Is my engine dead?

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Hi all,
I'm a new user to this forum. It's full of great information.

I just picked up an 83 ramcharger dirt cheap from a guy that drove it down from Alaska. Prospector series with 318 engine. I got it cheap because it doesn't run.

I have 2 questions-
1- although I think I know the answer to this one- but it won't start at all. It basically just spits gas up through the carb (thermo quad) and sputters occassionally. After reading posts, it seems that the timing gears or chain may have jumped. I did pull off the distributor cover and check tdc and it was pointing right at cyl 1, but when checking with a timing light while cranking the mark isn't anywhere near the tab on the engine. matter of fact it's not even visible.

2. If the timing did jump, is this a zero clearance engine and will it damage pistons/valves? I fear the worst after a friend mentioned that this is something that 318's are notorious for.

admittedly, I've only worked on chevy and pontiac before. I currently have a 90 ramcharger that's heading to the boneyard because of bad rot, and I needed another plow truck for the long buffalo winters.

any help is appreciated. Thanks again!

John
 
Thor, it sounds like the timing chain/gear is worn out. Pull off the water pump and timing cover and take a look at it. Does it have heavy mileage? You said the guy drove it from Alaska, so when did it stop running or did it just not start one day? If chain jumped at high rpm you it may have encountered some valves hitting pistons, but maybe not. Are you sure ignition, fuel, etc is in order? If so pull cover and check it out. Mike
 
Has someone else tried to get it running before you? If the timing chain jumped, the distributor would be in the wrong spot being it is attached to the cam. Check the wire placement on the cap, I have seen people put the wires the wrong way around before. The order will be clockwise on the cap. I have seen some caps that have an arrow pointing counterclock wise which is wrong for an LA Mopar. Also check to see if the distributor is not 180 deg out.

Chuck
 
I Agree With Chuck. Pull The Plug Out Of Number 1 Hold Your Finger Against The Spark Plug Hole And Bump It Over With The Starter Till It Sucks. Stop. Trace The Sp Wire For #1 Back To The Cap And See Where The Rotor Button Is.....
 
WONTGETDUSTED said:
I Agree With Chuck. Pull The Plug Out Of Number 1 Hold Your Finger Against The Spark Plug Hole And Bump It Over With The Starter Till It Sucks. Stop. Trace The Sp Wire For #1 Back To The Cap And See Where The Rotor Button Is.....
Click to expand...

Close. You feel for the compression pushing out, not sucking in...

What I do is get the thing on compression storke (the air pushing out,) then look for the TDC mark. Turn the engine clockwise with a socket until the mark is lined up with "0". Regardless of the rotor direction, this is TDC on compresion on the crank. Then, look a tthe rotor direction. It should be pointing either at #1 cylinder, or slightly forward of that. Then, turn the engine counter clockwise very slowly, and look a tthe rotor while you try to turn the crank. The instant the rotor begins to turn at all, stop, and see how far back the mark on the balancer is from the "0" mark. If it's more than about 5°, the timing chain is stretched, but ok. If it's more than 6°, replace the chain. It definately sounds like a slipped chain.
 
thanks for the replies so far!

I feel silly asking these questions as I've been building engines since I was 16.

I got it running last night- however I had to turn the distributor so far counterclockwise that the vac advance housing touches the manifold.
And the timing mark is showing waaay down on the balancer with a timing light still.
It sounds like a diesel engine running, but maybe mechanical interference? When I put a screwdriver up to the valve cover it's silent but the engine itself is super loud...?

me thinks the timing chain jumped, but I just need to verify before pulling it apart. I didn't want to put a ton of work into this engine as it's basically going to be a plow truck with trailer pulling duties occasionally.
 
Did you check the firing order? Maybe someone else messed with it and everything is way off.
 
AdamR said:
Did you check the firing order? Maybe someone else messed with it and everything is way off.
Click to expand...

yes, and when I first got it it had 2&4 reversed, but that was when I first started working on it.

I've checked it twice since then. it's fine
 
I had very simular problems with my Dart 318 and it was indeed the timing chain. The factory timing gears were aluminum with a hard plastic coating on the gear tips and over time the plastic breaks up and causes the chain to slip.
I pulled the heads to check for valve/piston damage and there were some very small indentations in the top of a couple of pistons but pulling all the valves and checking them showed nothing bent.
If you have the same issue with the timing gears and the plastic coating is breaking up them pull the oil pan to make sure you get all the bits of plastic out.

Hope this helps.
 
that makes sense. I didn't think it would be that dramatic though.
maybe what i'm hearing is the chain slapping the sides of the cover?...

