Need to know what kind of hubs I can use?

[19Dart74]

Hello all,

I am working on my 74 dodge dart and unfortunately my front hubs and drum covers did not survive due to rust. I having a hard time finding what would be good to replace these. The wheels are 14 inch and it is a 5 stud pattern. Does anyone have any suggestions?

 

[RustyRatRod]

Hello all,

I am working on my 74 dodge dart and unfortunately my front hubs and drum covers did not survive due to rust. I having a hard time finding what would be good to replace these. The wheels are 14 inch and it is a 5 stud pattern. Does anyone have any suggestions?

Need to know the wheel bolt pattern. There's small (5x4) and large (5x4.5). It could be either. Hubs and drums are different for each.

 

[19Dart74]

I don't know if this helps but this is a photo of the hub. It also says H91042 and 176/4 on the back of the hub. The back side of the drum housing says Max Dia 10.090 inches.

 

[RustyRatRod]

I don't know if this helps but this is a photo of the hub. It also says H91042 and 176/4 on the back of the hub. The back side of the drum housing says Max Dia 10.090 inches.

View attachment 1716145713

That LOOKS like the large bolt pattern. Can you measure the diameter of the shoes outside pad to outside pad? 10" = large bolt pattern 9" = small bolt pattern.

 

[72bluNblu]

If they’re factory drums it’s 5x4”. The disk/drum cars went 5x4.5” in ‘73 but the drum/drum cars stayed 5x4” all the way til the end of front drums.

What the heck happened to those hubs?! You know the drums are swaged onto the hubs right? As in, to get the drums off you need to remove the outer wheel bearings…

 

[motorpirate]

So, as info, those drums don't slide off the hubs like the rears do.
They are clenched on by the studs and require a cutter to remove.
To get them off for service you just take the nut off the spindle and slide it off.

 

[RustyRatRod]

If they’re factory drums it’s 5x4”. The disk/drum cars went 5x4.5” in ‘73 but the drum/drum cars stayed 5x4” all the way til the end of front drums.

What the heck happened to those hubs?! You know the drums are swaged onto the hubs right? As in, to get the drums off you need to remove the outer wheel bearings…

ehhh.....there were large bolt pattern 4 wheel drum cars, were there not?

 

[19Dart74]

If they’re factory drums it’s 5x4”. The disk/drum cars went 5x4.5” in ‘73 but the drum/drum cars stayed 5x4” all the way til the end of front drums.

What the heck happened to those hubs?! You know the drums are swaged onto the hubs right? As in, to get the drums off you need to remove the outer wheel bearings.

ehhh.....there were large bolt pattern 4 wheel drum cars, were there not?

I unfortunately did not know that the housing and hub where a unit. I had thought that the rust was the problem and used a harmonic puller to get the drum housing off. Never done this before and learning the hard way you could say.... As for measurments, it is 10 inches from outside of one shoe to the other outside of the other shoe.

 

[RustyRatRod]

I unfortunately did not know that the housing and hub where a unit. I had thought that the rust was the problem and used a harmonic puller to get the drum housing off. Never done this before and learning the hard way you could say.... As for measurments, it is 10 inches from outside of one shoe to the other outside of the other shoe.

That's what I thought. You have 10" drums and the large bolt pattern all around. Yup, unfortunately, you destroyed the drums and hubs. Lesson learned. I'm sure some of the guys here will have the parts you need. I would go to the classified section, look at Mopar parts wanted and post an ad there for everything you need. Don't feel too bad. You're not the first person whose done this. I do recommend one thing though. Go to mymopar.com and download a free service manual. That will help you a lot.

 

[72bluNblu]

ehhh.....there were large bolt pattern 4 wheel drum cars, were there not?

Not A bodies.

They did go to the large upper ball joints, but they kept the SBP.

‘73+ A-bodies were BBP if they were disk/drum, and SBP if they were drum/drum. All the V8’s 73+ were disk/drum and therefore BBP.

I unfortunately did not know that the housing and hub where a unit. I had thought that the rust was the problem and used a harmonic puller to get the drum housing off. Never done this before and learning the hard way you could say.... As for measurments, it is 10 inches from outside of one shoe to the other outside of the other shoe.

Yup, that’s not how those come apart.

The 10” measurement doesn’t actually tell us much, the 10” A-body front drums were small bolt pattern (SBP). There are two different shoe widths, your ‘74 should have the wider front shoes that went with the redesigned drums with the large ball joint spindle.

 

[RustyRatRod]

Not A bodies.

They did go to the large upper ball joints, but they kept the SBP.

‘73+ A-bodies were BBP if they were disk/drum, and SBP if they were drum/drum. All the V8’s 73+ were disk/drum and therefore BBP.





Yup, that’s not how those come apart.

The 10” measurement doesn’t actually tell us much, the 10” A-body front drums were small bolt pattern (SBP). There are two different shoe widths, your ‘74 should have the wider front shoes that went with the redesigned drums with the large ball joint spindle.

He just said he had 10" drums. The picture shows a front drum. I'm almost 100% certain they came that way.

 

[72bluNblu]

He just said he had 10" drums. The picture shows a front drum. I'm almost 100% certain they came that way.

No sir. All drum/drum A-bodies were SBP, 9” drums, 10” drums, all of them until front drums went away with the federal mandate. There were no BBP drum/drum A-bodies.

Here's the TSB on the 73+ drums. They're redesigned B body units, have the larger wheel bearings and large upper ball joint. But if you see point #1, they were redesigned from the B units to be 5x4". You can see the full version at hamtramck historical if you can't read the smaller version below

https://www.hamtramck-historical.com/images/TSBs/1973/05-03-73C page1.jpg

 

[RustyRatRod]

No sir. All drum/drum A-bodies were SBP, 9” drums, 10” drums, all of them until front drums went away with the federal mandate. There were no BBP drum/drum A-bodies.

