Flickering Lights

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Have, I hope, given information that I uncovered today after stripping tape off of wiring harness. Got a big mess on my hands. Trying to follow all the different color changing wires has been fun! Guess I will have to get my wire out and do some more rewiring.
Still would like to know why Blue wire cut at alternator and connected to terminal at bulkhead connector was for or even went to. Would it have been connected to battery terminal of alternator?
 
olddman said:
Still would like to know why Blue wire cut at alternator and connected to terminal at bulkhead connector was for or even went to. Would it have been connected to battery terminal of alternator?
Click to expand...
No it would not.

For the moment, forget the mess. Lets go back over how it originally worked.
Then what needs to be done will become clearer.

Follow the black wire labled R6 all the way to the big welded junction shown as a black circle.
Notice that at this juntions it joins with the battery wire.
So all the wires connected at junction are always hot, even with the key off.
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When the key is in Run position, power is available in the J2 wire Ignition Run.
The Ign terminal on the voltage regulator is now at system voltage.
The regulator is like a switch. If the voltage is lower than the set point, the regulator closes the switch and electricity can flow through the regulator and the alternator's rotor.
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The spinning rotor creates an electromagnetic field.
The reaction in the non-spinning windings is a lot excited electrons.
When the regulator opens the switch, the electromagnetic field loses strength.

olddman said:
Still would like to know why Blue wire cut at alternator and connected to terminal at bulkhead connector was for or even went to.
Click to expand...
So originally a blue wire was connected from the bulkhead position B to the ballast resistor, and another blue wire continued on to the voltage regulator.

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Does this make sense?

Put some more photos up in the other thread or this one.
Since you've already unwrapped the harness tape, I think the best will be to replace sections of multicolor with new. But before jumping in, it would be best to see how the electronic ignition box and ground controlling regulator are wired in and located.
 
You might be confusing him. He has a 70/ later regulator

Try not to overthink this. I told you earlier. Regardless of car model there is ONE source of power, ONE wire coming into the engine bay that is "hot in run" from the key switch. ONE

EVERYTHING under that hood that gets powered with the key "in run" comes off that one wire
(On a side note you might want to put a relay in that circuit specially since you are "in to" it)

The run wire--depending on year--feeds the ignition system (ballast), the VR IGN terminal, electric choke if used, on later models sometimes some smog doo dads. ON A 70 OR LATER with the electronic VR it also feeds power to one of the two alternator fields.

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On a second note, now that I've said (again) that there is one source of "run" power, it is also important to realize that the RUN voltage goes DEAD, that's right DEAD in "start." So how does it fire? There's a bypass circuit, IGN2, a separate contact on the ignition switch that works just like the start contact--only separate. IT goes from the key through the bulkhead to the coil+ side of the coil--and provides spark power when the car is cranking.
 
A lot of info! Going to read and everything and get a try to get a clear picture in my mind. May even draw a diagram. Will take more pictures in a couple of days. Won't be able to work on car as wife is going in for surgery to have kidney removed today.
In the meantime, I will go over all the information posted. Thanks to everyone.
 
Brought wife home Monday after successful surgery to remove kidney. Now I am chief cook and bottle washer!!
Did some more work on the Dart yesterday. I have decided to make a new wiring harness. The old harness is like a bird nest, burnt wires, different colors tied into different colored wires, and to replace sections of wire with correct color wire would not do away with splices/unions. Have started the process but had to order three more different colored wires to finish. Got a colored wiring diagram and another that list wire sizes used to connect components.
Hope to finish within the next week or so and will let everyone know how it goes or may have to come back for some HELP.
Have added a drawing of how wires were connected to starter relay, bulkhead, and battery.
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Thanks again for all the help.
 
olddman said:
Brought wife home Monday after successful surgery to remove kidney. Now I am chief cook and bottle washer!!
Click to expand...
Great !
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I think drawing out your own wire schematics and cable diagrams will go a long way.
Begining with the main power feeds first as you are doing, seems like a good approach. After that you can adress the modifications for the voltage regulator and the electronic ignition.

