Ever had self adjusting brakes overtighten?

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something else you might look for is wear on the backing plates. If you look closely when you have the BP stripped, you'll see three(I think) flat areas stamped in the BP. These are wear prone areas, where the edges of the shoes ride. These areas should be cleaned of dirt and rust and lightly greased with caliper grease.
 
rustycowll69 said:
with all the problems you've had, I would suggest you make changes on a minimal scale, so you can treat problems logically, and as they crop up and not muddy the waters by wholesale changes.
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Agree. It’s not about making minimal changes though, it’s about making one change at a time. If you change everything at once even if it fixes the problem you won’t know what the actual problem was.

Or worse, you change everything at once, don’t fix the original problem, and end up with another problem that you have to troubleshoot.

rustycowll69 said:
on this forum site, I've heard there are some FSM's for download. I've never accessed them, because I have many of my own, but they are invaluable for reference for members who don't have their own manuals.
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The FSM’s for a lot of these Mopars are available for free download here MyMopar - Mopar Forums & Information - Service Manuals

And once you download the FSM, you do have your own. :D

MyMopar also has parts and accessories manuals, which can be just as helpful as the FSM in some cases with the exploded diagrams and part numbers.
 
Thanks for all your inputs. Much to consider. I’ll update later this week as I plow thru this project and will follow suggestion to not do everything at once. I’m interested to jack the car up tomorrow to see if the rear brakes are still tight. Should tell me something if they are not. Hopefully the new springs I’ve ordered won’t be upside down like the current set. :)
 
I adjust until i hear them rub. Not feel them drag. And i let the adjusters do their job. I periodically clean,lubricate adjusters to keep them working.
To be honest, most vacuum brake bleeders suck.
I made a brake pedal hold down and do the entire process myself.
Press pedal,block it, go back and open bleeder. Repeat. Lots of back and forth but no helper required.
 
Tooljunkie said:
I adjust until i hear them rub. Not feel them drag. And i let the adjusters do their job. I periodically clean,lubricate adjusters to keep them working.
To be honest, most vacuum brake bleeders suck.
I made a brake pedal hold down and do the entire process myself.
Press pedal,block it, go back and open bleeder. Repeat. Lots of back and forth but no helper required.
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Sorry to hear that the brake bleeder was probably a bad investment. My wife has plenty of experience with the pump and hold routine during brake bleeding. Thanks for the info.
 
I always adjust drum brakes with the wheels on. I adjust them so that there's enough of a drag on the wheels so that I cannot spin it a full revolution. That's noticeable drag. Maybe heavy handed for some, but it works very well for me. Once everything moves around a little from the weight being on the wheels and a short test drive, they are about perfect. Since the rear brakes on a drum system have a lot to do with pedal height, I want them as tight as I can get them so there's no looseness. Been adjusting brakes like that since I was about ten years old when I was taught how and never had a problem.
 
RustyRatRod said:
I always adjust drum brakes with the wheels on. I adjust them so that there's enough of a drag on the wheels so that I cannot spin it a full revolution. That's noticeable drag. Maybe heavy handed for some, but it works very well for me. Once everything moves around a little from the weight being on the wheels and a short test drive, they are about perfect. Since the rear brakes on a drum system have a lot to do with pedal height, I want them as tight as I can get them so there's no looseness. Been adjusting brakes like that since I was about ten years old when I was taught how and never had a problem.
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That’s what I was taught to do way back when.
 
Daves69 said:
Sure looks like it. Compare the gap between the driver and passenger sides. Spring flipped as stated previously pulling the shoe upward (note wheel cylinder front pin angle).......
View attachment 1715471378

Separating as said previous. Really time for new...........
View attachment 1715471379
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Pulled springs off yesterday and they won’t work when turned over. Need to figure out why things are not fitting together better.
D0F55AD7-9B03-4988-8BF5-9217F0A17F49.jpeg
 
Brakes were tight about 3 days ago after I let the self adjusters do their thing. I just pulled car into garage and let it sit ‘till yesterday. I jacked it up yesterday and both wheels turned nicely - felt perfect. Very light drag...stopped turning after about one revolution when I spun them. I exercised the E-brake several times and it fully released each time. I pumped the brakes several times and checked the rear wheels...no change... they seemed to turn freely. Sure is looking like fluid is having trouble getting out of brake cylinders and causing drag when the system is warmed up - but not happening when cold. I now have a new set of rear brake shoes, new flexible rear brake line, and Permatex lube coming soon (per suggestion earlier from RustyRatRod. I think I’ll go ahead and install the new master brake cylinder and make sure I blow compressed air thru lines to see if they seem to be clear. Will also try checking E-brake cable to make sure it’s moving freely. (Reminder... just replaced the rear wheel cylinders). I also have new brake springs coming...maybe new spring config won’t bind against the wheel cylinder like the current one does.
 