Here's the TSB on the 73+ drums. They're redesigned B body units, have the larger wheel bearings and large upper ball joint. But if you see point #1, they were redesigned from the B units to be 5x4". You can see the full version at hamtramck historical if you can't read the smaller version below

https://www.hamtramck-historical.com/images/TSBs/1973/05-03-73C page1.jpg

View attachment 1716145714

Well, it appears he has one.

 

[RustyRatRod]

Rock Auto and "everybody else" clearly shows a 10 x 2.5" front shoe for his car.

 

[72bluNblu]

Well, it appears he has one.

Rock Auto and "everybody else" clearly shows a 10 x 2.5" front shoe for his car.

Yes, and 73+ A-body drums were 10x2.5 AND SMALL BOLT PATTERN.

It's right in the TSB. Small bolt pattern, 10x2.5" drums for the '73 model year. Nothing in that picture suggests that those are BBP.

 

[RustyRatRod]

Yes, and 73+ A-body drums were 10x2.5 AND SMALL BOLT PATTERN.

It's right in the TSB. Small bolt pattern, 10x2.5" drums for the '73 model year. Nothing in that picture suggests that those are BBP.

Ok. I'm not arguing with, just letting you know what I thought I remembered. That's all. I'm sure you're right. I was going on how far away from the hub center the studs look. Looks are deceiving I guess.

 

[19Dart74]

So that I am clear. I have drums all around and from the consensus is SBP or BBP or how can I verify?

 

[19Dart74]

Thank you for all the help! I believe that I have what I need. Thanks all!

 

[72bluNblu]

Ok. I'm not arguing with, just letting you know what I thought I remembered. That's all. I'm sure you're right. I was going on how far away from the hub center the studs look. Looks are deceiving I guess.

I'm not sure what you're remembering, but, all drum/drum A-bodies were SBP. In '73 the 10" front drums went from 10x2.25" to 10x2.5", but remained SBP. And the 9" front drums went away. That corresponds with the switch to large ball joints. But the drum/drum A's were all SBP from the factory.

And you have to be careful with the online listings, because the rear LBP drums are also 10x2.5" and those online listings screw up front/rear drum listings all the time.

Thank you for all the help! I believe that I have what I need. Thanks all!

Just measure the bolt pattern. You should have the 5x4" pattern, with a 10x2.5" front drum.

If you have a 5x4.5" pattern, someone has swapped your spindles out for B-body units and you'll have to use B-body parts.

FYI, the drum hubs are NOT reproduced. You will have to find used 10" drum hubs.

 

[RustyRatRod]

I'm not sure what you're remembering, but, all drum/drum A-bodies were SBP. In '73 the 10" front drums went from 10x2.25" to 10x2.5", but remained SBP. And the 9" front drums went away. That corresponds with the switch to large ball joints. But the drum/drum A's were all SBP from the factory.

And you have to be careful with the online listings, because the rear LBP drums are also 10x2.5" and those online listings screw up front/rear drum listings all the time.



Just measure the bolt pattern. You should have the 5x4" pattern, with a 10x2.5" front drum.
View attachment 1716145717

If you have a 5x4.5" pattern, someone has swapped your spindles out for B-body units and you'll have to use B-body parts.

FYI, the drum hubs are NOT reproduced. You will have to find used 10" drum hubs.

Thanks for the measuring diagram. I was gonna try to explain it, but I would have screwed it up.

 

[19Dart74]

Definitely 5×4 after measuring. Thank you. Any advise when using the classified section to source parts? Red flags, dos and donts?

 

[72bluNblu]

Definitely 5×4 after measuring. Thank you. Any advise when using the classified section to source parts? Red flags, dos and donts?

All the rules are posted at the top of the classified forum, or click here FABO Classified Section Rules


Other than that just the basic stuff. Members with a longer history or that are "gold members" are usually a safer bet. Don't haggle prices on the open forum, send a direct message for that. Don't post phone numbers or email addresses on the open forum, again, send a direct message for that.

I personally will not pay anyone using "friends and family" settings on any payment service unless I actually know them or have done business with them before. I will pay the fees on PayPal to process the transfer as a "sale transaction" unless the seller included the fees in their pricing. Some do, some don't. Get a tracking number, make sure the insurance on that method of shipping will cover the value of the item or buy extra insurance.

 

[RustyRatRod]

Definitely 5×4 after measuring. Thank you. Any advise when using the classified section to source parts? Red flags, dos and donts?

Just make sure to read and abide by the rules and you'll be fine. Good luck. I have some 9" hubs and brake assemblies, but that won't help.

 

[72bluNblu]

Just make sure to read and abide by the rules and you'll be fine. Good luck. I have some 9" hubs and brake assemblies, but that won't help.

Oh, and that's a good point for @19Dart74 - I know I've already said it, but there are 2 versions of the 10" front drums. So be sure you're not getting '67-72 10" front drums and hubs, they will not fit your spindles. Those are 10x2.25".

The '73-76 10" front drums/hubs use a different front spindle than the earlier version, and have larger wheel bearings. So, your 10" drum/hub assembly has to be '73-76, and they will be 10x2.5" drums. Not to be confused with the BBP 10x2.5" rear drums.

On the bright side, you have large ball joint upper control arms, so, if you give up trying to find drums and hubs in serviceable condition your disk brake swap will be easier.

 

[townsend]

This is just a curiosity type question. In 19dart74's previous post, it shows he has a 318 engine. In post#10 72bluNblu states that all the V8's 73+ were disk/drum and therefore BBP.
So does this mean his car originally came with a slant 6.