Maybe I've learned a good lesson . . .

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Vanguard15

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I've been reading 318 threads; most recently the one about XE cams.

14 years ago I bought a 68 Charger that still had the original 2 barrel, 318 w/904. My initial intent was to put it back on the road and sell it. This was before I knew anything about forums, nor could I really interpret what I was reading in magazines or all the helpful advice of my neighbors to "wake up the 318." Bottom line I "assembled" and engine for the first time which was a lot of fun. It now has a nice passing gear but only 225 pounds of torque to the rear wheels. Below is how things unfolded and a bit of speculation as to why those torque numbers are low. I have learned what happens if you don't have a clear end state or know how to match part specs. There is more I need to learn.

My basic rebuild went like this:
318 bored .30 over
kept the stock open chamber heads with a valve job, pocket port and exhaust runners cleaned up a bit.
Edelbrock dual plane intake with an Eddy 600 carb on top
360 power cam from Delta Cam in Tacoma - The specs I wrote down on a piece of paper are 450 lift; 268 duration; 214 @ 50; 112 lobe separation
KB 167 pistons - once the block was machined they didn't look like they were in the hole at all.
I put on factory spec head gaskets
I cleaned up the interior to make it comfortable.
Rewired the dash after it almost sent the car up in a blaze of glory.

At some point a couple years in I developed a romantic relationship with the car and decided to keep it . . .

BFGs with 15 x 275s on the rear, 255s on the front
A 3.55 gear with sure grip/posi - This was done as an effort to remedy what I thought was the limitation of my heads. It helped some but mostly killed by mpg.
Dual exhaust with headman headers and 2.5 exhaust . . . which didn't help the seat-of-the-pants dyno.
904, with a racemaster rebuild kit and a transgo shift kit, three clutch pack upgraded to 5 (red) and bigger sun gear which resulted in a little more fun and lower mpg.
*****stock stall converter put in, specs are unknown, but in the neighborhood of 2000 - at the time I had no idea about matching the stall to cam. I still don't have good practical experience, but I suspect this is a weak link in my build.
Better cooling radiator was installed.
Then a ton of body work and more wiring and interior work.
I have not upgraded the brakes yet but this, and the power steering box, are next.

I've put 28,000 miles on the car with all kinds of highway driving and have really enjoyed it, the learning process etc. . . I parked it two years ago for a D100 project. Now I'm ready to tear into it again after saving a little money for up-grades. It's no show car, but will no longer be a daily driver. I want performance up grades that are for fun - fun for driving and fun for learning a bit more about building. I have some interest in keeping the small block in there if it can be a more enjoyable and torquey cruiser. I have a line on a nice set of closed chamber 302 heads for cheap that may be a positive addition IF it would be beneficial and IF it is matched to a better torque convertor that works with my current cam shaft. Am I correct? Or will I need a different cam as well?
 
It's a slippery slope, all I can say is proceed with caution. I had the same idea 20 years ago, huge cam, stall convertor, gears, etc. It was fun in short spurts but was miserable to cruise. I've fell in love with the carbed 5.9 magnums, regrind cam and a set of springs makes for a fun street strip car.
 
I think defining a set of goals for the car will be the best thing for you to do. Define the goals, and build to suit. If you want 450lb/ft for example, starting with a 318 probably isn’t the best idea. If 20 mpg is the goal, your transmission choices and rear gear will change. So what do you want to end up with?

Edited to add; can we see a pic of the charger and the D100?
 
I have a 318 in my Duster. All of my B bodies have been big blocks. Myself, I wouldn't even consider building up a 318 for a 68 charger . If you are keeping the 318 , a quality (NOT an off the shelf TCI, B@M, etc.) 3000 stall converter would give it a pretty good boost.
 
Sure it ain't 225 hp at the wheels?
 
I think you could teach some a lesson. :) Your original build is about spot on imo. First off, that car with a small block is not near as heavy as it looks and makes a good handling ''road'' car. One of my early encounters with Mopars was with a college student neighbors 69' 318 Charger in the early 70's when i was about 13yo. All original with a alum intake, 600 carb and duals. He used to take me on some early Sun morning blasts thru the country roads near us and to this day, that some of the most fun i ever had. Might have been a 15/16sec car but i'd still love to have that same experience today.

That said, if you're looking for more of a straight line car, i'm not sure just a converter will satisfy you. Maybe time to look into larger cubes, and of course, larger dollars.
 