Reason spring will not work, there are left and right springs in the kit, its possible it was replaced with a wrong one in its past.
 
they weren't exactly "upside down". The shorter spring wasn't seated in the hole properly. It was halfway out of the hole and rotated somewhat.
I've never run into Left and right return springs.
 
also the adjusting cable pulley on the rear shoe should rotate clockwise about an 1/8" or so , so it's not binding against the long return spring. the groove In that pulley shold be lightly greased as well as the area of the cable that rus through that groove.
 
rustycowll69 said:
they weren't exactly "upside down". The shorter spring wasn't seated in the hole properly. It was halfway out of the hole and rotated somewhat.
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You know, I bet you're right. FSM shows spring in center of the hole, hooking the peg from under on a 10" rear ('70). The OP's picture shows the spring below the hole and leveraging over the wheel cylinder.
upload_2020-2-18_13-16-19.png


An 11" left rear..........
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sometimes it makes a difference which spring is hooked onto the top anchor, first. In other words, which spring overlaps which at the top anchor. I think that it has to do with moving the spring away just enough so it's not contacting the wheel cylinder in operation. If you consult the FSM for your year, model and brake size, that will be the final word on which overlaps which. When you finally get everything together correctly, and the shoes are pulled up against the top anchor and return there after application, you can use some pliers to bend the top anchor spring loops together somewhat so that the open end of the spring hook is parallel to the spring wire leading to the anchor. I hope I'm explaining that correctly. Does that make sense to you?
 
rustycowll69 said:
sometimes it makes a difference which spring is hooked onto the top anchor, first. In other words, which spring overlaps which at the top anchor. I think that it has to do with moving the spring away just enough so it's not contacting the wheel cylinder in operation. If you consult the FSM for your year, model and brake size, that will be the final word on which overlaps which. When you finally get everything together correctly, and the shoes are pulled up against the top anchor and return there after application, you can use some pliers to bend the top anchor spring loops together somewhat so that the open end of the spring hook is parallel to the spring wire leading to the anchor. I hope I'm explaining that correctly. Does that make sense to you?
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Yes - that makes sense. I’m sitting here looking at three different references...the primary shoe spring goes on first. Also read that the crimp on the adjuster cable needs to face the back (I noticed mine facing out).
 
Ken71Twister said:
Yes - that makes sense. I’m sitting here looking at three different references...the primary shoe spring goes on first. Also read that the crimp on the adjuster cable needs to face the back (I noticed mine facing out).
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like they say, a picture is worth a 1000 words, hahaha.
 
On self-adjusters on the rear, does the L mean left hand threads or does it mean that it goes on the left side? Same question with R (right). Thanks.
 
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rustycowll69 said:
when you say you replaced the back lineS, I take it you mean the hard lines on the axle housing. But what about the rubber flex line from frame to axle tee fitting?. Those can deteriorate internally and act like a one way check valve. It usually happens at a strain point. I've never seen it on a rear axle flex line, but I've seen it twice on front brakes on Darts about 20-25 yrs old. Your Duster is almost 50yrs old.
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Congrats rustycow.... I think you hit the nail on the head. I replaced the rear hose this evening and cut the old hose apart. The old hose that I said “looks healthy” had a blockage. I couldn’t blow air thru the hose. I’ll add a photo showing the blocked section of hose. I’m guessing there was probably a small piece of trash that caught in the narrowed section. View attachment 1715473404
 
I took the left right brake apart and reassembled with more attention to the minor details....I read and re-read manuals and have better results so far. The E-brake works much better now too. If the rear brakes survive some test drives... I will replace the damaged rear brake shoes and proceed to replace the Master Brake Cylinder, from brake cylinders and front brake shoes. An update will follow when I get there...
 
The hose works like a check valve. Pinhole on inner lining, pressure fills between inner and outer and chokes off inner lining. then it slowly bleeds back out.
have seen it on front brakes. Never on rears. Guess it could happen. Good catch.
 
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