EZ wire ignition switch with MSD (no ballast)

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plumkrazee70

plumkrazee70

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I am to this point and have looked through many threads, with no real answer. I called Sean today and got it, so putting it on here to help anyone on the future.

Mopar -------Ez
Red -------> Ign main power (red)
Yellow ----> Ign Switch start (Purple)
Black -----> Accessories (Orange)
Blue/brown (jumped together) ---> Brown/Pink (jumped together)


I hope that helps!!
 
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Yes it does, I think about going with a MSD ignition system but I never have.
I hear there are some Chinese knockoffs out there ?
 
Where would be the very best place to buy one for my street car 360 ? And know there will be someone there that can and will give me tec support and not break the bank
 
I think the knockoffs are bought from online flyby night places with great pricing.

I've had great luck with MSD and a monkey could wire and work with one and I'm am next to useless with wiring.
 
memike said:
Where would be the very best place to buy one for my street car 360 ? And know there will be someone there that can and will give me tec support and not break the bank
Click to expand...

MSD prices don't vary, unless you have a coupon code for the vendor selling. I always buy stuff like that through summit, because of their return policy.
 
plumkrazee70 said:
I am to this point and have looked through many threads, with no real answer. I called Sean today and got it, so putting it on here to help anyone on the future.

Mopar:. Ez
Red Ign main power (red)
Yellow. Ign Switch start (Purple)
Black. Accessories (Orange)
Blue/brown (jumped together) To. Brown/Pink (jumped together)


I hope that helps!!
Click to expand...

I had to tie 3 wires together at the switch , to get mine to work . Sean told me to . The only thing is, mine will keep running if I turn the key tp acces., on shut down , ''not a problem'' since I dont use access. anyway !----------
 
famous bob said:
I had to tie 3 wires together at the switch , to get mine to work . Sean told me to . The only thing is, mine will keep running if I turn the key tp acces., on shut down , ''not a problem'' since I dont use access. anyway !----------
Click to expand...

You must have wired in the acc to the start
 
Guys it is IMPORTANT to understand how the Mopar ignition circuits work. One big difference is that Ford, GM, and for some years AMC did the ballast bypass in the starter solenoid. Mopar never did.........they used the ignition switch

You have main power in............to the switch, hot at all times. NOTE that THIS IS NOT FUSED other than the fuse link which is nearly no protection at all

OUTPUTS are

1....IGN1 "ignition run." THIS IS ONLY powered in "run" and not in start, and is part of the trouble so to say

2....IGN2 brown/ bypass circuit. This is a separate contact and is only hot in "start" and runs to the ballast connected to the + side of the coil. THIS IS THE ONLY LIVE wire during "start" to operate the ignition

"1" and "2" above are what much be jumpered together if using ANY ignition system not using a ballast, or an EFI system.

3..."Start", usually yellow, this goes to the starter relay to crank the engine. "2" and "3" are both hot in start, but they are SEPARATE circuits. Trying to tie them together or substituting them will cause a circuit backfeed and other problems

4..."Accessory" powered both in "run" and "accessory" this obviously feeds accessories and ALSO drops off in the "start" position
 
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Workarounds If you are NOT using an original Mopar ignition switch, you might have a "situtation." For example, I once had a Chev column in a Toy FJ40 Landcruiser, with a Mopar SB engine. Just like Mopar, "ignition run" goes cold in starting. BUT THERE IS NO "ign2." This function in the Chev was provided by the "I" terminal on the starter solenoid. "What to do?"

There are a couple of ways....................

1.....big isolation diode. using a fairly large diode, you can take the 'start' wire and run from there through a diode to the ignition system. This imitates tying IGN1 and IGN2 together with a Mopar switch, and the diode keeps the "run" line from feeding back into the "start" line

2....Use a relay. This is simple, works well, and there are lots of options. Use the "start" line to key a second relay, and feed the relay switched output back to the "run" line.

3....If you are using a Mopar start relay, there is a later "Jeep" style which has one extra terminal. That terminal can be used for your IGN2 substitute. The disadvantage of this later relay is that instead of using a "square screw for the solenoid terminal it was replaced by a "push on" terminal.

Jeep relay:

Big stud........same as original, a battery junction, and one relay contact
Bottom two flag/ push on terminals........same as original, one is "start" wire, other goes to NSS switch/ clutch switch
Middle flag / push on........goes to Mopar starter solenoid, same as original 'square screw'
Top "flag" terminal up by the "big stud." This is the added terminal, and has a separate contact, which can substitute for your IGN2 connection

33003934.jpg


4....Use an AMC "Ford like" special starter solenoid. For a few years, AMC used a relay that was very similar to Ford, but with ONE EXTRA terminal. (5 total) This terminal was used for the neutral safety switch, so what you had on this relay was
1...Big stud to battery
2...Big stud to starter (On Mopar, this feeds the solenoid start wire)
3....small "start" terminal......goes to Mopar yellow start wire
4....small stud NSS terminal.....goes to Mopar neutral safety / clutch safety
5.....small stud "IGN" terminal goes to your ignition run line and performs the bypass function

The weird AMC "Ford like" relay, the NSS stud is at the rear, a push on Ford style connector

5972892_cbw_s607_pri_larg.jpg


5972892_cbw_s607_alt3_pri_larg.jpg
 
Last edited:
67Dart273 said:
Workarounds If you are NOT using an original Mopar ignition switch, you might have a "situtation." For example, I once had a Chev column in a Toy FJ40 Landcruiser, with a Mopar SB engine. Just like Mopar, "ignition run" goes cold in starting. BUT THERE IS NO "ign2." This function in the Chev was provided by the "I" terminal on the starter solenoid. "What to do?"