68 Charger! Where are the pictures?
My first car in late 1971 was a 68 Charger R/T.
 
Here is the 68. My first car was a 69 and I did a 318 to a mid 70’s 440 swap. I told myself I wasn’t going to do that again, but about 6 years ago I pulled a 68 440 w/727 out of a C Body. I have since cleaned up the block and turned the crank. It was frozen, rough and rusty and hardly any of the parts are usable, but maybe I’m warming up to the idea again. With respect to my question above, maybe a torque converter with a 2600-2800 stall may be all she needs in the short run?

IMG_0499.jpeg
 
I think you could teach some a lesson. :) Your original build is about spot on imo. First off, that car with a small block is not near as heavy as it looks and makes a good handling ''road'' car. One of my early encounters with Mopars was with a college student neighbors 69' 318 Charger in the early 70's when i was about 13yo. All original with a alum intake, 600 carb and duals. He used to take me on some early Sun morning blasts thru the country roads near us and to this day, that some of the most fun i ever had. Might have been a 15/16sec car but i'd still love to have that same experience today.

That said, if you're looking for more of a straight line car, i'm not sure just a converter will satisfy you. Maybe time to look into larger cubes, and of course, larger dollars.
This is what I’ve been thinking, and probably the 302 heads would be unnecessary even if it did increase compression.
 
I'd think there is some potential in the torque converter. Call a place you can talk with about the weight of the car, gearing, the engine and cam. Even Turbo Action (which I think of as off the shelf) will ask you about that. Or at least they used to.

My opinion, and its just that. Exhaust tubing is a little big and could be hurting low end. 2.5" Muffler size is fine.
Do some performance tuning. Measure the timing curve. Then make some small change and test out.
Same with the carb. Document what its got. make a change and test that change. For example, if changing the MJ, that's a full power change to be tested at the strip. If its a rod/mj, that's high speed cruise change to be tested on the interstate. The part throttle acceleration is hard to test but will work out when the steady state stuff is tuned.
 
I've been reading 318 threads; most recently the one about XE cams.

14 years ago I bought a 68 Charger that still had the original 2 barrel, 318 w/904. My initial intent was to put it back on the road and sell it. This was before I knew anything about forums, nor could I really interpret what I was reading in magazines or all the helpful advice of my neighbors to "wake up the 318." Bottom line I "assembled" and engine for the first time which was a lot of fun. It now has a nice passing gear but only 225 pounds of torque to the rear wheels. Below is how things unfolded and a bit of speculation as to why those torque numbers are low. I have learned what happens if you don't have a clear end state or know how to match part specs. There is more I need to learn.

My basic rebuild went like this:
318 bored .30 over
kept the stock open chamber heads with a valve job, pocket port and exhaust runners cleaned up a bit.
Edelbrock dual plane intake with an Eddy 600 carb on top
360 power cam from Delta Cam in Tacoma - The specs I wrote down on a piece of paper are 450 lift; 268 duration; 214 @ 50; 112 lobe separation
KB 167 pistons - once the block was machined they didn't look like they were in the hole at all.
I put on factory spec head gaskets
I cleaned up the interior to make it comfortable.
Rewired the dash after it almost sent the car up in a blaze of glory.

At some point a couple years in I developed a romantic relationship with the car and decided to keep it . . .

BFGs with 15 x 275s on the rear, 255s on the front
A 3.55 gear with sure grip/posi - This was done as an effort to remedy what I thought was the limitation of my heads. It helped some but mostly killed by mpg.
Dual exhaust with headman headers and 2.5 exhaust . . . which didn't help the seat-of-the-pants dyno.
904, with a racemaster rebuild kit and a transgo shift kit, three clutch pack upgraded to 5 (red) and bigger sun gear which resulted in a little more fun and lower mpg.
*****stock stall converter put in, specs are unknown, but in the neighborhood of 2000 - at the time I had no idea about matching the stall to cam. I still don't have good practical experience, but I suspect this is a weak link in my build.
Better cooling radiator was installed.
Then a ton of body work and more wiring and interior work.
I have not upgraded the brakes yet but this, and the power steering box, are next.

I've put 28,000 miles on the car with all kinds of highway driving and have really enjoyed it, the learning process etc. . . I parked it two years ago for a D100 project. Now I'm ready to tear into it again after saving a little money for up-grades. It's no show car, but will no longer be a daily driver. I want performance up grades that are for fun - fun for driving and fun for learning a bit more about building. I have some interest in keeping the small block in there if it can be a more enjoyable and torquey cruiser. I have a line on a nice set of closed chamber 302 heads for cheap that may be a positive addition IF it would be beneficial and IF it is matched to a better torque convertor that works with my current cam shaft. Am I correct? Or will I need a different cam as well?
I would t touch an iron head for a 318. I’d use an Edelbrock head straight away. You’ll be way ahead dollar wise and head flow wise.
 