I wonder if the oil pan comes off easily.. I remember having a B150 conversion van and the engine was so gunked up with crap that the oil pressure would drop. I could get the pan off without too much hassle while the engine was still in the van. I ended up buying a long block after pulling the pan and seeing all the crud up in the engine.
 
Thor,

I can pull the oil pan out of my '74 Ramcharger without even jacking the engine up, but it takes a little "manipulation" if you know what I mean. On the other hand, You should be able to pull the timing cover after removing the front 4 bolts, allowing the pan to drop just a hair. You could then use carb cleaner to flush out your pan, and button it up with a timing cover gasket set that comes with the two short cork pan gasket ends. The downside to this is you won't be able to get the pickup tube and screen.

In all honesty, if you want a good RELIABLE plow truck, I would recommend yanking that sucker out and checking everything, especially since it has enough miles to skip teeth. There's got to be a buttload of debris cruising around inside that engine. Clean everything out and check the crank, rod and crank bearings, bore taper and add a set a KB 107 flat tops and bore if necessary. Check out the valve guides and valve seats and do a basic valve job. Add a cam with 205 to 210 degrees duration at .050 lift with a good (name brand like Cloyes) double roller timing chain and you'll be good for another 100,000 miles for really not that much money. Oh yeah, replace your oil pump with a stock volume unit and clean your pickup. It'll be a stout unit and you should be able to pull 300 horses at sea level at the crank pretty easy with awesome low end torque.
 
Thanks Ramcharger! good advice there.

I looked to see what the cost of parts are for the 318 and it's so cheap it's not worth not doing. I've rebuilt many a small block chevy and it's nice to see parts cheap.
Being from alaska, this truck has all the essentials- block heater, tranny heater, battery heater, and one more I haven't traced out yet. This things ready for buffalo's battle with snow. Just needs a tight powerplant to make it go.

one more question though. Is the thermoquad worth using? It's been rebuilt already and ran great before i'm told. I'll probably end up ditching the cast manifold and go with something aluminum like edelbrock, and a holley carb with manual choke.

thanks again!
 
Thermoquads are good carbs, Pretty much the same as a Q-Jet. Some love them some hate them. If you have any Thermoquad questions get a hold of our member DemonSizzler. he builds them and is doing one for me right now. His web site is www.thermoquads.com.

There are a few aluminum spreadbore intakes out. Wiand Action Plus and the Edelbrock Performer will take either spread or square bore. I think for a torquey plow truck the Performer/thermoquad would be a good combo.
 
Whoops! Thought you had a 360. KB167 is the part number you would want for some flat tops. Adam makes sense regarding the carb/manifold choice as the TQ has small primaries, although I'm a holley guy and I don't have much experience with the TQ's.

If you wanted to save some dough, the stock 4 bbl mopar manifoldis not all that bad of a piece although the performer (not the performer rpm) should give the low end a boost due to the smaller runners.

On the subject of low end torque, if your heads are in bad shape, you might want to see if you could find some 5.2 magnum heads and do the conversion. They are closed (small) chamber and a nice big quench pad. They'll boost your compression and add detonation resistance too as long as you set your quench to .040 with flat tops, a zero deck height, and .040 thick gasket. You can also use chevy style adjustable roller rockers (be sure to get the 1.6 ratio arms, as that is what the magnums used stock, and if you don't, you may have pushrod/head interference issues). The only problem with this swap is that your intake manifold choices would be limited.
 
It is extremely difficult getting the oil pan off. My friend had a cherry picker (engine hoist). I loosened the bolts and lifted the engine up. That made it possible to take off the pan and clean out all the vinyl or plastic pieces left inside from the sprocket. I had to remove the transmission braces and move the starter out of the way to do the job. I cleaned out the pan and applied the new gasket to the pan and got it back into place. I then placed the front and rear seal on the pan. I tried to put the pan back on with that rear seal, but destroyed the seal in the process. I had another one and decided to only put on one side of the seal and then the other side when it was around the oil pump. It was a tight fit.

Good luck with that.

Swanny
 
73spaceduster said:
It is extremely difficult getting the oil pan off. My friend had a cherry picker (engine hoist). I loosened the bolts and lifted the engine up. That made it possible to take off the pan and clean out all the vinyl or plastic pieces left inside from the sprocket. I had to remove the transmission braces and move the starter out of the way to do the job. I cleaned out the pan and applied the new gasket to the pan and got it back into place. I then placed the front and rear seal on the pan. I tried to put the pan back on with that rear seal, but destroyed the seal in the process. I had another one and decided to only put on one side of the seal and then the other side when it was around the oil pump. It was a tight fit.

Good luck with that.

Swanny
Click to expand...

Was that on a Ramcharger or a Duster? Dodge small block trucks have a rear sump pan which is much easier to remove if neccesary.
 
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