There are a couple of ways....................

1.....big isolation diode. using a fairly large diode, you can take the 'start' wire and run from there through a diode to the ignition system. This imitates tying IGN1 and IGN2 together with a Mopar switch, and the diode keeps the "run" line from feeding back into the "start" line

2....Use a relay. This is simple, works well, and there are lots of options. Use the "start" line to key a second relay, and feed the relay switched output back to the "run" line.

3....If you are using a Mopar start relay, there is a later "Jeep" style which has one extra terminal. That terminal can be used for your IGN2 substitute. The disadvantage of this later relay is that instead of using a "square screw for the solenoid terminal it was replaced by a "push on" terminal.

Jeep relay:

Big stud........same as original, a battery junction, and one relay contact
Bottom two flag/ push on terminals........same as original, one is "start" wire, other goes to NSS switch/ clutch switch
Middle flag / push on........goes to Mopar starter solenoid, same as original 'square screw'
Top "flag" terminal up by the "big stud." This is the added terminal, and has a separate contact, which can substitute for your IGN2 connection

View attachment 1715452773

4....Use an AMC "Ford like" special starter solenoid. For a few years, AMC used a relay that was very similar to Ford, but with ONE EXTRA terminal. (5 total) This terminal was used for the neutral safety switch, so what you had on this relay was
1...Big stud to battery
2...Big stud to starter (On Mopar, this feeds the solenoid start wire)
3....small "start" terminal......goes to Mopar yellow start wire
4....small stud NSS terminal.....goes to Mopar neutral safety / clutch safety
5.....small stud "IGN" terminal goes to your ignition run line and performs the bypass function

The weird AMC "Ford like" relay, the NSS stud is at the rear, a push on Ford style connector

View attachment 1715452782

View attachment 1715452783
Click to expand...

No arguing here , my stuff is running pretty good, and have had no problems w/ it , MSD or anything. Only small problem is I haven`t taken time to get it tuned enough, a little rich still yet , more to come next summer-----
I do have a little glitch after slowing down to turn a corner , when I first touch the gas pedal to speed up (slowly) , I have a momentary stumble that is over almost instantly, that I haven`t pursued yet. ----???
 
67Dart273 said:
Workarounds If you are NOT using an original Mopar ignition switch, you might have a "situtation." For example, I once had a Chev column in a Toy FJ40 Landcruiser, with a Mopar SB engine. Just like Mopar, "ignition run" goes cold in starting. BUT THERE IS NO "ign2." This function in the Chev was provided by the "I" terminal on the starter solenoid. "What to do?"

There are a couple of ways....................

1.....big isolation diode. using a fairly large diode, you can take the 'start' wire and run from there through a diode to the ignition system. This imitates tying IGN1 and IGN2 together with a Mopar switch, and the diode keeps the "run" line from feeding back into the "start" line

2....Use a relay. This is simple, works well, and there are lots of options. Use the "start" line to key a second relay, and feed the relay switched output back to the "run" line.

3....If you are using a Mopar start relay, there is a later "Jeep" style which has one extra terminal. That terminal can be used for your IGN2 substitute. The disadvantage of this later relay is that instead of using a "square screw for the solenoid terminal it was replaced by a "push on" terminal.

Jeep relay:

Big stud........same as original, a battery junction, and one relay contact
Bottom two flag/ push on terminals........same as original, one is "start" wire, other goes to NSS switch/ clutch switch
Middle flag / push on........goes to Mopar starter solenoid, same as original 'square screw'
Top "flag" terminal up by the "big stud." This is the added terminal, and has a separate contact, which can substitute for your IGN2 connection

View attachment 1715452773

4....Use an AMC "Ford like" special starter solenoid. For a few years, AMC used a relay that was very similar to Ford, but with ONE EXTRA terminal. (5 total) This terminal was used for the neutral safety switch, so what you had on this relay was
1...Big stud to battery
2...Big stud to starter (On Mopar, this feeds the solenoid start wire)
3....small "start" terminal......goes to Mopar yellow start wire
4....small stud NSS terminal.....goes to Mopar neutral safety / clutch safety
5.....small stud "IGN" terminal goes to your ignition run line and performs the bypass function

The weird AMC "Ford like" relay, the NSS stud is at the rear, a push on Ford style connector

View attachment 1715452782

View attachment 1715452783
Click to expand...

