Help needed with sb 318

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H

H Monster

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Should probably start by mentioning I need help with general 318 stuff. I asked and was given the OK to post, as it is NOT an A body. Beast sat idle for maybe 5 years or more.....classic was running when parked. Was not running when I bought it.

Just joined.....have questions

Anyway, second part is while I happen to own a set of 40 year old Craftsman wrenches, I'm not a mechanic. Last engine I pulled using them was over 40 years ago. Can do basic stuff like swapping parts, etc, but if you get technical, you will get over my head in a hurry. Do not normally do my own wrenching, but this isn't normally. I need to get this thing working myself so when it has issues, I can resolve them.

So beyond the basic stuff I did to get her running (pulled carb....handed it to a guy who has done thousands of carb kits), new starter, new starter switch and ignition wiring circuit; new gas tank and fuel lines, new battery, changed oil, oil filter, etc. We got her going and she idles and runs pretty good. Have plenty more to do on the perimeter, but have questions about the engine.

One issue, she had two freeze/core plugs that were leaking pretty bad. One a steady, drip, drip, drip. Initial concern was should could have a busted block, but then realized all the anti-freeze had probably leaked out, so nothing to freeze or bust. But, did replace two of the plugs, however and in doing so, got nearly 1/4 cup of sediment / scale from each hole. One side was so plugged up I began to wonder if that was where they buried Jimmy Hoffa. But makes me think the engine coolant channels could be really clogged up. Anyway to get rid of that short of tearing down the engine? Perhaps replace all the other plus and flush it really well?

Second issue, when checking the oil, dip stick showed nothing. So drained the oil, new filter, added 5 quarts and still no oil? So thinking maybe it had a bigger than standard oil pan.....like maybe 7 or 8 quarts, kept adding oil. At 10 quarts, still nothing showing on the dip stick.

Is it possible for the dip stick to somehow deviate out of the hole it is supposed to go in? Hangs up where it enters the block, but then pushes on through. For this thing not to show oil with 10 quarts in it makes no sense. Oil pan does not look that big.

Also, when you lay the dip stick up against the tube, tip bottoms out just above the bottom of the forward pan, just where it seems to me like it should.

Any thoughts? Can't be running this without knowing oil level is where it is supposed to be.

hm dip stick 1.jpg
hm dip stick 2.jpg
hm oil pan.jpg


PS: Didn't start or run it with that much oil. Drained 4 quarts out before starting.
 
Can you take a picture of the handle-end of the dipstick in the tube? Also measure the length of the dipstick while removed.
It looks like a rear sump truck pan, nothing special. So capacity is only around 6 quarts, something like that.
It is possible for the dipstick go off course inside the pan. It's also possible someone put a short car dipstick into a long truck tube. They are different.
 
pull the thermostat out and the core plugs and flush up and down till all that crust comes out.
looks like a truck pan. I believe the stick would go into a channel in the pan to reach the oil in the sump.
6 qts of oil at the most in pan and long filter.
sorry, didn't mean to duplicate answers. must have been answering at same time.
 
Is this engine in a vehicle?
#1, if the freeze plugs you replaced was cocked full of rusted dry gunk I would pull as may freeze plugs you can get to and fish a coat hanger wire or something to bust all that loose and get as much as you can out of there and run a garden hose though the top to wash it all out. Also if those plugs were rusted out the others are not far behind.

#2, Most 318 car engines hold 5 qts, some truck engines do hold more. Looks like a rear sump truck pan to me, but maybe not. Don't really know what to tell ya on the dip stick other than it might be catching something like you said. Have to tear it apart and check it out !!!! No telling what may have been done to an old car and or engine.
 
Would have to pull the dipstick on my truck and measure it so you know whether its correct or not.
Pan looks like a piece of cake to remove though.
 
Well, most of the guys have addressed the dipstick issue but I think on the freeze plugs they ignored the elephant in the room.
If you block has a lot of sediment, it will be very good to flush. I would pull the drain plugs in the block on both sides. These are visible 9/16 hex head in pics two and three. You will likely have to clear sediment to get them to drain properly. You can flush from top to bottom by pulling a heater hose loose and push water from your garden hose. (now on the the bad part)
Other freeze plugs, such as the ones under the motor mounts and at the front of the block, (picture two again), may not be currently leaking. These may be compromised and leaking soon after the initial stuff is flushed from the block. Your choice on taking this to heart. Ditto on the statement #1 from Rat Rod AL.
Take it from the guys who have been there.
 
