My first e85 experience.
- Thread starter flyfish
- Start date
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For me its a few reasons:
1. I have e85 at a gas station about a mile away from my house. You use about 30% more fuel than with gas, but even with that you are still less than half the cost of race fuel...and about on par with premium pump gas, but with more power.
2. You get the cooling effects of running on alcohol without the corrosive issues of methanol. Methanol you have to use some type of top end lube, e85 you don't.
3. Since I can get e85 at quite a few pumps around town, I can still drive my "street car" all over town without worrying about running out of fuel
.One draw back compared to gas is you can't let the fuel sit too long in an unsealed container (like your gas tank) because the ethanol absorbs water quickly....so if you only drive your car like once a month, you should find a way to seal up your fuel cell. "They" say that you should not let the car sit for more than 3 weeks at a time with e85.....so, I guess that means I have to drive my car a few times a month.....darn.....
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One draw back compared to gas is you can't let the fuel sit too long in an unsealed container (like your gas tank) because the ethanol absorbs water quickly....so if you only drive your car like once a month, you should find a way to seal up your fuel cell. "They" say that you should not let the car sit for more than 3 weeks at a time with e85.....so, I guess that means I have to drive my car a few times a month.....darn.....
One thing I had planned on doing when running E85 was putting a simple ball valve on the end of the vent hose to shut it off when the car sat. Whether or not it was going to keep the water out, I'm not sure. But it was an idea to help keep the water content down in the tank.
dusterdragracer
Drag Racer
Yes, the ball valve works well on the vent tube. It also keeps it from evaporating as quick out of the cell. But even with E85, you will still have the moister issue's even in the bowls, just not as bad as alky. My friend ran E85 all last year in a SB Chev with 15:1 comp. he rebuilt the engine this winter, not any issue's from the use.
I run a belt drive pump, so a shut off was required by NHRA, this too helps keep the system from the pump to the cell closed.
Another trick you can do with E85, is install a lean out valve , this will help you build heat quicker in the motor.
You will want to get a test kit, to test the octane with E85. It can and will vary.
Don't forget to open the ball valve, easy to miss. I have a list before starting:
Shut off valve on
Vent tube valve open
Air bottle on
If my car wasn't set up for alky, I would run E85.With the price of race fuel, it is a smart move. It is just now catching on.
SRT_DSTRHOLC
Well-Known Member
They sell stabilizer that you can pour in the E85 gas to prevent all that from happening.
Anyone given thought to just buying a drum of e85 and not worrying about all the testing and such,I believe its still way cheaper than race gas and the quality is there,This is the route i think we are going to take when we convert.--Steve
SRT_DSTRHOLC
Well-Known Member
Some people can't store it. Plus they sell an electric tester you can install and it will show a LED read out of what the level is.
I read a little on a few of the different "e85 stabilizers", all of which talk about stabilizing the gasoline in the EtOH, preventing corrosion, but nothing about keeping the EtOH from absorbing water. I'm not sure how you would prevent the EtOH from being hygroscopic....Curious....Well, I guess you could theoretically add another solvent that was not miscible with EtOH, less dense, thereby creating a byphasic solution in your gas tank that essentially makes a protective layer to chemically shield the EtOH from the outside air (which is carrying water vapor)....of course that would be problematic to get back out of the tank....Sorry, my inner nerd is showing, I'll shut up... LOL.
dusterdragracer
Drag Racer
Great idea....And Flyfish, your not a nerd, your on the cutting edge!
Most guys I know get a couple gallons of race fuel, pump out the e85, then start/run the car on race fuel for longer term storage. When you are ready to race again, pump out the race fuel and fill it with e85.
funny you should mention it by the drum. I have gotten e85 in a 5 gallon race jug from the same store 2 times this week. first jug tested as e-78. then the 2nd one tested as e84.
I just took a job with a fuel delivery company working in the shop. I had a guy in the office call our distributor and get a quote on a 55 gallon drum of e98. the rep was on vacation and not at the office, but told our office guy that he could most likely do it for around $1 to $1.50 per gallon with a minimum 100 gallon purchase!!!!
so looks like I will be buying 2 drums of e98 and mixing in the 87 octane gas myself to get it to e85. now I get consistent fuel AND will only pay around $1.75 to $2.00 per gallon after mixing!!!
if I don't use all the fuel in a season.......then I'll just put it in my Flex Fuel Ram truck. win,win,win!!!!!!
