Front end wont stay aligned

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GTSDustin

GTSDustin

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Having problems with our 67 Barracuda not keeping an alignment. Everything up front is brand new:
Upper/lower ball joints
Tie rod ends
sway bar links
tires (radials)
Upper/lower control arm bushings
new eccentrics
My dad and I have lined this car up at least 10 times. When we are finished, it looks great, and handles great, but about a 1/4 mile down the road....it goes bat **** crazy.Every single time. I have recently heard of these k frames cracking around where the lower control arm bolts through. Is this common?
This is not my first mopar, and my dad has been doing alignments for 30+ years. Just don't know what to try next. Any help would be appreciated!
 
Are you sure your upper A bolts are gripping!

K-Frames will crack at the collar but should be obvious.

Where is the alignment getting off?
 
Not sure what to say about all that, except LCA and strut rod bushings but you said everything is new.
When everything looks right and then suddenly changes something is moving and it's as simple as that.

Pins through the K like you mentioned is also common enough to check them to be sure, and take a good look at the steering box area for loose bolts or cracking around it.

Also, you do consider ball joints as being in the everything new category, right?:D
 
Check this area closely for cracks in the k-frame....
 

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And check the other side of that hole for signs that the pivot is wallering around. It should be tight. HDK has a repair design for the front hole being loose on the pivots I got from him. It uses a washer and a new pivot, but is for the tubular LCA... He could make it fit stock LCAs and save K frames IMO.
 
You're going to need to tear it down to inspect everything. I have driven a car with cracked LCA pin tubes. It's an adventure, but it's NOT wildly scary. I have seen slightly too much toe-in cause the front end to pull down (I didn't believe it until I saw it myself).
 
Ok thanks guys. And yes EVERYTHING is new. Moog or Napa parts

I put the new style replacement strut arm bushings in, the cone style one piece. I didn't like the looks of them from day one but used them anyway. I kept the old ones, may put them in for kicks and giggles.
Just don't know how it can look great in the garage and bam it settles going down the road.
 
TrailBeast said:
Not sure what to say about all that, except LCA and strut rod bushings but you said everything is new.
When everything looks right and then suddenly changes something is moving and it's as simple as that.

Pins through the K like you mentioned is also common enough to check them to be sure, and take a good look at the steering box area for loose bolts or cracking around it.

Also, you do consider ball joints as being in the everything new category, right?:D
Click to expand...

Yes lol. I actually put another set of brand new lower ball joints on with no success. I put new ones on my 65 coronet one time and 2 months later I had to replace the passenger side.
 
Make sure you have correct length eccentric bolts in the upper control arms. If they are too long (and some aftermarket ones are), they will not tighten fully and the arms will slip out of place when driven.

An easy way to tell is to mark the eccentrics after an alignment and then recheck them after you drive. If they slip, you will see the marks have moved.
 
I drove my 65 when the steering mount darn near broke off. It was cracked on 2 of the 3 mount planes. Imagine speed wobbles on a skateboard, but its your entire car! It happened at about 15 mph and you would have to brake hard or the car would feel like it would shake itself to pieces. I drove 5 miles home at 10 mph. On a lighter note, check the idler arm and centerlink pivots. They wouldnt cause an out of alignment but would make steering sloppy.
 
RustyRatRod said:
Make sure you have correct length eccentric bolts in the upper control arms. If they are too long (and some aftermarket ones are), they will not tighten fully and the arms will slip out of place when driven.

An easy way to tell is to mark the eccentrics after an alignment and then recheck them after you drive. If they slip, you will see the marks have moved.
Click to expand...

Good idea. Will do that on the eleventh alignment. Lol
 
We don't even know if things even moved or not yet.
Like RRR said about the upper bolts (did they move after the alignment) or did anything else.

Is this a case of just did everything and it drives like crap, and has any of it been checked again yet?

If not we might as well be putting our thoughts down on paper, put them in a bottle and toss them in the ocean. :D
 
All the steering components are tight. I have rocked the wheel back and forth while dad looked under the car at everything. I'm going to tear it back apart again soon and will let you guys know what I came across. Gotta be something simple somewhere...
 
Also another trick that I always do with any vehicle with eccentric cams.....I remove them, take a hammer and punch and punch dimples into the side of the cams that go against the frame brackets. This gives the cams teeth to bite into the brackets and helps keep them from slipping.
 
Bounce the front end while parked. If you hear the UCA bushings creak the cam bolts aren't tight enough. I usually weld around the K frame LCA pivot tubes, broken or not, just to reinforce the area. I MIG weld a bead completely around them and then grind it back til it's the same height as original so the LCA sits in the stock position.
When you realign it - which measurement has changed from the last alignment - caster, camber, toe? Also, make sure the steering box bolts holding it to the k frame are really tight. DAMHIK...
 
The top of the wheels go way in. And the front of the car will drop an inch
I have bounced the front of the car until the wheels came off the ground, no noises or creaks at all. It will make a slight clunk when it acts up going down the road.
 
Sure sounds like the cams are slipping.
 
GTSDustin said:
The top of the wheels go way in. And the front of the car will drop an inch
Click to expand...

Please check the area really well that I posted a picture of above. It's difficult to see without paying very close attention....

Your symptoms point there IMO
 
I'm going to do a thorough review on the k frame tomorrow.
I put new eccentric bolts in because the last alignment we tightened one so tight we snapped one, probably out of frustration. But I will do the dimple trick, and mark everything. I had it on my mind to mark them but would always forget to.
 
6pk2goDemon said:
Please check the area really well that I posted a picture of above. It's difficult to see without paying very close attention....

Your symptoms point there IMO
Click to expand...

Seems like one or the other has to be happening (upper A or Pins) if everything is new and tight right?
 
RustyRatRod said:
Make sure you have correct length eccentric bolts in the upper control arms. If they are too long (and some aftermarket ones are), they will not tighten fully and the arms will slip out of place when driven.

An easy way to tell is to mark the eccentrics after an alignment and then recheck them after you drive. If they slip, you will see the marks have moved.
Click to expand...

I have seen this with Moogs! My solution was hardened washers under the nuts, as there was not enough threading up the shank. I could torque that nut up, and it would all be good except I could still move the UCA around! Like Rusty says; mark 'em.
 
how are you doing your alignment.
Jack each side up under the splndle nut individually,remove the wheel and lower until the rotor is on a block of wood at ride height.
As RRR says,index everything so you can see if anything has moved.Everything must be loose with the suspension under load,even lower control arm pivet pins.Tighten after each adjustment ,re install wheels and check.
 
What you are describing sounds like too much toe-in pulling the car down on the stops. Jack the car up and set it back down. Then bounce it up and down multiple times. If the ride height is back where it was right after the alignment, you have found the problem.

Like I said, I have seen this otherwise I wouldn't believe it. We had slightly too much toe-in on my son's Barracuda. Pulled the front down in ten feet...
 
My steering on my manual steering '67 Notch big block is extremely vague, sloppy, actually.

And when I bounce the front end up & down there is a LOUD creak.

I take it now that I need to inspect the front end for cracks.

Thank you!
 
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