New Upper A Arm Troubles

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Wvbuzzmaster

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Purchased brand new tubular upper A arms for my Duster from a reputable company and one is welded incorrectly to where the bushings do not align with each other by a noticeable amount. A half inch rod thru bushing one hits bushing two 3/4” off the center of the hole. Called the company and they will not stand behind their product, nothing but excuses as to why I don’t know what I am talking about, even after sending pictures. If I want replacements I would have to wait til next production run sometime next year. I was unsure whether to post this or not, but because my only resolution is returning these for a refund, my fear is that this unsafe A arm will just be resold, and that they are making more A arms just like this one. I am not posting the name of the company, out of respect, and since this is ongoing. Also not sharing pictures as the A arm design would be recognizable.
 
Wvbuzzmaster said:
was unsure whether to post this or not, but because my only resolution is returning these for a refund, my fear is that this unsafe A arm will just be resold, and that they are making more A arms just like this one. I am not posting the name of the company, out of respect, and since this is ongoing. Also not sharing pictures as the A arm design would be recognizable.
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So why say anything then?
 
Public shaming is acceptable as only **** bag companies won’t stand behind a product or service that’s defective, your most likely not the only one that’s had this problem…
 
Scody21 said:
Public shaming is acceptable as only **** bag companies won’t stand behind a product or service that’s defective, your most likely not the only one that’s had this problem…
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I agree with this and it can be done in a constructive manner. Naming the company also lets fellow site supporters know just what they would be dealing with if they purchase from this company.

Too many are just rebrand and sell, like Allstar Performance. I bought a Mopar specific throttle cable mount and it didn't fit, too small. I emailed them to basically just let them know they might have a issue with some bad inventory (that's the MFG Eng in me) and all I got it return was basically "sucks for you, move along". So in your case, they many not be able to stand behind a product they don't even make or know exactly where it comes from.

So name names and let those who know these cars, how parts should be and how to fabricate them, see what you got as a finished product that you should feel safe to drive your friends and family down the road with.
 
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The A arm in question.
1702419664052.jpeg
 
I have circa 2012ish Firm Feel tubular UCA's that fit excellent.

I have three sets of QA1 tubular LCA's in service with no issues.

I have on car with a $130 set of ebay UCA's (not the QA1 clone) and after a few modifications (grooving poly bushings for full perimeter grease propagation, drill/tap for zerks) they also had no issues during the installation, alignment process or in service.

That said my last two dealings with Firm Feel left me with the impression that they had outgrown the original management structure. I wouldn't mind spending a few weeks there to understand the dynamics of the business.

Who did you speak with? Dick, Matt and Frank have all been pretty cool over the years.

After a few minor order/part issues that should have, IMO, be handled by FF I reluctantly switched to buying new steering boxes and QA1 suspension components.

I like to support the PNW vendors but not when they are beyond reproach. As we say, npthing personal just business.
 
I have the full FF kit front and rear in my car. Had an issue with the sway bar as the wrong one was provided, called them and they made it right. I lived about 20 minutes from them, but their shop is on their property and the city, more like the Karen neighbors complain about the traffic going to their place, which is not much. After seeing their shop, they have some other company manufacture most of their items elsewhere. Matt is kind of a putts, living off his dads hard work. Knowing what I know now, I’d go with another supplier, as much as I like buying from the local / small shops….
 
Wvbuzzmaster said:
Purchased brand new tubular upper A arms for my Duster from a reputable company and one is welded incorrectly to where the bushings do not align with each other by a noticeable amount. A half inch rod thru bushing one hits bushing two 3/4” off the center of the hole. Called the company and they will not stand behind their product, nothing but excuses as to why I don’t know what I am talking about, even after sending pictures. If I want replacements I would have to wait til next production run sometime next year. I was unsure whether to post this or not, but because my only resolution is returning these for a refund, my fear is that this unsafe A arm will just be resold, and that they are making more A arms just like this one. I am not posting the name of the company, out of respect, and since this is ongoing. Also not sharing pictures as the A arm design would be recognizable.
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Yeah, well God forbid you out that company and maybe help someone else not go through the same thing. That would just make too much phakkin sense.
 
Wvbuzzmaster said:
Purchased brand new tubular upper A arms for my Duster from a reputable company and one is welded incorrectly to where the bushings do not align with each other by a noticeable amount. A half inch rod thru bushing one hits bushing two 3/4” off the center of the hole. Called the company and they will not stand behind their product, nothing but excuses as to why I don’t know what I am talking about, even after sending pictures. If I want replacements I would have to wait til next production run sometime next year. I was unsure whether to post this or not, but because my only resolution is returning these for a refund, my fear is that this unsafe A arm will just be resold, and that they are making more A arms just like this one. I am not posting the name of the company, out of respect, and since this is ongoing. Also not sharing pictures as the A arm design would be recognizable.
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So, they offered to replace/refund the parts if you return them and that’s not good enough for you? That’s standard business practice. In today’s world most people that request a replacement or refund without returning the part are scammers, plain and simple. They keep the part and the money, win win.