Thanks Guy's-I know buying in bulk is the way to go but it sucks you had two sealed containers and they were that far apart !!!!!!!!! you WOULD think that there would be MORE quality control in small batches like that-Oh well lesson learned when we go E85 BUY a test kit no matter what--GREAT THREAD FLYFISH--this is on it's way to being a sticky i would think, HAPPY EASTER GUY'S AND REMEMBER WHAT HE DID ON THE CROSS FOR ALL !!!!!!!!!!!!! Steve
It is not really a quality control issue, it is the difference in winter/summer blend. Winter is 75% EtOH, summer is 85% EtOH....and Happy Easter to you as well.
dusterdragracer
Drag Racer
I do that with the alky, then drain the fuel cell and lines...Super easy.
Although it barley runs on gas...but it's only for a few min.
1980volare
Well-Known Member
Wrong. On a return style system, the pump is working much harder, not only is it pumping to the regulator, it's pumping from the regulator back to the tank. On a returnless style, it reduces the pump load greatly.
Is it easier on the motor to push against 15 psi or 7-8?
The pump may move more fluid with a return system, it's easier on the motor.
The pump may move more fluid with a return system, it's easier on the motor.
dusterdragracer
Drag Racer
I run a BLP internal regulator belt drive pump. I have talked to them twice, because of the prime/drive system I just put on. I wanted to make sure I can run a dead head shut off valve (which I got from them. It is also required by NHRA on all belt drive fuel pumps.I got the O.K. you can even pull the shut off at the finish line, so that I can switch to gas to drive back.
They said that all it is doing inside the pump is looping the fuel, no harm done.In their instruction though, it says return fuel line,external regulated fuel pumps are better, but most people run internal by-pass pumps, because they are more simple to hook up.
There may be some confusion,the ball valve we were talking about, is on the fuel cell vent line. A valve to close the system, stopping moister and evaporation, between races.It's a great idea for E85 too.
They said that all it is doing inside the pump is looping the fuel, no harm done.In their instruction though, it says return fuel line,external regulated fuel pumps are better, but most people run internal by-pass pumps, because they are more simple to hook up.
There may be some confusion,the ball valve we were talking about, is on the fuel cell vent line. A valve to close the system, stopping moister and evaporation, between races.It's a great idea for E85 too.
mopwr2004a
low slung chassis
the E85carbs kit you bought, is it something he builds or is it just a quickfuel kit
I got the DIY kit, but he builds carbs too. The kit has what appears to be a modified Proform billet metering block (not sure on the manufacture of the block, but it looks like a Proform), 4 jets, 1 high-flow PV, 1 PV plug, 2 squirters, 2 high-flow needles & seats (130's if I recall correctly), and 2 30cc GFLT pump diaphragms. Everything you need on the carb side.
mopwr2004a
low slung chassis
ok cool. are you happy with the results? im looking at getting the quick fuel kit because I can get a good price on it from my warehouse supplier.
Yes, I'm happy, see the first post on page one :-D.
I just though I would send a little update to save others the headache. If you run e85 you really do need to test each tank, or have a wide-band hooked up so you can see when your air fuel changes drastically.
Earlier this summer when I checked my fuel from my local gas station they had switched from the winter blend 77% EtOH, to the summer blend which when I tested it was 84% EtOH. The next few tanks I just assumed it would probably stay that way for the rest of the summer (WRONG ANSWER). I've been chasing down a good tune for the summer blend ever since, not being able to quite get it. I just checked my last tank and it was 92% EtOH...my air-fuel meter was telling me it was a little lean, but I was having a hard time believing it since I was already jetting 90/100 with a PV. Well, I dropped my HSAB down from 0.036 to 0.028 and set the jets 4 steps down to compensate (86/96), ran it, AFR was about the same so I fattened it back up to 90/100. Now the AFR is reading closer to where it should be AND the car picked back up 5 hundredths (6.84 @ 99.5 at 2900' DA). I'm still a little on the lean side, so I will probably fatten it up 1-2 more steps.
So anyway, to make a long story short, check every tank or drum if you go that route.
Earlier this summer when I checked my fuel from my local gas station they had switched from the winter blend 77% EtOH, to the summer blend which when I tested it was 84% EtOH. The next few tanks I just assumed it would probably stay that way for the rest of the summer (WRONG ANSWER). I've been chasing down a good tune for the summer blend ever since, not being able to quite get it. I just checked my last tank and it was 92% EtOH...my air-fuel meter was telling me it was a little lean, but I was having a hard time believing it since I was already jetting 90/100 with a PV. Well, I dropped my HSAB down from 0.036 to 0.028 and set the jets 4 steps down to compensate (86/96), ran it, AFR was about the same so I fattened it back up to 90/100. Now the AFR is reading closer to where it should be AND the car picked back up 5 hundredths (6.84 @ 99.5 at 2900' DA). I'm still a little on the lean side, so I will probably fatten it up 1-2 more steps.
So anyway, to make a long story short, check every tank or drum if you go that route.
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