Yes,i agree, if one or 2 leaked the rest arent far behind. The freeze plug kit is like 18 dollars and everything is in there. Even comperssed air will blow out all the scale.
 
I have seen a factory 7 quart pan on a van once, 1989 318 high swirl. With a large oil filter, took two gallons of oil. But my moneys on the dipstick being wrong for the application. Ditto on the freeze plugs, pull all the old ones and the block plugs out, run coat hanger or engine cleaning brushes through everything, prepare to hose down and get dirty. If you have access to a hot water pressure washer, even better. Plan on running flushing water through your radiator and everything else, too, that crud builds up and cakes everywhere in the whole cooling system. What year truck or van is that?
 
Last edited:
Garrett Ellison said:
I have seen a factory 7 quart pan on a van once, 1989 318 high swirl. With a large oil filter, took two gallons of oil. But my moneys on the dipstick being wrong for the application. What year truck or van is that?
Click to expand...

Truck or van? Actually neither. It is a piece of farm equipment dating back to around 1972. Original 318 engine replaced sometime in past 10 years with 318 dating to 1983, as per casting number on the block. Has no VIN, so is thought to be either a warranty engine or something Chrysler sold for generic use. Also has a 4 or 5 speed NP540 transmission that was apparently used in mid sized (2 ton size) trucks from that era. So probably sold to the outfit that built these things as a combination unit.

The intro thread I referenced has a photo of the monster in general. These are pictures of the engine as mounted.
hm engine front.jpg
hm engine 1.jpg


Basically, think of it as being like a school bus chassis. Engine mounted in the middle between the rails. So in general, pretty easy to get to the front, back, sides and bottom, but not much room overhead. Engine serves two purposes. It propels the beast, but also runs a hydraulic pump off the front crankshaft. Hydraulic ump runs a couple hydraulic motors, including one for the fan for a remote mounted radiator, plus some lift cylinders.

Out of all the engines the guy who invented this thing could have used, he chose a Chrysler 318 to run it. Guy was pretty smart.
 
Beast came with two dip sticks. One in it and a brand new replacement the seller picked up from somewhere. Neither of them are long enough to find oil....with 10 quarts in it.
hm dip stick 3.jpg
hm dip stick 4.jpg


Tried to get pictures of the dip stick mounted in the tube, but is too dark to see anything. May try again in the morning with a real digital camera vs. my cell phone.
 
The oil pan has a guide for the rear sump and dipstick is quite long. I think i have a pan laying around,will check it. And also measure my dipstick. Think its around 30”
 
Daing, That Thing is Cool! I don't know what it is , but I've always wanted one... Got a truck 360 from 1985 I'll check for you too, got the factory stick in it.
 
H monster as in hay monster?
For picking bales?
 
Those dipsticks appear to be for car applications with center sump oil pans. As others stated, the truck dipstick for rear sump pan is quite a bit longer. I forgot to measure mine. I guess we know why it came two dipsticks. Previous owner tried to figure it out.
If you have a Dodge truck with a Magnum engine, try inserting that dipstick in this 318. Once you get something long enough to read, just drain the oil, pour in six quarts, and use that for your full mark.
 
krazykuda said:
Sorry, we're not allowed to answer non a-body questions.... View attachment 1715363620
Click to expand...

Sorry......would probably be a better fit in a D bodies forum, but couldn't find one of those. The "trucks" Dodge forum seems to be more about finding spare parts and less about engines. The only thing I have in common with them is the engine. The place to be for engine help would seem to be here.

Perhaps if I fudged and suggested my intent is if I can get the 318 running good, my plan is to put it into my cousins old 66 Cuda......if I can ever find it?
 
H Monster said:
Sorry......would probably be a better fit in a D bodies forum, but couldn't find one of those. The "trucks" Dodge forum seems to be more about finding spare parts and less about engines. The only thing I have in common with them is the engine. The place to be for engine help would seem to be here.

Perhaps if I fudged and suggested my intent is if I can get the 318 running good, my plan is to put it into my cousins old 66 Cuda......if I can ever find it?
Click to expand...
You're new here. You don't know Karl. He was kidding.
 
H Monster said:
Sorry......would probably be a better fit in a D bodies forum, but couldn't find one of those. The "trucks" Dodge forum seems to be more about finding spare parts and less about engines. The only thing I have in common with them is the engine. The place to be for engine help would seem to be here.

