On the topic of Fender Tags- what if you don't have it?

-
JDMopar said:
@LO23M8B I have a 70 Challenger A66 car (340) that is all numbers matching, and most of the date codes on the bolt on do dads are correct. I have a fender tag but not a build sheet, and have owned it since 79. When I fix that one, I will do exactly like you said above, and get a reproduction fender tag made to match the real one. Since I don't have a build sheet, I don't want to risk having some sticky fingered bastage with a phillips screwdriver stealing my original tag. The older I get, the more I'd rather build a hot rodded up old Mopar that I couldn't care less about all the numbers crap or if it looks original. Just get in it and.....

:steering:
Click to expand...
I have the warranty card on my wife's car and I keep it locked in the glove box and bought some misc. ones to put in the sleeve when we are at a show so if someone swipes it I'll just put in another one.
 
There’s a guy on the dc.com that makes fender tags with a 3-D printer. He’s not trying to make them look original or trying to change the options on the car. He’s doing it for car shows and in case somebody wants to grab it.
 
498D3135-6695-4C82-8756-1726B19BB454.jpeg
42F46D35-A402-473E-A4A5-3469B553C7EF.jpeg
0BB9DDDB-B013-49F1-92BB-F77D63159B58.jpeg
 
JDMopar said:
I'm 64 years old and haven't seen everything, but I've seen most of it. What I have NEVER seen is a fender tag pop riveted to the inner left front fender with rosette rivets. If you can still find a car that hasn't been messed with at this point, the fender tag is put on with phillips head screws. One of those screws will have paint on it, and that corner of the fender tag will be bent diagonal across the same corner as that painted screw. The other screw will be bare or rusty because it was put on after the car was painted. The fender tags were usually screwed down with the left screw, then pried up to where they stood up to allow the bottom of the tag and the space under it to be painted. After paint, and probably down the line, the fender tag was mashed back down and the second screw was installed in the other hole in the tag....with no paint on it. They could not have achieved that same result in the time allotted to do it using rivets.
Click to expand...
I appreciate your knowledge, and thanks for sharing it with us. My 1970 Swinger 340 is very original, and I found the fully legible build sheet under the back seat. If I send you a picture of my fender tag, with the fasteners I have ,could you and other knowledgeable members give me your opinions on it's originality, please? The local Mopar gurus told me it's original to the car.
 
JDMopar said:
I'm 64 years old and haven't seen everything, but I've seen most of it. What I have NEVER seen is a fender tag pop riveted to the inner left front fender with rosette rivets. If you can still find a car that hasn't been messed with at this point, the fender tag is put on with phillips head screws. One of those screws will have paint on it, and that corner of the fender tag will be bent diagonal across the same corner as that painted screw. The other screw will be bare or rusty because it was put on after the car was painted. The fender tags were usually screwed down with the left screw, then pried up to where they stood up to allow the bottom of the tag and the space under it to be painted. After paint, and probably down the line, the fender tag was mashed back down and the second screw was installed in the other hole in the tag....with no paint on it. They could not have achieved that same result in the time allotted to do it using rivets.
Click to expand...
I'm also an old man at 63, but here's what I have. I bought the car in 2005, found the build sheet, and almost all parts are original, with the numbers matching the build sheet and correct date codes. For your evaluation, here is the fender tag. I put tape over the last couple of numbers of the sequence number just because. Any comments are welcome. I hope I didn't jack the OP's thread. Paul.
20220108_000625.jpg
20220108_000625.jpg
 
It seems I've kicked a hornet's nest. Maybe I used the wrong term with "rosette" fasteners. I don't mind being corrected for my Mopar language infraction. I know my fender tag has never been removed from my car. Please correct my language so I can correct my terms in the future. I can take higher quality photos if it would help in future conversations. I'm not thin skinned, but when a Moderator gives me a red "X", I'd sure like to know why I earned it. All members, please feel free to comment.
 
After reading other related posts, it seems my term of "Rosette" fasteners is what ticked off TMM. My apology for the incorrect terminology. I'll not use it in the future.
 
Car Nut said:
Those are Philip head screws.
Click to expand...
So I can safely remove them when I paint the engine bay? If so, that will help when I paint the engine bay. A local old Mopar guy told me that the screws were some "1970" anti theft fasteners. I'll unscrew them to continue with my engine bay repaint. I didn't mean to offend anyone with my comments. I got some bad intel, and won't pass it on. Thanks and apologies to any Mods or members I've insulted. Paul.
 