Sorry to resurrect an old thread, but in using a Jeep style starter relay, is the extra IGN terminal mentioned above powered in both start and run? I am assuming I can use that additional terminal to power my EFI during start and run?
 
No it is only to replace the missing "bypass" circuit if you are not using a factory mopar ignition switch.

There has been some discussion on EFI, but when I had mine together I simply used the "usual" solution of tying IGN1 and IGN2 together, either in the engine bay or at the switch, and use that to trigger a bosch style relay which then powers "run" loads
 
67Dart273 said:
Workarounds If you are NOT using an original Mopar ignition switch, you might have a "situtation." For example, I once had a Chev column in a Toy FJ40 Landcruiser, with a Mopar SB engine. Just like Mopar, "ignition run" goes cold in starting. BUT THERE IS NO "ign2." This function in the Chev was provided by the "I" terminal on the starter solenoid. "What to do?"

There are a couple of ways....................

1.....big isolation diode. using a fairly large diode, you can take the 'start' wire and run from there through a diode to the ignition system. This imitates tying IGN1 and IGN2 together with a Mopar switch, and the diode keeps the "run" line from feeding back into the "start" line

2....Use a relay. This is simple, works well, and there are lots of options. Use the "start" line to key a second relay, and feed the relay switched output back to the "run" line.

3....If you are using a Mopar start relay, there is a later "Jeep" style which has one extra terminal. That terminal can be used for your IGN2 substitute. The disadvantage of this later relay is that instead of using a "square screw for the solenoid terminal it was replaced by a "push on" terminal.

Jeep relay:

Big stud........same as original, a battery junction, and one relay contact
Bottom two flag/ push on terminals........same as original, one is "start" wire, other goes to NSS switch/ clutch switch
Middle flag / push on........goes to Mopar starter solenoid, same as original 'square screw'
Top "flag" terminal up by the "big stud." This is the added terminal, and has a separate contact, which can substitute for your IGN2 connection

View attachment 1715452773

4....Use an AMC "Ford like" special starter solenoid. For a few years, AMC used a relay that was very similar to Ford, but with ONE EXTRA terminal. (5 total) This terminal was used for the neutral safety switch, so what you had on this relay was
1...Big stud to battery
2...Big stud to starter (On Mopar, this feeds the solenoid start wire)
3....small "start" terminal......goes to Mopar yellow start wire
4....small stud NSS terminal.....goes to Mopar neutral safety / clutch safety
5.....small stud "IGN" terminal goes to your ignition run line and performs the bypass function

The weird AMC "Ford like" relay, the NSS stud is at the rear, a push on Ford style connector

View attachment 1715452782

View attachment 1715452783
Click to expand...
 
I think they were used on later Dodge pickups as well, in the '80's. You need to find a parts guy who knows how to run the illustrated parts guide.
 
mopowers said:
Look at #SS581.
Click to expand...
I don't think so. I believe that is known as "grounded base." You have to understand there are several configurations for solenoids

What you are trying to do with the Jeep style relay, is it has a second output to jumper the ballast resistor
 
67Dart273 said:
Guys it is IMPORTANT to understand how the Mopar ignition circuits work. One big difference is that Ford, GM, and for some years AMC did the ballast bypass in the starter solenoid. Mopar never did.........they used the ignition switch

You have main power in............to the switch, hot at all times. NOTE that THIS IS NOT FUSED other than the fuse link which is nearly no protection at all

OUTPUTS are

1....IGN1 "ignition run." THIS IS ONLY powered in "run" and not in start, and is part of the trouble so to say

2....IGN2 brown/ bypass circuit. This is a separate contact and is only hot in "start" and runs to the ballast connected to the + side of the coil. THIS IS THE ONLY LIVE wire during "start" to operate the ignition

"1" and "2" above are what much be jumpered together if using ANY ignition system not using a ballast, or an EFI system.

3..."Start", usually yellow, this goes to the starter relay to crank the engine. "2" and "3" are both hot in start, but they are SEPARATE circuits. Trying to tie them together or substituting them will cause a circuit backfeed and other problems

4..."Accessory" powered both in "run" and "accessory" this obviously feeds accessories and ALSO drops off in the "start" position
Click to expand...
 
67 Dart273. Thanks so much for this! Installed MSD 8388 ProBillet replacing 5 Point Mopar ignition to get rid of the ballast and ECM. Ended up I had Ignition 2 (brown wire) hooked to my coil initially so was only getting 12v during cranking and as soon as I let go of start the engine would quit because of no spark. Spliced Ignition 1 (blue wire) to the positive port on the coil along with the brown wire and MSD harness and she fired right up! 12v at “on” from the blue wire which shuts off at “start” but brown wire provides the 12v at “start” and shuts off at run. I think what’s confusing is the blue wires from the alternator, voltage regulator, ignition, and coil are all tied in together. I used a four way wire connector. Anyway for anyone swiping from a Mopar 5 pin ignition to an MSD 8388 I hope this helps.

6071CC5F-13E6-4A90-ABB5-30A62F59AB0D.jpeg


1C4EE1D1-E9CA-4E81-A517-A4B1A03C105D.jpeg
 
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