If you’re truly concerned about more parts being made incorrectly, and wanting to correct future versions, you also need to return the part. Because until they have the part in hand and can check/test it, they don’t really know what’s wrong with it. A couple of pictures isn’t enough to accurately assess a jig for manufacturing.

And have you considered that telling someone you won’t return a part you think is defective because they’ll resell it to someone else is insulting? Like, really insulting?

There’s always 2 sides to every story. I’ve been doing business with Firm Feel for well over a decade, and they’ve always gone out of their way to stand behind their products, answer questions, and provide great service.
 
Scody21 said:
Public shaming is acceptable as only **** bag companies won’t stand behind a product or service that’s defective, your most likely not the only one that’s had this problem…
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It's not public shaming just to tell people which company it is. It's called telling the truth.
 
72bluNblu said:
So, they offered to replace/refund the parts if you return them and that’s not good enough for you? That’s standard business practice. In today’s world most people that request a replacement or refund without returning the part are scammers, plain and simple. They keep the part and the money, win win.

If you’re truly concerned about more parts being made incorrectly, and wanting to correct future versions, you also need to return the part. Because until they have the part in hand and can check/test it, they don’t really know what’s wrong with it. A couple of pictures isn’t enough to accurately assess a jig for manufacturing.

And have you considered that telling someone you won’t return a part you think is defective because they’ll resell it to someone else is insulting? Like, really insulting?

There’s always 2 sides to every story. I’ve been doing business with Firm Feel for well over a decade, and they’ve always gone out of their way to stand behind their products, answer questions, and provide great service.
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I guess he wants it like all these chinese companies do nowadays. "No you keep old part. We send new one"
 
RustyRatRod said:
I guess he wants it like all these chinese companies do nowadays. "No you keep old part. We send new one"
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Yeah exactly. Large manufacturers do that because their cost for an individual part is so low that shipping the part back is more expensive for them than just sending a new part (should tell you something right there, those parts are cheap as hell).

Firm Feel is not producing numbers like that, and even if those parts aren’t being made in house they’re still being made in relatively low numbers.

Any time someone won’t return a part and wants a refund it’s a huge red flag.

And yeah, if someone told me they won’t return a part I built because they think I’d intentionally sell a defective part to somebody else? Well they’d get detailed instructions on how to insert that part into the upper reaches of their colon. Because they just insulted my integrity, and they want free ****.
 
I never said I wasn’t willing to return the part, the issue is they don’t care about making it right for the customer. If I want a replacement I am to wait for them to have another production run in a few months, forget the fact they made it wrong. And any time I tried to explain to them it was a bad part I was told “you don’t know what you are talking about, you just care about how it looks.” The other arm in the package was fine, no issue, bar passes thru perfectly, the tubes welded on square.
 
if the part has been made to add more castor

should they align?

?????????????????????????????????!

i.e did you do a valid test?

you believe you did, and at a basic level it seems to make sense

But vendor says NOT via their dismissive attitude
they seem pretty adamant that your test just illustrated what they say about you.

if they had explained why... you wouldn't be in this position, but you could of course be customer 567th to point this out so maybe its wearing a bit thin


the best test would be, can you get the bolts in and set the car up with castor and camber you want. if so Arm is good

given the fact that the factory couldn't get the mounts on the car in the what we now think is the "right place" anyway, will it make any difference?
or were these arms made to cater for the fact that most cars with upper arm mounts that have some peculiarity in positioning, when compared side to side, are "off" in much the same way, which kinda makes you think it was a deliberate move by Chrysler, to make it easier to achieve appropriate settings, given the limits to adjust-ability of the originals, for a car on crossply tyres for a 2 lane highway with camber

or not as the case may be.

our views on this matter are based on non cambered, freeway or race track, running radial tyres and usually with toe camber caster settings that look nothing like the book figures

Its an argument no one can win, for another day.

the manufacturer could have been really clever, applied some not widely known knowledge to the arms design on one side, to cater for something that those of us with only experience of a few cars of the type are not likely to ever spot.

but you can only call "foul" when you can't achieve sensible set-up


Dave
 
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There are 2 bolts that hold that arm on. Not a straight rod. As said did you actually install it? Does the other arm do the same?
 
I'm having Deja Vue. Seems a few years back there Was a bad batch of those but I can’t remember. lol
 
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