70dart340 said:
So I can safely remove them when I paint the engine bay? If so, that will help when I paint the engine bay. A local old Mopar guy told me that the screws were some "1970" anti theft fasteners. I'll unscrew them to continue with my engine bay repaint. I didn't mean to offend anyone with my comments. I got some bad intel, and won't pass it on. Thanks and apologies to any Mods or members I've insulted. Paul.
Click to expand...

Watch out for those "local old Mopar guys". Many of them have very little real knowledge. Hence the responses I get to my son's fender tag...
 
70dart340 said:
I'm also an old man at 63, but here's what I have. I bought the car in 2005, found the build sheet, and almost all parts are original, with the numbers matching the build sheet and correct date codes. For your evaluation, here is the fender tag. I put tape over the last couple of numbers of the sequence number just because. Any comments are welcome. I hope I didn't jack the OP's thread. Paul. View attachment 1715849487 View attachment 1715849487
Click to expand...

That certainly looks like an original tag to me. The appearance of the tag varied from plant to plant. The fonts were different, as were the methods they used for painting under the hoods. If the last 6 digits in the sequence match the last 6 of your VIN, that is more than likely the tag that originally came on the car. You were only mistaken on your fastener terminology when you said the fender tag was held on with rosette rivets. Wasn't offended or mad about it though...so we're all good.

:thumbsup::thumbsup:
 
70dart340 said:
So I can safely remove them when I paint the engine bay? If so, that will help when I paint the engine bay. A local old Mopar guy told me that the screws were some "1970" anti theft fasteners. I'll unscrew them to continue with my engine bay repaint. I didn't mean to offend anyone with my comments. I got some bad intel, and won't pass it on. Thanks and apologies to any Mods or members I've insulted. Paul.
Click to expand...
I would have to see the head of the screw with the paint removed to see if it was a Phillips or a Pozidriv but no reason to sweat the small stuff. Leave them painted as original. There's a good chance that a Pozidriv screw is what the old Mopar guy was talking about when he said "anti theft". They are standard Phillips from the factory.
 
TMM and I PM'd, and he straightened my old butt out. I apologize to all for the bad intel. Apparently, the special fasteners are on the dash tag VIN.
 
The build sheet and fender tag match. So does the dash tag, block, and "hidden" numbers. Thanks to all.
 
toolmanmike said:
I would have to see the head of the screw with the paint removed to see if it was a Phillips or a Pozidriv but no reason to sweat the small stuff. Leave them painted as original. There's a good chance that a Pozidriv screw is what the old Mopar guy was talking about when he said "anti theft". They are standard Phillips from the factory.
Click to expand...

That's interesting about the Pozidriv screw. I have only ever seen them in Electrical Applications (and if you don't have the right tool it will make a mess.) Did they even have that type of head for fasteners back then? Interesting.....

As for any apologizing, let it go. Your just learning a few things, that's all. And as for people who think they are some Mopar gods, well they can get humbled real quick. I ain't one of them and tend to watch and learn rather than attest and lash out lol....

The one thing I do know is for me personally my car is real and so is the history. It means squat to me but for someone like my dad he's all about it. And that's an older generation for you lol....

JW
 
SLOPAR72 said:
That's interesting about the Pozidriv screw. I have only ever seen them in Electrical Applications (and if you don't have the right tool it will make a mess.) Did they even have that type of head for fasteners back then? Interesting.....

As for any apologizing, let it go. Your just learning a few things, that's all. And as for people who think they are some Mopar gods, well they can get humbled real quick. I ain't one of them and tend to watch and learn rather than attest and lash out lol....

The one thing I do know is for me personally my car is real and so is the history. It means squat to me but for someone like my dad he's all about it. And that's an older generation for you lol....

JW
Click to expand...
Car Nut said:
The Pozidriv screw was patented in 1963.
Click to expand...
Pozidriv and Torx+ are probably the two most understood fasteners. Both are easy to mess up if you don't use the proper driver. Good observation on the Pozi's on electrical.
 
British aircraft also used a specialized "Bristol Spline" in their aircraft electronics. I had to by a set in the late 80's to repair and calibrate their electronics.
 
As long as we're throwing out oddball fasteners that don't work real well with similar traditional tools...

I've always had some moderate difficulty with what I thought were "Phillips" screws in vintage audio equipment.

JIS

Japan Industrial Standard
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
-

Back
Top