Is it getting old yet?? (Will it fit…again)

[1973dartswinger]

What’s up guys and gals in the process of getting parts together for the swinger. I know the best way to determine is to measure and see but the car is in pieces and i can kind of set up things to make things fit if necessary. To start the car is a 1973 dart swinger. I am going to run a ford 8.8 with the one side cut down so the axles will be the same side. From my understanding this brings the axle to within an inch of a stock a body rear. I’m going to have leaf spring rear and I can move them in a 1/2 inch if necessary while building it with out an issue. The front suspension I’m going to be getting upgraded parts from Bergman auto sports
The wheels I am looking to get are
are 17x8. The rears are 0 offset/4.5” backspace. The fronts are +38mm offset/6” backspace and a 1/2” spacer in the front

The tires are Falken Azenis RT660 rear 245/45/17s. Fronts are 245/40/17

I don’t mind needing spacers if necessary either. The main thing is I just wanted to get some input some from knowledgeable people. I am 98% sure they will fit from my reading and searching threads but I know the dart sport had a little more room in the rear so just trying to confirm

appreciate the help
Thank you

 

[69cudaownr]

I'm no expert but your 4.5" backspace is the magic number for a stock rear and front. A 6" backspace with +38mm (1.5") offset should equal a 4.5" backspace if my memory serves me correctly. You may not even need the 1/2" spacer.
Again, no expert but you're in the right ballpark with that I believe.

 

[1973dartswinger]

I'm no expert but your 4.5" backspace is the magic number for a stock rear and front. A 6" backspace with +38mm (1.5") offset should equal a 4.5" backspace if my memory serves me correctly. You may not even need the 1/2" spacer.
Again, no expert but you're in the right ballpark with that I believe.

awesome. Like I said I’ve done a lot of reading and it seems like alot of what I see is similar offsets so I was like ehhhhhh it should work but let me triple check! Especially because these were mounted before on a dart sport and I have a swinger. Minor differences

 

[72bluNblu]

What’s up guys and gals in the process of getting parts together for the swinger. I know the best way to determine is to measure and see but the car is in pieces and i can kind of set up things to make things fit if necessary. To start the car is a 1973 dart swinger. I am going to run a ford 8.8 with the one side cut down so the axles will be the same side. From my understanding this brings the axle to within an inch of a stock a body rear. I’m going to have leaf spring rear and I can move them in a 1/2 inch if necessary while building it with out an issue. The front suspension I’m going to be getting upgraded parts from Bergman auto sports
The wheels I am looking to get are
are 17x8. The rears are 0 offset/4.5” backspace. The fronts are +38mm offset/6” backspace and a 1/2” spacer in the front

The tires are Falken Azenis RT660 rear 245/45/17s. Fronts are 245/40/17

I don’t mind needing spacers if necessary either. The main thing is I just wanted to get some input some from knowledgeable people. I am 98% sure they will fit from my reading and searching threads but I know the dart sport had a little more room in the rear so just trying to confirm

appreciate the help
Thank you

In the front with 73+ disk brakes and a 17x8 the backspace you're going to need is about 5.6". With most 17" rims the outer tie rod end interferes with the wheel at around 5.7", give or take depending on the specific rim construction and design.

A 17x8 +38mm offset has a 6" backspace, so, you will probably need an 8-10mm wide spacer to get the outer tie rod end to clear the rim. That's the biggest issue, a 245/45/17 will clear fine once the tie rod end has clearance on the rim. Also, I would run a 245/45/17 in the front, it's only about 25.6" tall which is fine for the front. A 245/40/17 is less than 25" tall, which is just silly short.

In the back, an 8.8 out of a ford explorer (disk brakes) with two short side axles is 56-5/8" from wheel mounting surface to wheel mounting surface. That's 1-3/16" shorter than an A-body 8 3/4 with BBP axles. WMS to spring with BBP axles in an A-body 8 3/4 is ~6", so, your measurement if you don't move the springs in will be ~5.4". That should mean that the 17x8 with a 4.5" backspace will fit with a 245/45/17, it will give you .9" from the outside of the rim to the spring. Rough rule of thumb will mean about a 1/2" of rubber hanging over the rim, which will leave about .4" from tire to spring. That's about as tight as you want to go, so, it will depend on the tolerances on your car specifically. A small spacer may be needed if you keep the springs in the stock location. But maybe not, and if you're going to be off by a little it's better to be closer to the springs because you can adjust that with a spacer.

I'm no expert but your 4.5" backspace is the magic number for a stock rear and front. A 6" backspace with +38mm (1.5") offset should equal a 4.5" backspace if my memory serves me correctly. You may not even need the 1/2" spacer.
Again, no expert but you're in the right ballpark with that I believe.

No sir. A 8" rim with a +38 offset has a 6" backspace, that's all the calculation. It's not equal to a 4.5" backspace, it's a 6" backspace. And he will almost definitely need a spacer in the 1/3" to 1/2" range to clear the outer tie rod end with a 17" rim. With an 18" rim no problem, tie rod fits inside the lip of the rim. With a 17", there's only one or two rim designs that actually clear the outer tie rod past 5.7" of backspace.

 

[1973dartswinger]

In the front with 73+ disk brakes and a 17x8 the backspace you're going to need is about 5.6". With most 17" rims the outer tie rod end interferes with the wheel at around 5.7", give or take depending on the specific rim construction and design.