Perhaps if I fudged and suggested my intent is if I can get the 318 running good, my plan is to put it into my cousins old 66 Cuda......if I can ever find it?
Click to expand...
A few ag manufacturers used Mopar engines in their products. Slant 6's in haybines and combines, 318's in combines and sprayers and such. Heck even the old 392 Hemi's in back up generators and air raid sirens.
 
So the dip stick question leads to another problem......when you go shopping for parts (like the correct dip stick), all the kid at the parts store wants to know is the make and model of vehicle it came from so he can look up the parts. These things are not in his computer. So I've got to come up with a vehicle the engine would probably match up to. Since the date stamp on the engine says 2-15-83, best guess for now would be a 1983 Dodge D200?
 
One more thing about the dip stick, the one that came in it had a slight bend in the tip.....little ski tip. Replacement was straight. When inserting new stick in the tube, as it left the tube to enter the block, it hit something solid. Would go no further. But after bending in the little ski tip, it will now pass on down. That could mean something is out of alignment down there, but not knowing how it looks, hard to say.

BTW, this came with a handful of spare parts. New dip stick, a carb kit that didn't match the carb, 4 or 5 brass core plugs, plus a set of oil pan gaskets. So the problems I'm finding were known.

Plus this is a seasonal use item. When it was time to use, it got used heavy....15 hour days for a month or so. When something broke down, it had to be patched up and running ASAP. Once the season was over, it got parked. The last time it was parked it was for good. That kind of maintenance schedule isn't conducive to a reliable machine. I have found at least 3 bundles of baling wire hanging on this......and places where they used it!
 
I found a lot of gunk in a 273 that I was rebuilding. I took all the steel plugs out (2 were paper thin) and took a pressure washer nozzle into them and blew out the state of Rhode Island. The worst buildup were the plugs at the flywheel. They were packed solid. My drains did nothing when removed, took a screwdriver and had to displace some 50 year old sediment in there. You can do this with the pan attached but getting the rears out requires a pull. Use brass plugs or paint the backs of steel with RTV.
 
H Monster said:
Sorry......would probably be a better fit in a D bodies forum, but couldn't find one of those. The "trucks" Dodge forum seems to be more about finding spare parts and less about engines. The only thing I have in common with them is the engine. The place to be for engine help would seem to be here.

Perhaps if I fudged and suggested my intent is if I can get the 318 running good, my plan is to put it into my cousins old 66 Cuda......if I can ever find it?
Click to expand...



I was just kidding... We can help you with a 318...
 
H Monster said:
One more thing about the dip stick, the one that came in it had a slight bend in the tip.....little ski tip. Replacement was straight. When inserting new stick in the tube, as it left the tube to enter the block, it hit something solid. Would go no further. But after bending in the little ski tip, it will now pass on down. That could mean something is out of alignment down there, but not knowing how it looks, hard to say.

BTW, this came with a handful of spare parts. New dip stick, a carb kit that didn't match the carb, 4 or 5 brass core plugs, plus a set of oil pan gaskets. So the problems I'm finding were known.

Plus this is a seasonal use item. When it was time to use, it got used heavy....15 hour days for a month or so. When something broke down, it had to be patched up and running ASAP. Once the season was over, it got parked. The last time it was parked it was for good. That kind of maintenance schedule isn't conducive to a reliable machine. I have found at least 3 bundles of baling wire hanging on this......and places where they used it!
Click to expand...

The dipstick may be bottoming out on the pan when the tip isn't bent...
 
Bobzilla said:
Those dipsticks appear to be for car applications with center sump oil pans. As others stated, the truck dipstick for rear sump pan is quite a bit longer. I forgot to measure mine. I guess we know why it came two dipsticks. Previous owner tried to figure it out.
If you have a Dodge truck with a Magnum engine, try inserting that dipstick in this 318. Once you get something long enough to read, just drain the oil, pour in six quarts, and use that for your full mark.
Click to expand...


H Monster said:
So the dip stick question leads to another problem......when you go shopping for parts (like the correct dip stick), all the kid at the parts store wants to know is the make and model of vehicle it came from so he can look up the parts. These things are not in his computer. So I've got to come up with a vehicle the engine would probably match up to. Since the date stamp on the engine says 2-15-83, best guess for now would be a 1983 Dodge D200?
Click to expand...

The dipstick tube mounts in the same place for both car and truck applications... The oil pans have the same shape for the area where the stick goes into the pan at that spot, there shouldn't be a difference...

How to ID a Small Block Oil Pan 60's - 80's
 
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