Nope, the hp was 192. I was kind of surprised.
I just looked at a Richard Holdener video and his Dodge stock 2bbl 360 van dyno'd to the wheels 155 hp and same engine out of van but fully dressed with the breather accessories and van exhaust dyno'd 225 hp flywheel. Once he did about 350 hp flywheel of upgrades it dyno'd 252 hp to the wheels, he didn't say anything about torque, but yours actually sounds about right compared to his.

 
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I don’t think a 2800-3000 stall converter is the right move here. It’s a big car, with a small engine, and it’s not meant to be a drag strip terror. Remember, everything you do to increase performance will take away something somewhere else. Drive it the way it is and enjoy it, if you want more “go” out of it, I think the recipe should be for more cubic inches to keep the drivability the same.
 
I have some interest in keeping the small block in there if it can be a more enjoyable and torquey cruiser.
This ^^^^ screams 5.9 magnum with a 218-224 @050 ish hyd roller cam, an rpm intake, an 750 carb of your choice (whatever you’re most comfortable tuning) and your 2800 converter, in my eyes. That will be a dead reliable torquey cruiser and should sneeze 350lb/ft to the tire. And probably get better mileage then the 318.
 
This is the TWO problems I see:
[1] You have a heavy car with a small-ish engine.
[2] Take the 318, rated at 230 hp. And you mess around with cams, heads & get a 10% increase in hp. That is 23 hp. If you started with a 440 & did the same, you get 37 hp more.

If you had a light car like a Dart, then moving on the 318 would give you oomph you could feel.

Many parts/devices that increase HP are just power shifters: they take power from the low end & move it to the top end. With a heavy car, this can turn it into slug status.

I would put money into a larger engine. Even a bone stock 440 would be more satisfying that a hotted up 318.
 
Here is the 68. My first car was a 69 and I did a 318 to a mid 70’s 440 swap. I told myself I wasn’t going to do that again, but about 6 years ago I pulled a 68 440 w/727 out of a C Body. I have since cleaned up the block and turned the crank. It was frozen, rough and rusty and hardly any of the parts are usable, but maybe I’m warming up to the idea again. With respect to my question above, maybe a torque converter with a 2600-2800 stall may be all she needs in the short run?

View attachment 1716215085
Yes it is a beautiful car! I like that it has a painted roof. My 68 was gold with white vinyl top. About 4 years later, I had a green 70 R/T without vinyl top.
 
450 lift; 268 duration; 214 @ 50; 112 lobe separation
Delta Cams is up for sale according to their website.
I would contact them as soon as possible and get as much info as you can about the cam. Lobe centerline, recommneded install, lobe design etc.
Looking at Comp's 2011 catalog there's nothing that really matches but the closest ones suggest that a converter may not be needed. Again see what Delta says. Generally cam manufactures have a sense of when non-stock converter is really needed.

Higher stall converters allow an engine to respond decently even with a less well tuned low and mid range. Its possible that with tuning a snappier response can be had from the existing setup. This takes more effort than the top end tuning but same approach, document the baseline and keep track of the changes and what they did.
 
After building many of Mpars , one day a friend of a friend told me of a 318 AT 68 Charger for sale (back in NE Mo,) The owner had done all the body/paint in his garage, but admitted it had a "fair" amount of filler. It looked great! He did the interior with some Legendary, freshen the stock motor, It ran and drove great>$2500 this was 2001 or 2. Yep I bought the rascal!!!! I loved cruising in it, drove it 40 mi to work/ I admit IF I had kept it, any running big block would have found its home there. Some things just scream for a BB/
So why are second gen Chargers today so stupid money!!??? RoadKill!!!!!
But I also learned that sometime a guy an find a GOOD car done good enough that makes building projects seam like a futile endeavor!!!! But I still love the hunt and the build!
:BangHead:
 
I like TT5.9 (Mikes) answer.
But me? I'd put a cast 4"stroker kit in the 318, get 390-395 inches, throw on some speedmaster heads, preferably bought from a black friday sale, use the intake you have, with maybe some brand of 750, use the exhaust you have. If you REALLY want to get into it...... an overdrive with a gear change. Should get you an easy to live with 400hp, 400 torque.
I would not do a 440 swap, too many things would need to be acquired and /or changed.
If you WANT a 440 powered car, to go fast in a straight line...... I'd find a slant six Duster and swap a 440 into that.
My opinion only (from a guy with a 440 swapped /6 car)
 
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