A 17x8 +38mm offset has a 6" backspace, so, you will probably need an 8-10mm wide spacer to get the outer tie rod end to clear the rim. That's the biggest issue, a 245/45/17 will clear fine once the tie rod end has clearance on the rim. Also, I would run a 245/45/17 in the front, it's only about 25.6" tall which is fine for the front. A 245/40/17 is less than 25" tall, which is just silly short.

In the back, an 8.8 out of a ford explorer (disk brakes) with two short side axles is 56-5/8" from wheel mounting surface to wheel mounting surface. That's 1-3/16" shorter than an A-body 8 3/4 with BBP axles. WMS to spring with BBP axles in an A-body 8 3/4 is ~6", so, your measurement if you don't move the springs in will be ~5.4". That should mean that the 17x8 with a 4.5" backspace will fit with a 245/45/17, it will give you .9" from the outside of the rim to the spring. Rough rule of thumb will mean about a 1/2" of rubber hanging over the rim, which will leave about .4" from tire to spring. That's about as tight as you want to go, so, it will depend on the tolerances on your car specifically. A small spacer may be needed if you keep the springs in the stock location. But maybe not, and if you're going to be off by a little it's better to be closer to the springs because you can adjust that with a spacer.



No sir. A 8" rim with a +38 offset has a 6" backspace, that's all the calculation. It's not equal to a 4.5" backspace, it's a 6" backspace. And he will almost definitely need a spacer in the 1/3" to 1/2" range to clear the outer tie rod end with a 17" rim. With an 18" rim no problem, tie rod fits inside the lip of the rim. With a 17", there's only one or two rim designs that actually clear the outer tie rod past 5.7" of backspace.

Wow! This is exactly what I needed. Thank you so much I appreciate the information and the time you took putting it together!
Cheers!

 

[MRGTX]

Not to but-in on this conversation but I don’t think the 245/40/17s look “silly short” on the front and even lowered down quite a bit, they clear everything.

 

[72bluNblu]

Not to but-in on this conversation but I don’t think the 245/40/17s look “silly short” on the front and even lowered down quite a bit, they clear everything.

View attachment 1715985521

View attachment 1715985522

View attachment 1715985524

And if you installed 245/45/17's and changed nothing else the top of the tire would be a little tucked in, which would look a ton better. And it would still clear everything.

IMO keeping the wheels taller than 25" looks a lot better visually. Especially with larger rims, since you're cutting down on sidewall height already. A 245/40/17 only has .07" more sidewall than the 275/35/18's I run.

Now, this is my Challenger, but it has 275/40/17's in these pictures. They're 25.6" tall, so the height and sidewall would be very similar to a 245/45/17.

And my Duster. These are 18's, but you can see that the sidewall is pretty much identical to the 245/40/17's and the wheels fill out the wheel wells quite a bit better. The front's are 25.6" tall and the rears are 27.3" tall.

 

[MRGTX]

Meh. We are all entitled to our opinions. I don’t care for silver painted wheels but I will admit that there is nothing wrong with them.

I was coming off of tires that rubbed slightly after maxing out the camber in my alignment and it bugged the heck out of me. I wanted to be sure they fit correctly. The lower/front part of the Dart front wheel arches seem to be especially prone to rubbing when turning.

 

[Tripped]

And if you installed 245/45/17's and changed nothing else the top of the tire would be a little tucked in, which would look a ton better. And it would still clear everything.

IMO keeping the wheels taller than 25" looks a lot better visually. Especially with larger rims, since you're cutting down on sidewall height already. A 245/40/17 only has .07" more sidewall than the 275/35/18's I run.

Now, this is my Challenger, but it has 275/40/17's in these pictures. They're 25.6" tall, so the height and sidewall would be very similar to a 245/45/17.
View attachment 1715985538
View attachment 1715985539

And my Duster. These are 18's, but you can see that the sidewall is pretty much identical to the 245/40/17's and the wheels fill out the wheel wells quite a bit better. The front's are 25.6" tall and the rears are 27.3" tall.
View attachment 1715985535

View attachment 1715985534

Hello,

I am brand new to the mopar world. From the research I have done I have found that you sir are the guru when it comes to wheels. I am trying to figure out the correct option for 17" wheels for my car. The car is a 70 Dart 340 swinger. I have replaced the front spindles to the later 73 & up style. Wilwood 12.19 rotor disc up front and 11" disc brakes in the rear. With these changes I now have the 5x4.5 bolt pattern. I am looking at wheel from US Wheel, they are 17" Chrysler OE style steel wheel. The options they have available are as follows,

Part Number	Size	BP 1	BP 2	BP 3	Offset	Backspacing	Bore	Load	Weight	Finish	Accessories
658-8712	17x7	5x4.5			16	4.625	73.15	1700	38	POWDER COAT	C52A
660-8712	17x7	5x4.5			16	4.625	73.15	1700	38	RAW	C52A
658-8812	17x8	5x4.5			13	5	73.15	1700	39	POWDER COAT	C52A
658-8912	17x9	5x4.5			25	6	73.15	1700	40	POWDER COAT	C52A

Can you help me determine if any of these wheels will fit on my vehicle? I hope this isn't to forward of me to ask but I have been struggling to find an answer.