The factory scheme uses a 16 ga fusible link to protect the 12 ga wires from a battery short.
This includes the alternator output circuit.
The ammeter was placed to show battery discharging and charging.
upload_2022-2-24_12-0-16.png

A1 was oriignally black 10 ga wire. Around 1966 it more often was red. As long as its 10 gage and you know what it is I think either color is fine.
The fusible link should be 16 ga. That's important. Big enough to handle starting and emergencies when the alternator fails. Small enough to melt before the 12 gage wires.

On your car, someone has connected the alternator output to the battery circuit at the solenoid.
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It may have been due to a loose or damaged terminal ?
They may have also rerouted the power feed around the ammeter.
Sometimes the ammeter gets converted to a voltmeter.
It will be importqant to figure out what was done.
 
This will fix you issue. The problem you're having is more than likely dirty or worn ignition contacts in your ignition switch. Add a relay to feed the voltage regulator and your problem will go away.
 
Had a little time today to work on my Dart. Pulled the instrument cluster. Does not look like the ammeter has been bypassed. Yet from looking at a MAD drawing and the way wires have been run the process was started but not finished.
Think that I am just going to have to make new harness for the engine side and complete the MAD conversion. May be wrong but will check this out as I make repair this mess.
May take a while to finish as I am still chief cook and bottle washer for another week or two.
Thanks again to all who have taken time to help me out with this. I am learning a lot about wiring and testing components. Will keep update and some pictures as I move along.
Sure that I will be back for more help.
 
Sound good. Appreciate the updates.

olddman said:
Yet from looking at a MAD drawing and the way wires have been run the process was started but not finished.
Think that I am just going to have to make new harness for the engine side and complete the MAD conversion.
Click to expand...

Well you might have to do something along those lines depending on what you find.
I hope you can put it back to stock configuration. The MAD scheme is very general and has its own design faults. I guess it brings them business as it certainly gets a lot of internet attention.

If the ammeter's terminals are OK, its probably good to go.
My question is why the alternator power disconnected at the bulkhead. It may be because that connector got damaged. That is the connection that sees the largest currents. The Previous owner/mechanic may not have seen the Mad scheme, but simply been looking for another route to get power fed in.
 
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As far as I can tell the connection point at the bulkhead, where the alternator power was disconnected, does not look damaged. No burnt marks, discoloration, or melting of bulkhead connector. Head scratcher!!
Quick question. I have three 18 gauge wires that I need to put into a flag terminal. Thought about making a bundle with the three wires and then insert one 18 gauge wire into the bundle. Then solder the whole bundle and insert the one 18 gauge wire into the flag terminal and solder that connection. Flag terminal would then attach to the bottom terminal of the ballast resistor. Is this a good way to do this or not?
 
That concerns me on two points.
One is that single 18 gage connection is carrying load to three 18 ga wires. That might be OK knowing the loads are actually pretty low.
The other concern is having no strain relief with three wires. Maybe if they are supported it would be OK.

Another approach is:
Two wires on a standard open barrel female terminal.
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Use a piggyback to add more.
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OR.

Make a single 16 ga wire connection to the terminal.
Then make a junction in a location where the wires all have good support and not subject to a tight bend or turn.

Inline wiring splice clips........from the Dodge RAM service manual

There are also techniques for wrapping the wires and soldering in a branch.

edit:
Here's an example where there was improper wire support and an improper solder splice.
Solder and Poor Trouble Shooting = $$$$ - Marine How To
I'm not against soldering wire, just wanted to point out that these sort of problems are real.
 
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The single wire would be carrying current from the bundle of three wires. One wire goes to electronic ignition module, one wire goes to "I" terminal of voltage regulator, and the third wire goes to bulkhead connector.
Right now all three wires have been twisted together and crimped into a female connector. Can probably do this also but was just wondering if I could connect them as I described in prior post.
 
Electric current is like water flowing though a pipe.
It flows from the alternator to the junction(s) where it branches off.

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Current flow with Engine running


As much as 6 gallons per minute flow through the pipes to the junction.
Then 3 gallons per minute or less flow through each branch.

Same idea except instead of pipe and gpm, its wires and amps.
 
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