, with provisions for bypassing it on start. This provides for a nice hot spark during cranking.
 
Sorry for the delay...I have either lost or lent out my service manuals so we are flying blind here.

We tossed a new coil at it Monday and it worked..but i don't think we solved the problem...we have been backtracking the wiring.

As you know, we changed trans/ engine combo and I modded our shift column to a ratchet shiftier on the floor and we were having problems getting the car started ..we had also taken all the pollution crap off of it and removed miles of wire. We could start the engine by hot wiring it but not normally. So our garage installed a relay with the neutral start switch..connected directly to the coil...so I have 2 ..actually 3 wires connected to the positive side of the coil.

1. to the electric choke of my carb
2. to the electronic ignition
3. to the relay switch.

Remove either 2 or 3 and the car will not turn over.

When it cools a bit, we will try to start the car in gear.

I am thinking that the 3rd wire may be the issue ?

Thoughts, thanks
Ian.
 
No way for me to guess, I have no crystal ball. You can download free shop manuals over at MyMopar for free

This is why, when you make changes, you have to think them out, and know what a voltmeter is telling you. Otherwise, we are just standing in the dark, shooting into the air
 
67Dart273 said:
No way for me to guess, I have no crystal ball. You can download free shop manuals over at MyMopar for free

This is why, when you make changes, you have to think them out, and know what a voltmeter is telling you. Otherwise, we are just standing in the dark, shooting into the air
Click to expand...

Thank you for your negativity. Some people cannot do everything and require help. Wiring is my weak point since you know because you have commented on many of my posts. I require someone who can think outside the box...no, ma mopar didn't always do it best and we can improve..

I have d'loaded the 1972 manual however, it is slightly different.

If you cannot help and say something constructive, I wish you would just move on...
 
grassy said:
Thank you for your negativity. Some people cannot do everything and require help. Wiring is my weak point since you know because you have commented on many of my posts. I require someone who can think outside the box...no, ma mopar didn't always do it best and we can improve..

I have d'loaded the 1972 manual however, it is slightly different.

If you cannot help and say something constructive, I wish you would just move on...
Click to expand...

Look, man, YOU YOU YOU are the one who has NOT (as in negative) supplied any pertinent information here about changes you've made.

So, have one 'ell of a lot of fun........
 
Ok girls, untangle your panties.

You're burning up coils because they are getting too much voltage.
Most canister coils will not live/operate at extended periods of time on 12v. That's why they need a (correct!) ballast resistor to lower the voltage to around 8-9 volts.

The Orange Mopar ECU box isn't helping matters either. They (still / used to) have a bad track record of being unreliable and known to just stop working one day.
Get an aftermarket ECU made by 'Standard' from Napa orso.

If you want a more reliable and simple system, replace the Mopar ECU with a GM 4-pin ignition module so you can supply the coil with the full 12-14v battery/alternator charge. No ballastresistors needed.
Schematics can be found here and online if Googled for.
 
67Dart273 said:
No way for me to guess, I have no crystal ball. You can download free shop manuals over at MyMopar for free

This is why, when you make changes, you have to think them out, and know what a voltmeter is telling you. Otherwise, we are just standing in the dark, shooting into the air
Click to expand...

And if you are unable to do this, you have 2 options;
1) find someone locally who can get under the hood,and knows his stuff, or
2) make a wiring diagram of what you currently have. Without the car in front of us, AND ,it not being original, AND, without a wiring diagram of what you have, I doubt anyone could help you. It can be done, but we'd be playing 20 question forever.

Del can help you, if you ask nicely.
 
grassy said:
Thank you for your negativity. Some people cannot do everything and require help. Wiring is my weak point since you know because you have commented on many of my posts. I require someone who can think outside the box...no, ma mopar didn't always do it best and we can improve..

I have d'loaded the 1972 manual however, it is slightly different.

If you cannot help and say something constructive, I wish you would just move on...
Click to expand...

Wow you just pissed in your own corn flakes! you lost a great resource.
 
grassy said:
Sorry for the delay...I have either lost or lent out my service manuals so we are flying blind here.

We tossed a new coil at it Monday and it worked..but i don't think we solved the problem...we have been backtracking the wiring.

As you know, we changed trans/ engine combo and I modded our shift column to a ratchet shiftier on the floor and we were having problems getting the car started ..we had also taken all the pollution crap off of it and removed miles of wire. We could start the engine by hot wiring it but not normally. So our garage installed a relay with the neutral start switch..connected directly to the coil...so I have 2 ..actually 3 wires connected to the positive side of the coil.

1. to the electric choke of my carb
2. to the electronic ignition
3. to the relay switch.

Remove either 2 or 3 and the car will not turn over.

When it cools a bit, we will try to start the car in gear.

I am thinking that the 3rd wire may be the issue ?

Thoughts, thanks
Ian.
Click to expand...
Here is what I "think" I understand. You were burning up ballast resistors for reasons unknown so instead of diagnosing and correcting the problem you removed it. You believed some half-wit who told you that the ballast resistor was not needed but you are burning up coils repeatedly, which would seem to indicate the half-wit was wrong. Then you modified the shifter, which screwed up the wiring for the starting system so it would not start. Then you let the half-wit's cousin crack-head Larry install a relay wired who knows how. The coils are of unknown pedigree and the positive terminal has not one but three wires on it. You may or may not have a wiring diagram which may or may not be for the correct vehicle and you may or may not be able to read it properly. And I still do not know what kind of car you are working on. Do I have that right? Did I miss anything?

The positive terminal of the coil is not a junction block. It should only have one wire on it. That wire should have battery voltage on it when the engine is cranking and less voltage through the ballast resistor when the engine is running. It should be the proper type of coil for a ballast resistor system. If that is the case the engine will start and run. It is that simple. Sort that out and worry about the other hacked up crap later.

And stay away from Goober half-wit and crack-head Larry.
 
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